Part II of the Saga.....

After many delays and no progress other than pulling my V6 and tranny. I have decided that the job is best done by a professional. Since I don't have enough money for one of those....I'm doing it all myself!

Step 1, Is the retrieval of my stuff from the "Speed Shop".
The guy had good intentions just no follow through. I was paitent when it took 3 weeks to get the motor pulled. I was very calm when he told me the sterio was stolen while it was parked in his shop. I was concerned when he kept stalling on installing the gears.

Today he called and said he couldn't install the gears because he couldn't afford to buy the parts. ( You usually pay after the job is done ) Could I pay in advance?

It also looks like he has to be out of this shop soon...Hmmm... ( Going out of business? )

I decided to pull my stuff out of there tomorrow. I'm going to make some calls and see if I can rent space at a friends shop ( Place where we welded up Sinjin's Bumpers ) If that falls through I'll try to borrow some small tires and get the truck in my garage to work on it there. We shall see!

Also, looks like I'm buying a trailer tomorrow. I have to many places I need to pull it just to get it running now, so the wife said " Just buy one " ( Selling a 5X8 if anyone needs it )

Wish me luck, and yes there will be pictures now!

Man that's nuts, it took the guy 3 weeks to pull the motor ? it's a peice of cake to pull a motor. I pulled my motor last saturday and it took my friend and I under an hour. The same day we mounted the new motor and did a bunch of other stuff.

I wish you all the best of luck.

Suffice it to say, we can see the motive of the stolen stereo. Heck, I am suprised you didn't accuse him of stealing it. When you get your stuff, that would be a good time to do that :-)

Your insurance cover the loss?

Gofast--As you know...I've been following your thread closely, and I'm sorry that this is going downhill for you. Look at it this way though...at some point things will turn around for you!
Pete

Just a curiosity...why exactly did you start the new post? Also, since the topic was discussed I wanted to ask if anyone out there has tried using a Dana 44 IFS? I know Currie makes a shortened one, but that is probably more expensive then fabbing everything for the straight 44. Also, OKnut's Explorer is cool, but I don't know that I want to go that extreme nor do I want my tires to stick out as much. Which Bronco 44 is the right size and does anyone know or have an idea about how the RTI of the IFS versus the straight would compare. I just got Advance Adapters V8 manual. Babysteps here...don't want to leap yet.

Tate, is the V8 Swap manual worth $10? I was thinking about getting one but I wasn't sure it had anything more than what was already on the site.

Gofast, sorry to hear about your truck but you'll probably be better off (especially in the wallet) if you do it yourself and you will appreciate it more and know how to fix it if/when it breaks.

I started the new thread because the old one was getting tough to load. I wanted to get back to the project as well.

And to clarify some more on the speed shop. I'm partially guilty for letting it get this far. I tried everywhere that I could find for a shop to do this work. He was recomended by someone I knew and they said he did good work on Mustangs.

I think basically this project was over his head. It turns out I was doing all the footwork on what was supposed to be a turnkey deal. That was my first clue and they started adding up from there.

I really don't think he was scamming on this deal. I think he had good intentions, but not the experiance to back it up. I also think one of his " Friends " robbed him at the shop. He'll learn as he gets older, that insurance on a shop is not an option.

Back to the project.

I decided to order the Kaufman or Advance Adapters Motor Mounts. I don't have the time to Fab my own mounts now. The Motor shipped today, so I expect to start on the truck Monday.

I still have to get the Radiator mounted, relocate the battery ( Any suggestions )and some minor clean-up before the install.

The gears will be put on hold till after the truck is running. I have a really nice Detroit and "SVO" cover sitting on my desk now!

CougarX, Advance adapters has some basic info on there website. I did a lot of researching and reading on other sites as well.


[Edited by Gofast on 12-07-2000 at 07:17 PM]

Hey go fast. I met a guy down here in annapolis when i was wheeling one day, i helped him change a flat. and ends up he works at an engine shop. =) I discussed swaping a 302 or 351 in my explorer when the v 6 goes. I think I might go with the 302 and he told me he would do it all for less thank 4 k, including new tranny, drive shafts and motor,mounts . what else would i need? But if i do so, i worrie about breaking axels, driveshafts and other things from the power.

That's a great price. Wiring harness & Radiator need some attention. good price on what he's offering. I'm over 3K on motor & tranny & adapters. Does he include the Fuel Injection and Wiring harness? ASk if it's a turn key deal, drive in & drive out.


And yes breakage of drivetrain parts is a concern now. My next conversion will be a solid front axle set-up. Slow and steady on the trails hopefully will keep my breakage down to a minimumn.

Rob I read and heard from Rod I believe that you were opening up an Explorer shop. Is this a dream or are you in the works with it?

It sounds like a good idea but I don't know all the plans you have. I would think that just modifying Explorers wouldn't have a big enough demand. Perhaps if you designed and manufactored products and sold them on top of modifying Explorers would probably work.

Would love to know the details.

Keith,

I think that was just a dream that we both had. :)

Yep, still in the works, may take many months to happen though. I'm thinking once I get my truck running I can put a sign on it and maybe get some tax benefits. Also, thinking I will do mostly weekend stuff out of my garage for those that don't want to wrench on there own.

The idea started out of frustration trying to find a shop that would do anything with a non-jeep. Not to mention custom fabbing stuff.

We'll see where it goes.

Originally posted by Gofast
And yes breakage of drivetrain parts is a concern now. My next conversion will be a solid front axle set-up. Slow and steady on the trails hopefully will keep my breakage down to a minimumn.

Maybe you SHOULDN'T replace that radio. Know what I mean? ;)

And hey, if you need an associate wrench at your new Explorer shop, well, I know someone that might be interested.... :smoke:

An Explorer Shop... HMMMM. I really like that Idea. Plus I am experinced in Swaps too. Since My next swap will be a T-5 transmission. I think the Texas guys on the Board might be willing to help start a new bussiness here.

The little parts just keep coming in.

Late news.

I ordered the radiator today from http://www.radiator.com Great site. They only offer OEM stuff, but if you want something bigger then just cross referance something from another car that fits the bill. I paid $128 for a Mustang GT 3 core radiator brand new and it will be here tomorrow! I'll let everyone know if this doesn't cover my cooling needs. I really needed to save money right now, so I'll watch the temp gauges for now.

The Kaufman Motor Mounts arrived today too. I'll post pic's later of the pieces I'm stock piling.

Still waiting on the motor to arrive. I'm sure the ice storm doesn't help since it's coming from Indy. It's been 2 months now since I ordered the motor.

I am interested in swaping to a 302 V8 when my V6 dies. Hopefully that won't be soon. I have just found this forum in the last few weeks and I am finding all of the info overwelming. But on to my question. Has anyone put a conventional carboreted 302 in their explorer. What do you do with the computer system? Can you find a conversion wiring harness? How will other systems such as ABS, A/C, heater, power steering, power brakes, etc be effected? Any help will be appreciated.
Thanks,
Matt

Matt, You can go carburated if you want. Keep in mind that if you have to pass emmissions that could be a problem. F.I. will give you better MPG though and if you go offroad it's easier to deal with severe angles without starving the motor. If you do go with a carb then you simply disconnect all the sensor wires and tie them back out of the way. All the other systems will still work, at least I think they will. I don't think the ABS system is tied into the engine harness.

However, F.I. is simple to do. There are several links mentioned in this thread and it's predeccesor. Check out Harwood Engineering site ( link was listed somewhere on here ) He has a book you need to buy. $30 and it covers most of what your asking.

And mostly, be prepared to spend some money! This is still a very custom deal. This is not a turn key kit. You will have to fab some stuff amd plan like crazy. There are so many options of motors and adapters and combinations of things you can do that it makes it hard to cover all the bases.

Good Luck.

Gofast....I just searched that "Harwood Engineering" and came up empty handed....I'm looking for the motor and parts now, and I'm interested in a book if it helps explain lots about this swap. I'm keepin up on yers, but am reading anything possible. Any update on yours?
Thanks
Pete

Here's the link. Dogman deserves the credit for finding this site. Good work Mike!

http://www.harwoodperformance.bizland.com

I think the book is worth the money.

Thanks Rob, I thought you'd like it.

Matt Harwood seems like a real nice guy, very knowledgable. I've emailed him a number of times with questions about the swap, and his answers were very helpful, being detailed and specific. Seems like he enjoys sharing his knowledge and experience.

I think I told you this before, but I think the wiring section alone is worth the $30.

I followed Matt's advice and ordered the EVTM and wiring manuals for my 91 and for a 93 Mustang from Helm Inc. (www.helm.com).

I'm also getting Charles O. Probst's book, How to Understand, Service & Modify Ford Fuel Injection & Electronic Engine Control. (FRPP # M-1832-Z1)

Can't have too much information.

OK, I discovered last night that the AMSOIL remote filter will not work on this conversion. There is not enough room between the Gear Box and the oil filter location on the block. By the time you have there adapter in place you only 1/2" to maybe 3/4" to try and put a 90 degree fitting in place. It was way to tight.

I went by L&L products and picked-up there 90 degree remote oil adapter base PN040180 for $110.00. I will still use the Dual Amsoil filters but due to space will now install the L& L base.

I will also use steel braided hose and the pretty anodized connectors between the base and remote filters.

Other news!

Looked at there shorty headers in person. High quality stuff. However I still want longtube headers and will try to visit with the owner and see if this can be developed for an Explorer application. ( Dogman )

I will receive my waterpump bolts, harmonic balancer and valve covers tomorrow. Yea!

So Rob,
Are you seeing the light at the end of the tunnel yet??
Just be careful it might be the train!!!
Just glad to hear things are finally starting to fall into place after the ruff start.

While you had the motor out you should have painted it. It just wouldn't be right to have just a plain white Explorer with all those mods. Lets see there is a Purple and Orange ones out there so maybe what pink, lime green, something besides white......lol

Rob,

Good idea, trying to get L&L to make some long tubes. When I talked to them last week, I don't remember if I inquired about this possibility. It's worth a shot. With my heads and motor combo, I need a 1 5/8" primary tubed header for optimum performance. I already talked to the guys at Duff to see if they could get their 302 conversion long tube header manufacturer to make a 1 5/8" version of their 1 1/2" long tubes, but they said they just plain didn't want to. Persistence pays off, I'm sure we'll come up with something.

What is wrong with block huggers? I know they arent ideal, but from all the sites I've read...they work.....All I want is 250-280 at the rear wheel....who knows...I'll have to see what the shops tell me
Thanks
Pete

Pete, There are many things to consider on the headers. I thought the shorties would work but they don't clear the frame. The problem with "Block Huggers" is that there is not very much room between the block and the frame on a 4X4 Explorer. Maybe, later I can measure the actual clearance between my frame and the block.

280 at the rear wheels is do-able. You would need about 340 at the crank to get 280 at the wheels. Go with a stroked 347 and focus on torque if your going to climb rocks. Not many Explorers need HP above 4.5K RPM if there offroading.

Good Luck

OK, The total cost for L & L remote oil kit was $250 or so, AMSOIL runs about $50 bucks cheaper I think. but the base that bolts to the block does not work. I bought the billet aluminumn base for $110 from L & L and will use the remote duals from AMSOIL.

Hoses come with the kit but I needed something different. I was going to use the stell braided 1/2" hoses but the cost is really high, close to $200 just to run to the remote filters with no frills. I have opted to run custom built high pressure hoses with 45 degree fittings from the base and 90 degree fittings on the remote oil filter base. I plan to use the taps in the remote base that amsoil provides for analsyis and running that to my temp & pressure gauge that will be mounted in the A pillar pod I just ordered. Pod and gauges came to $150 or so. Oil temp,pressure, and tranny temp.

Plan,Plan,Plan and then cut the hose.

Rob,

Who are you getting the A-pillar guage mount from? Is it made by Autometer? I plan on the same course of action. In addition, I plan on going with an Autometer 5" Monster Tach mounted just inside the A-pillar, on top of the dash. Don't know if I'll retrofit the existing tach to mate with the 5.0 V8.

Do you know who makes the L&L billet oil filter adapter? Does L&L, or do they buy it in? I'm planning on going with braided stainless hose, as well as Aeroquip fittings, on the oil lines a few others. Man, it is $$$$$$$, isn't it? Looks cool though!

Any luck hooking up with a competent mechanic in your neck of the woods? Good luck, we both need it!

I ordered the A pillar pod from JEGs online. It's a dual and I may put two duals on the a pillar, not sure yet.
I'll mount the 2 1/6 Autometer Oil Pressure & Oil Temp gauge in the pod. Thinking about putting Trans Temp & Water Temp in a second pod.

I plan on mounting the dual oil filters on the drivers side fender where the water reservoir used to be. I'll figure out something else for the windshield wiper fluid tank. Think I'll use your suggestion and mount an overflow tank on the radiator like the mustangs do. Hose length comes to 50" from block to Dual filters. The Amsoil dual filter base has a fitting that will work great for mounting the pressure sending unit. I plan on putting a T-fitting on the outgoing side of the dual filter base so I can get the temp after any cooling affects of the filter. If I'm to hot there then the stuff in the block will be to hot as well. Don't really think that will be an issue though. Maybe I'll put it on the input side?

Steel braid stuff is expensive, maybe I'll do it anyway so it will match the chrome dipstick tube.

I want to say thanks to Scott Basso for information on the A pillar pod which he has installed on his truck. The organized runs are great places to see what other people have installed on there vehicles.

At this point I'm pretty happy with the little achievements on my truck. I'm real excited about getting the oil filters installed. I also got the T-Case skid plate installed tonight. Doesn't sound hard to do, but when the previous shop lost all the bolts for your truck it makes these things a little harder to install.\


No luck finding someone to do the work. I got some real good leads from Alec though. I'll do some more of the "Little" stuff and probable take it to a shop for the intial start-up. I'm paying myself $35.00 an hour to work on the truck which is a lot cheaper than $70 and up most places want.

Plans for this week...

Install Water Pump on Sunday.
Install Intake on Sunday.
Start looking at installing the pulleys etc.

Got the custom hoses this morning for the remote dual oil filter.

Steel Braid cost ( Est. )
Hose $9.00 ft
90 Connector $20 ( Need 2 )
45 Connector $20 ( Need 2 )
Wrenches $110 for the set ( Think I could 1for $30 )
Total for my truck $182.00 for parts

Hose that looks factory
2 48" hoses with pressed on connectors ( Like you have for Power steering hose ) with 2 90 connectors & 2 45 connectors.
Total $87.00

Maybe later I'll go back and add Steel braided, but for now I need the money to get the truck running.

Rob, maybe I missed something about this, but why not run one of the oil filter relocation kits that the swap companies offer?
Thanks
Pete

Pete, You can. I sorta did.

L&L's kit is $250 total
Amsoil kit is close to $200 or so
I saw one for less than $100.

The prices vary depending on the qulity of what is in the kit. L&L is Billett Aluminumn of very high quality. You pay for this. Also you don't want a leak down hear because it could run you dry very quickly.

Amsoil is very high quality on the Dual Base filter mount, but the base that mounts to the block is to tall to fit in this application.

I spent about $400 counting custom hoses and fitting for pressure and temp gauges. If you go Stainless you'll spend another $100.

If you use the hoses provided in the kits you save aboput $90 over my custom made stuff.


I went with Amsoil because I wanted to filter everything on my motor. HAve heard many good things about AMsoil. My problem came when the base was too big to fit between the gearbox and the block. MAybe AMsoil sells there kit in pieces so you can get the Remote filter without the base?

Remeber "The Devil is in the details"

So, alot of that was run up in costs b/c of the extra gauges you are running? I mean, all I am looking for is something that will get the job done right, and is strong. Doesn't need to be flashy or billet alumuminum.. although, that would be cool:) Do you think the remote oil filter location kits are good from duff and kauffman?
Thanks
Pete

The Duff and Kaufmann oil filter relocation kits are actually the Ford Racing model.

Pete, I wasn't very clear back there. The remote oil filter kits from Duff,Kaufman etc will work fine.They include all the parts necessary and should work just fine if you follow the instructions. They include hose connecters etc.

I went a little off the deep end. I wanted the AMSOIL dual filters because I think duals look cool and because I heard and read very good things about them. So I bought that kit. Turns out I don't have enough room for the base so I had to spend another $110 for a base. Why L&L? Because they are 15 mins from my office. I am impressed with the quality of the base. It is better than the Amsoil base in my opinion. However the Amsoil base would work just fine if I had the space and I would not have spent the money for the L & L if I had room for the other.

I spent another $90 on the custom made to length hoses. These are very flexible and come with pressed ( Crimped ) connectors like your power steering hose. I chose these because I didn't want to mess with the connectors that came with my kit. They are the type that tighten up on the hose when your cinch down the nuts. I just wasn't comfortable with those connectors.

So basically I spent an extra $200 by not going with a Kit from one of the Adapters companies. Don't forget to add my header decision in there too. That was another $170 I wasted. I refuse to add the $500 I paid to have that shop steel my stereo when they pulled the motor and tranny and lose all the bolts for my truck and misplace the second computer I had. If I added these things up I would realize that I'm out over $1000 on this project and it still isn't done.

Back to the subject. The gauges are an additional $150 on top of the the Oil set-up and hoses. I consider that very cheap insurance.

Plan carefully, spend the money on the books so you understand what all those wires are for and then plan some more.


BTW...Dogman, Put the remote oil filter base on before you put the block in the truck. What a pain if you do it the other way. I got in a hurry and had some drop the motor in and now I wish I had waited till I had all the oil filter stuff in hand. Oh well, I always said, You can be first or you can be second and save some money.....

Thanks Rob....I plan on gettin all the manauls possible including the Harwood one......Thanks!
Pete

Rob,

Thanks for the tip to put on the remote oil adapter before setting the motor -- I owe you one!

What style Autometer guages you going with?

Ever talk to L&L about long tubes?

Mike, I got the standard 2 1/6 chrome rimmed electronic gauges. Once they arrive I'll post pictures of the set-up. The gauges,intake and valve covers will be installed Sunday or Monday night.

I'm looking at installing the upper intake 180 degrees out so that the Intake tube is on the drivers side and maybe avoid all the A/C stuff and the heater box.

No, never did get back with L&L about the longtubes. I know they make some that are only sold through another dealer for the early model Bronco's. I really think they would fab some for Explorers if we let them know how much interest there was. Go ahead and call them if you want. It's kind of back burner stuff for me right now.

Hehe, I just got a local friend of mine who build race stangs who's gonna help me....He hasn't done an explorer...but he's done alot of stangs....so that is another hand to help....
Pete

Got any pics yet. The engine in my Exploere just went to hell. I am going to change it over to a 302. Just intrested in some pics.

Eric

OK,, I've been quit for a while, So here's the latest.

Ordered the cooling fans today from one of our site sponsers. Ford Parts Network.

Torrie was very helpful. I ordered the Mark VIII cooling fans for about $160.00 and the V8 tach that goes behind my factory gauge face for $72.00.

Also, picked up lot's of top end parts after being cleaned. The intake, Vavle covers etc are now ready to be installed.

If I can find the battery charger for my Digital camara I'll post pictures later this week.

Still hoping for MOAB!......

Rob,

Did that $160 price for the Mark 8 fan include the thermostat control?

Originally posted by Gofast
Still hoping for MOAB!......

What do you mean "hoping for MOAB, you ment to say "LOOKING FORWARD TO SEEING EVERYONE AT MOAB!!!

I have faith in you Rob, you will have it going. You still have two months. If we can get a rolled Explorer ready you can put in a little motor.

Mike, I'll let you know when I see the fans. It is supposed to be a complete replacement unit with shroud fan and wireing harness. I hope the T-Stat conrtol is part of it. If not then I'll order it next. Trying to get the radiator mounted this week and then I can check clearance between the waterpump and pulleys and the Fans.

Perry, I'm really trying to get it done in time. The real limiting factor is money supply. I may not have the cash to get everything finished before MOAB. Kids in sports comes first then I get to spend time and money on my truck. Seems everytime I turn around I'm spending another $200. I think I turned around 3.5 times yesterday and it looks like I need new injectors, so it's another 2.5 turns for me today.

Genral note. I just ordered all the bolts I needed for lower intake, valve covers, dist, and waterpump! ARP supplies all this so if you need something new for your 302 give them a call.

OK, Installing the radiator. I bought a factory 3 row HD radiator from Radiator.Com. Great prices and fast delivery. I read somewhere that it would mount up in my truck. Wish I knew where I had read that. It doesn't fit without "Major" mods. The A/C condensor lines will have to be re-routed and custom made. The ABS motor will have to be relocated, custom mounting bracket made and knew brake lines custom made. ( Notice the word " Custom" a lot? )

This is another case where I would probable have been better off getting the RAdiator kit from one of the conversion vendors ( Kaufman, Total Perf, Advance adapters, etc ) I may do that still. Also, looks like it will be a very tight fit between the waterpump pulley and the radiator. May not be room for the electric fans unless I relocate the condesor 2" forward and move the radiator up as well.

Good news...

Vavle Covers are installed. So is the lower intake. Waiting on the new injectors before I mount the upper intake.

Getting closer. Will actually start thinking about the wiring now..

OOOOH! Custom! I think at times, I hate that word;) SOOOO much more work...Oknut told me he used all James Duff swap products, and had no problems, and that everything fit together nicely...That is probly what I'm going to do except one mod of my own. Summit Racing has a oil/tranny fluid cooler combo for 100 bucks. it has the oil relocator unit as well. They have used it on motors w/ 450+ hp, so it's durable. Rob, how thick, is the oil relocator part that screws onto? Summit told me the oil relocation screw on adapter is approx, 1.5-2.0in thick. Is this gonna clear? How does this compare to your amsoil adapter....
Thanks
Pete

Mine is about 2" I think. I have about 1/2" clearance after installing the adapter. You should be fine. The key point is that the hose's exit at 90 degrees. If they are straight out with no right angle stuff then they will not work.

I tried to save money over the "Kits". Don't do it!

Good Luck.

Yeah, I do believe they they exit at a 90 degree angle. If not, I can always get a 90 degree exit one, and then use the rest of this kit, b/c I need an oil and tranny cooler. Also, seeing the success of Oknut, I plan on using the duff kit, even though some kits maybe cheaper than it. So I will continue my research.
Thanks
Pete

Pete, That's what I did. The AMSOIL remote has a great set-up for running coolers and of course gauges. I'll try to get some pictures tonight of how mine is set-up.

That's why I bought the L & L adapter for the block. High Quality and 90 angle. I then used the rest of the AMSOIL kit.

I'll have temp & pressure gauges on mine. If temps get to hot form me then I'll add a cooler. With the remote base it's very easy to add a cooler.

Thanks

Rob I've forgot, and it would take a bit of searching when I can just ask you. What tranny and T-case are you going to run?
Thanks
Pete

Pete, I'm running a modified AOD tranny. I had Advance Adapters send the 9" tailhousing and output shaft straight to Phoenix Transmissions. http://www.phoenixtrans.com/

I got a built tranny using the adapters that bolts upto my factory T-Case.

The AOD has a good OD 32% and a low 2.48 : 1 first gear. It also totaly locks the Converter in 1st and 2nd gear so there is very little heat build up.

I plan to put either an Atlas II in there when it blows ot maybe a second T-case behind the first one to get the low low climbing gears.

How about some updates?
Your fans from all over need to know what is up.
How about some pictures?


I too am looking into doing the swap. I have many questions and since you are becoming the "expert" on what to do and what not to do. I was wondering if I could e-mail you directly with my questions and you could answer them when you have the time.
I heard you were going to do a complete story on this project. Is that still in the works?

Hammer, Thanks for the post. Yes you can e-mail me with questions. Also feel free to post them if you want. Other people are probable thinking the same thing.

Latest scoop.

Just returned from a week of skiing. Very sore, but still need to work on truck. Mostly need cash to get it finished now.

Radiator clearance is my nig concern right now. If the weather holds up, I'll work on that tomorrow.
My Garage is very small and I have to have the door open to work on the truck. So hopefully it will not rain.


My lesson this week in how not to spend money. If you have 19# injectors don't upgrade to 24# injectors unless you buy a MAF to match. Anybody need a set of 24# injectors, brand new in the box?

I'll post pictures this week end as well. I need to get the camara unpacked from the trip first.

Also, plan on doing a write-up when I'm done. I'll pull some of the highlights from this post and the previous one too.

The best thing you can do is plan ahead. I dived in, found out the water was very cold. I'll plan better when I do the front end swap ( Riffman style )

Thanks Rob

Can you e-mail me everything you have learned, parts lists, etc. for the engine conversion? Bislamjoe@priest.com is my e-mail, drop me a line. I'm planning to convert my '93 to a V8... just not sure which one. I'm pretty mujch settled between a 5.0L (modern 302) and a Triton 5.4L (that'll be pretty sweet if I can pull it off). While I'm here, does anybody know how tough it would be to fit a 5.4 in my baby? Also, what swap parts from the 302 swap can be used? I'm probably going to be the first person to try this... This is going to mean either a lot of custom fabbing or me and Wade in the backyard with a welder a tree and a chain. LoL

I would really like to see some pics. especially the radiator work and the air box for the heater&a/c clearance. the weather is getting nice and i would like to start this before it gets too hot so im getting anxious.:D speaking of wiring....im throwing around the idea of buying a whole new ecu system from Haltec that lets you program the chip from your laptop while the engine is running. has anyone heard of them or delt with Haltec? as usual they are hard to get information from. like prices. check them out www.haltech.com

Sorry for being late on this subject and I have not read all of the above posts, so if this has been memtioned before pls forget I posted.

The fan problem is a big problem in my book. I have run an electric on my Ranger conversion and although the vehicle has not over heated it is still running too hot for me.

The Montianeer has a V8 and it has a mechanical fan.
How do they do it ? The parts on the front of the engine, i.e. timing chain cover, brkts, etc., have been moved back approx. 1.5". That may be enough to help you out.

Of course there is the price of the parts but if it works then the mechanical fan will make up for it.

Good Luck,
Keep it on all Four !

I got a good look at Rob's Explorer GT Money Pit last weekend while we converted my brother's auto hubs to manuals at the Gofast Garage.

How he fits his radiator in will be interesting. He may have to cut and extend the radiator mounts and frame forward; I don't know. His fan looks like it will be in the very same place the radiator will be. But that's not the real challenge.

I have absolutely no idea how he will get his intake installed. It's reversible but it still won't help. Installed normally, the intake will run right into the A/C. Installed the other way it looks like he'd have to remove his steering and stuff. I believe Rob is considering removing his A/C to get the intake on and running and then figuring out a custom A/C in the future. If he does that he won't be wheelin' in Texas this August.

The turns that this project has taken are positively mindboggling.

Gofast,
Not to be a smart ass or anything, but why are you having so much trouble when they have put 5.0's in the Rangers and Bronco II a lot??????????????????

When we were first looking for a Explorer I was going to get one with high mileage and put in the 5.0, now I'm glad I went the way I did.

Sorry to hear you won't be at Moab. Looking forward to when we can see that beast in person...................

Hi there,

I don't understand why he wouldn't be able to fit the radiator.. I'm running a regular flex fan off the engine and it's even got a spacer on it. I'm running a 4 core radiator that fit perfectly. My truck wasn't cooling very good at a idle because my idle is set at 650 rpm. So what I did was install a 14 inch electric fan on the outside of the radiator, with a temp sencor and that fan kicks on when the other one can't handle it. There is actually a lot of room behind the grill, all that you need to do is cut a little bracket off.

If he doesn't have room for serpentine belts, then convert to performance v-belt pulleys.. And maybe not even run a fan on the inside, just the outside.

Where does he live ? does he even need a the a/c ? I just got rid of mine, but then again I live in Washington state.

If you have any questions about what I did, then feel free to e-mail me.

Take care,
Oknut

Sandy,

What brand and size electric fan are you using on your Ranger? What is it's air moving capability (cfm)?

Gerald,

The "normal" position for the upper intake is to hang over the driver's side valve cover.

Oknut, yeah, it looks like he'll have to cut out that vertical bracket in front of the radiator space and then he'll have plenty of room going out to the grill. As far as the A/C goes, we are in the Dallas area and A/C is a lot more important during a 105 degree Texas summer day than it is up in Washington, so it is a somewhat of a sacrifice to have to remove it.

First off they s___ !
Next there is not enough room in the Ranger and I believe in the Explorer/Navajo either, for a mechanical fan.

I used two 12" electric fans. They work well enough to keep the thing from overheating but not as cool as I would like.

I did not cut the brace in the front of the raditor, I bent it up a little to accommodate the fan brackets but that was it.

My Ranger runs at approx. 205/210 on the hy-way but around 200 around town. Seems the slower I go the cooler it runs, go figure.

I have been told that my heat problem is due to the fact that I removed the front apron. Seems that the air is trying to get in the engine compartment from two different direction, from the front and the bottom.
I have not reinstalled the apron but it is in the future, no need to rush in to it.

I'm running a 93 5.0 HO. The radiator is a custom brass 4 core that sits inside the rad support. I'm using the stock fan and shroud from my 94 4.0. There's about 2.5" of fan/rad clearance. I'm going to bust out with the armorall and clean up the engine for some new pics soon.

Interesting that the 4.0 stuff works, I have never looked at it; something to think about.

Sandy B

I'm with you there.. I do think that you would be able to relocate it tho. There is plenty of room over the fenders.

But I still don't understand why he will have to move his radiator, they put 5.0 in explorers. and I had no problems fitting mine.. he could actually place the engine back a little bit on the cross member. Just hit the fire wall in a bit with a hammer.

-Oknut

I know the after-market raditors that you buy for this swap are designed to fit in the opening up front. I believe this gives a little more room for the fan, but you can not use a mechanical fan.
The Mountaineer comes with a V8 and I think the Timing Chain Cover, and all the other bracket up front are designed to give room for a mechanical fan. I have looked at the Mountaineer engine bay and the front of its 5.0L looks different.

I will need to look again.

Keep it on all Four.

Well i'm running v-belts and a regular fan plus an electric fan. I don't see why he can't also.

I think the 5.0L belt setup sticks out more.

Sandy,

I have a 5 liter in my explorer, all I did was convert it to a v-belt setup. Gave me more room and I was able to run performance pulleys. He should be able to do the same thing.

-Oknut

Oknut,
When you converted to V-Belts did you have to change the water pump ? Different rotation I think...

How many V-Belts are you running ?
Did you retain all of the accessories ?

Tnx,

Sandy,

My engine is an older style 5.0 but the block and the all the bolt holes should be the same. The engine was setup for serpentine belts. I had a guy custom make me a bracket for the power steering, it's off a 1982 bronco II, and i'm running a chevy alternator and a 16 inch flex fan. I bought my performance pulleys from James Duff. It all works awsome and gave me more power.

The Water pump that i'm running is for a 1979 5.0 L. You might have to go with a different water pump. but everything else should work.

Hope this helps,

-Oknut

Oknut,

Tnx for the info, I will have to look into that.

You welcome,

Oknut,
Was just looking at your vehicle specs.
Nice rig.

16 inches of lift, how does it ride ?

Mine will be approx 5 inches, D44, 9"er, locked in both.
he engine will be a warmed over 5.0L, nv4500, Atlas II-4.3.

Still putting it together, a little slow though.

Keep it on all four

I will not mention progress. I will show some pictures though.

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1388432&a=10803322&p=47210321

From the top. Tight in the back and the sides. Notice throttle body wanting to occupy the same space as theA/C heater box. Time to get a 90 degree elbow from SVT. The upper intake is still 2" forward of where it will bolt up.

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1388432&a=10803322&p=47210274

Check out the clearance on the remote oil filter. The Steering box is removed for install. I have 1/2" between the oil adapter and the gearbox.

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1388432&a=10803322&p=47210280


http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1388432&a=10803322&p=47210300

Someday, I'll have pics of it running......

hey gofast....looks nice i like the blue. did you have to trim any of the a/c box? and also cant you just flip the upper manifold so the tb is on the other side? or is there an egr passage in the manifold? man i hope i can start mine soon... your pictures have given me greater confidance in being able to do this swap...well good luck on the rest of it!! lookin good

Sandy-

My truck rides pretty good on the road, considering what I have done, But I lincoln locked my rear end a few weeks ago and it makes it a little harder to go around corners and the rear brakes tend to lock up, but I have only driving my rig around town about 5 times. It's mainly for offroad and I really don't care how it drives on the road. After I first completed it, I took it for a test run and I actually went as fast as 75 mph. I did take it up in the hills two weekends ago for a local event.. And man does it do good offroad. It even did awsome on the trails. I did a few hill climbs that some locked up jeeps couldn't do, but up here we got some pretty deep ruts, so if you don't have the big tires you aren't going anywhere.

Fordcrazy-

Did you mean heaterbox? Because I don't think you can trim your a/c box.

Take care,

-Oknut

GoFast,
It all takes time, I have been working on mine for about 18 months, still have a lot to do. Do it right and do it once.

I bought the Trick FLow 45 degree unit, still tight.

The L&L stuff looks good. (Oil Adapter)


Lots of luck, keep us, on the forum, informed of your progress.

Robert, You can flip the intake and have it all exit on the drivers side. Still have clearance issues on passenger side due to the runners and also have clearance issues on the drivers side with Steering and brakes. It's do-able though, but then my 5.0 logo on the intake would be upside down. :(

Sandy, Did the trick flow elbo bolt up to the intake directly or to the EGR plate? I would prefer to have the elbow between the Intake and the EGR plate if possible.

I've been at this since September...I orginally thought it would be a 90 day project. Due to all kinds of problems it has turned out to be a slow process. Getting there though.

BTW, The intake and Vavle covers are Powder coated and I really like the way they turned out. I just couldn't resist the "Pretty Stuff" under the hood. The oil adapter is L&L, really like there stuff. The Motor Mounts are Kaufman.

I have no idea why I'm having such a tough time with space on my truck. I'm sure the shortie accesorie kit would have helped get me room in the front of the motor. But it is really tight all the way around this motor.

Thanks Rob

A tight fit can be good but is not alway the best thing, : :D but in Explorer/Bronco II/Ranger cases it is the only way.
The Air Conditioner/Heater Box tight fit is a big problem. Maybe replace the box with one w/o air, but do you want air ? The box is the only problem I had, everything else fits like my Ranger conversion did and there is enough clearance.

The TrickFlow elbow is designed to replace the EGR Valve, or at least the one I have has all of the connections on it. I have blocked all of them off and I blocked off the ports at the head for the exhaust recirculation. This will keep the gas a little cooler and maybe help with a little HP. In the cooler months it may take a little longer to heat up but I think there is no problem with heat in these setups, there is always too much.

I have to haul everything apart again to modify the cross member under the engine. I want to replace it with a removable unit that fits up tighter to the engine. The D44 is cramped under there with all that cross member above it. I think it will give me more room for the D44 to move around, maybe up to 6". :rolleyes: :eek:

Keep it on all four,


Oh ya, one more thing, Are your Valve covers on backward or is there no Oil Filler ?

Good catch, They are on backwords. I was going to flip the upper intake but didn't gain anything clearance wise when I did it. The valve covers will be swapped back this weekend. This will show off the SVO breather cap on the oil tube better anyway.

oknut...i did mean to say a/c box. the heater box is inside the vehicle. the a/c box is right by the engine...go figure ford puts something that is supposed to be cold next to something that is really hot. technically its all one box with some 'trap doors' that adjust the temp... any way gofast it dosnt look like you trimmed it....do you have a body lift?

Yep,, Got 3" body lift sitting on top of 5.5" + Superlift with 35" tires.

The Body lift helped a lot with clearance for the conversion.



BTW....I used to live on Skyline Dr in Stillwater. Also used to go to Joe's before they were a resturant.......

cool man....im in ambassador one apartments off perkins rd. and i dont go to joes cause it makes me sick. they had like 70 health code violations last year. food poisioning is plentiful around these parts. your stomache really has to get used to eating here. any way i thought of a question for you .... what has been the main limiting fator in getting this project done for you. based on what i have heard an read the swap takes 50-70 hrs. is this a good estimation or does it take much longer. i know you have been working for a while now but many make it seem like it only takes a week or so to get it done. the reason im asking is cause my explorer is my transportation and i want to limit my down time or be able to plan around it. im sure it helps to have all the parts before you start doing the swap. thanks for your help.

Uh, Rob.....It's been awhile...a long while since the last post.....where does yer project stand?
Pete

i know where is the update :D

GoFast an easy solution for the intake clearance would be a '94-'95 Mustang upper intake. It bolts to '86 to 95 5.0LHO lowers and has a nice elbow already. Only difference is EGR runs from the right hedder to manifold rather than thru the intake. As for the accessories find all the brackets off a 5.0L Explorer from a wrecker, or even '94 - '95 Mustang stuff. They both run the belt about 1.5 inches closer to the block for extra room to the rad. I plan on putting in a 5.0L into my Explorer as well and have done some preliminary work already. Hope this may help.

Was hoping to post an update and tell you how good it sounds.

Anyway, The intake now fits! I bought a 94/95 adapter that has a 45 degree bend. Need to figure out how to run the EGR stuff and linkage for the Throttle Body. Also need the hose or tube that goes to the MAS or MAF sensor. ( I get them confused with the LS1 equivilent )

I may take SpeedFreek up on the advice to change brackets. I need clearance bad up front.

Next Item, Mount the gearbox ( Gerald? Help? ) Install Injectors and start working on Brackets and accesoriies plus the waterpump.

Thanks Rob

Originally posted by Gofast
Next Item, Mount the gearbox ( Gerald? Help? )...

I've got Hunter with me until June 22nd but I'll bet we could schedule a wrenchathon while the kids hit the pool. Just give me a call!

Have you thought about eliminating the EGR ?

Is the 45 degree angle piece an SVO item ? If so then all of the mount locations shhould be there, but... there is always a but, why not leave the orginal EGR inplace and add the 45. You will have to block any open holes but I hear say that it will increase the low end torque by increasing the upper plenum volumne.

Just a thought.

I looked at one of the TrickFlow 45s and all of the attaching points were there. I didn't want any of the attaching points so I didn't buy it. If yours doesn't have the attaching points please let me know, I may want to buy one.

Keep us updated on your progress.

Sandy, Mine has all the EGR stuff on it. I'm not using the orginal one because that save me an 1" on the A/C box side. I need the room. I'll hook the EGR up with a custom tube to the plenum or the exahust manifold ( forget which it routes too )and I said custom because I just added a 1/2" riser to the intake so I would have linkage clearance on the throttle body and the valve cover.

Getting Closer, just need to figure out which water pump bolts are studs for accesories and which ones are just bolts. It's kind of like a 3D puzzel right now.

Thanks Rob

Good show...
The 1/2" riser should increase the low end torque also. (per TrickFlow)

I thought the 45 would have all of the s__t on it. I disconnected the EGR on my Ranger/5.0L setup and have had not problems except the high idle and NightRanger helped me out on that one.
Seems it is the 10pin harness connections that cause the problem.

Keep it touch with the forum.

I take it cleaning that 10 pin did the trick?

Sunday, will be a workday on Frankenstien.

Gerald is coming over to help me get the gearbox and Flaming rivershaft put back in the truck. ALso, plan on putting the injectors in and working on the pulleys and accersories if time permits.

There is lots of little things todo and it all adds up. Should have some pictures to post late sunday showing where things stand.

Hoping to make CCR2001!

Thanks Rob

NIGHTRANGER5.0,
Seems to have helped, tnx.

I didn't do a good job, I didn't have the right tools so I tried to take the connector apart with standard tools, not the best thing to do.
I am going to pick up a connector set, hopefully tomorrow and install new connectors w/dielectric grease.

Tnx,

Where do you plan to get a connector set? My ford dealer was oblivious to anything related to EFI harness hard shell connectors.

A while back i was attempting to try anf find a 4 pin hardshell. I wanted to make a new jumper harness for my passenger side o2.

The 4 pin o2 plug off the harness was damaged and instead of soldering a o2 connector in i wanted to start from scratch and build the harness with new pins and connectors.

In the end i found a 4 wire jumper out of a 90's 150. Now i need to cut out the 4 pin and solder directly into the Main harness.

The 93 HO couger 5.0 o2's are set-up different then a stang.

Now i'm comming up short on diagrams and can't get thru to the ford techline.

So where do you plan to get fresh connectors?

Rob-
Is there any update from this weekend? You thought you were gonna be doin alot of work on it sunday, and I'm seein if ya got any work done, or some photos of it.
Pete

Yep, Worked on it some this weekend.

Mounted all the Injectors and the Engine Harness. Also, mounted the waterpump pulley and lower crank shaft pulley. Doesn't sound like much, but it is.

Actually reading books on wiring diagrams now. Looks like I have most of the stuff ready for that. Need to buy some sensors that go on the intake before proceeding.

I'll post pictures when I'm home and can spend the time.


Thanks rob

Any updates on the project?

Sounded like it was coming along alright. I can't wait for a writup on the whole process. I have a 91' X that has over 150,000 on it now, I am considering the V8 swap when the tranny or engine finally go.

Anyone have any estimate on the total cost of parts for this project? I could eliminate some cost by skipping the A/C Unit and I wouldn't have to go with all the pretty stuff like you :) hehe.

Anyway don't know if this is a project I would care to undertake, but Ill probably throw a little research towards it just for the heck of it, any ideas on what a turnkey solution on this might cost me if I could find a shop that would even do it?

Thanks again
-Matt

NIGHTRANGER5.0

NIGHTRANGER5.0

Sorry it took so long, I just read the thread again...
The 10 pin connectors are available from Ford, they come connected together and you have to cut the wires in the middle.

I do not have the bag they came in and SINCE I sold my RANGER :( :( :( :( :( , I can not check the numbers.

I will see if I can get the number if you need them.

:us: :chug: :can:

What am I building now, you don't want to know, but it is Ford 5.0 powered. 115/1 final gear ratio, low gear/low range... it should crawl all by itself.

Well, my last post on this was 6-6-2001. Yes over a year ago.

Still not finished. But there is progress.

First we mounted a custom radiator under the front radiator support. This allowed room for standard accesories on the motor. Using a flex fan for cooling. Clearnces are/were very tight. We shaved the Fan spacer down 1/2" for clearance on the radiator. This gave us room for the radiator and fan blade clearance but unfortunatly the fan blades now hit the fan belts.

Back to the drawing board. Spend money ( $800 ) on new front accesorie kit or move the radiator another 1" forward? We went the fabrication route and have moved the radiator forward 1". I plan to take some pictures of it this weekend to post next week.

Wiring harness is installed and most everything else is complete. Had to do some fabricating for the Air Pump tubes to clear things as well. All in all there is not much left to do.

Of course everytime I get to this point something else happens. Yes, Layoffs are looming at work again so not much time or money is being focused on my truck. Hoping to join the Locals at the Slabs soon and maybe even Tellico? ( I know it want be ready, but I still dream about it )

Thanks Rob

It sounds as though you have been having real troubles.
I used a Schucks oil relocation kit I bought at their store. It comes with straight fittings, so I just had to buy 90 degree nipples.

I put a new 2 core Chevy s-10 radiator in mine. I took off the grill, measured and cut out the core support to be about the same size as my radiator. I then put a dual b-cool electric fan setup in it. I have not had a single problem with either one of the parts I put in. the oil relocation has not dropped a single drop of oil, and the engine runs cool with the radiator and fans. They came with the t-stat controls, so I never have to worry.

Oh yeah, mine is a 351w, so it was a little closer to everything than the 302 was. I put in a 302 to first only to find out it had a cracked cylinder.

So now, my radiator is in the front of the core support, with the grill reinstalled. You cannot tell that anything was ever touched.

I went with a carbed engine. So, all the computer crap all came out. The only functionality that I lost was the electric shift 4x4 and my anti lock. The electric shift was easy enough to fix, but I have not figured out the anti lock stuff yet, and do not really see me trying to hard anytime soon. My rig pretty much only plays in the mountains, so I do not need to go from 80 to 0 on asphalt very often.


I did all the work, with friends, and I would imagine I only spent 1200.00 or so. The most expensive parts were the radiator and the fans.

Well, It looks like this Friday I will be making a trip North to pick-up my truck. No it's not finished yet. I will finish the truck here. My friend that was working on it is going in for more foot surgery and he will not be able to finish the project.

That's fine with me, because I want my truck finished. So I'll do it myself. Pictures to be posted later this weekend.

Thanks Rob

So Rob do you think you will have it ready for the Slabs in October?

Ready for the slabs? Probable not...But I'll try.
I had zero chance of getting finished in Claremore. Even if he wasn't on crutches, hunting season's are coming up and He is an avid hunter. He would not miss chance to kill critters to work on my truck.

So, after I get it back and see eactly how much is left to finish I'll let you know if the Slabs are a reality.

I'm hoping to be there. I want to see some of the Demon 4X4 set-ups in person.

Thanks Rob

I am in a rush to get the Explorer ready for the Slabs as well. Once I get the Tranny back in the Truck. The Rest of the work is gearing it with the 5.13 gears and a few odds and ends.

What is the slabs?

Originally posted by Kris Guilbeaux
So Rob do you think you will have it ready for the Slabs in October?

We asked that very same question a year ago, didn't we? :p

Or was it two years ago, LOL :D

Originally posted by VonZipper
What is the slabs?

The Slabs is a favored wheeling spot in central Texas, about 90 miles west of Austin.

Here is the link to the trail run thread:
http://explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=55422

And here's a place I like to go to get info on Texas Trails:
Demon4x4.com/tx4x4.htm#SLAB

thanks Mudd Whore.

I am in Washington state, so I do not see my exploder being down there soon. Could be fun though it sounds.