A while ago we picked up a 1978 Ford e-250 3/4 ton van that has a pathfinder quadravan setup..

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3061/2437152167_c5a1b7358c.jpg?v=0
Van right after getting it home...

It has a 460 motor, Dana 44 front axle and Dana 60 rear....

It made some interesting sounds when driving and since this is going to be the tow rig for the X I wanted to make sure things were right.. Sooo...

We pulled the motor in hopes of finding what was making the noises...

We found the following..
many bolts were loose, including oil pan, exhuast, intake and a couple head bolts...
Lots of bearings looked really bad... (Crank bearings and rod bearings)..
Pistons show signs of burning oil..
3 of the pistons had the ring gaps lined up.
Engine has been rebuilt.. pistons are .030 over.
timing chaing/sprockets look great.. I'd say < 50k miles.. almost no wear..
Part of a starter snout was between the transmission bell housing and the torque converter..

We were glad we found at least "something" that could be cuasing the noise.. Just didn't want to find that much...

Soo....
currently, the motor is out and apart.. Heads are getting rebuilt.. block is getting checked/cleaned etc and the same with the crank.


We pulled (A friend actually did the work).. the motor on Thursday...
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3649/3597027964_75274d76e6.jpg?v=0
Motor pulled and sitting on the ground, waiting to be taken apart.


Today we took apart the motor and took the parts to the machine shop.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2471/3602071557_13bfce61ae.jpg?v=0
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2431/3602071851_52ed15acbd.jpg?v=0

We also took the pressure washer to the engine bay, and with some Purple Power degreaser we got most of the grease off.. and even some of the paint..
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3364/3602072093_98f3d7d317.jpg?v=0

Stay tuned for more updates....

did you remove the Valance when you took out the engine?

...What is the paint scheme plans for this motor???..:D

Which part is the valence?

Basically, the Radiator/core support was removed, along with the grill etc...

The Heads and Intake were pulled with the motor still in the van..

It came straight out w/out the heads/intake.. With those in it was going to have to come out in a strange angle...

As for the paint scheme.. I'm thinking I'll do another Lego type motor.. but I think I'll use different colors.. and the block will also get color this time.

~Mark

I've heard good things about Banks power on a 460, but this only lists engines from 87.
http://bankspower.com/products/show/139/46

You've always got some good projects brewing Mark!

It looks like their kits are only for the computer controlled/ fuel injectec vehicles. :( But I know their kits a great.. My Mom's Husband added a Banks turbo kit to his old late 80's diesel f-250 (non turbo) and he said it made it into a new truck.

I hate sitting still.. and I'm lucky I have a friend that has done things like motor builds to help out.. He's also the one teaching me welding and even helped work on the tractor (he actually gave me the tractor).

~Mark

Sweet van! As much as I hate vans, I wouldn't mind getting a 4wd Econoline

Finished the short block yesterday..

Picked up the radiator and other parts yesterday and today. . I can re-use the unknown radiator.. its big.. it appears to be a 5 core from a big truck..

Motor will be in in the Van on Saturday.. We will install the heads/intake etc once its in the van.. easier to put in w/out all the extra width/height and expecially the weight.

Cell phone pic...
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3387/3661800972_f5fec416f2.jpg

~Mark

Yay another Lego themed motor!

Yes to the colors! YES YES YES!!! http://smiliesftw.com/x/badger.gif

Looks great Mark

looks good mark keep up good work

Well.. We are done with day 1 of the install... We are going to take a few days off to pick up a few little parts that we are going to need...


Dry fit on the heads etc on the short block before we put it in the van... (morning pics)
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2477/3666054989_e735d956ac.jpg?v=0

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2422/3666056103_8601e3cef3.jpg?v=0

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2437/3666057333_6901e150e9.jpg?v=0

Here is where we were when we stopped for the day (3:30 or so).. It was raining heavy to the east, so we cleaned up just in case it came our way (we were getting the high winds).

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3599/3666887600_5c4301140c_b.jpg

note: more pics from the whole quadravan work is here.. http://www.flickr.com/photos/10384420@N03/sets/72157604698701780/

~Mark

That looks great. Do you have to set the engine in thru the door?

Nope.. We put it in w/out the heads or intake.. and made the chain really short. If we would have taken off the valence we could get it in with the heads.. but it wasn't bad.. the only real hard part is manuvering the motor mounts around the exhaust that is still in the engine compartment.. If we would have put the mounts on after it was installed it would have been quicker.. but it only took us 30 minutes to 'stab' the motor once we started.

~Mark

Lego themed motor, I like it.

Sweet van do you have candy in there? (Sorry, I didn't mean that.)

Any who, nice build. I didn't know the 3/4 tons ran coils, I thought the 3/4 ton ran leaves.

Not only 3/4 ton.. its 4x4 conversion by Pathfinder..

BUT.. I'm pretty sure the 2wd ones were coil spring too..

~Mark

That looks pretty nice! :thumbsup:

Sure you have the fuel pump in the right way ?

Sure you have the fuel pump in the right way ?

I was wondering that too when I saw it in the pic too.. I'm pretty sure its upside down. We are on hold for a few days as I work on the mustang and pick up a few parts. I'll add it to the list of things to do when we start working on it again (I'm "thinking" next week).

~Mark

Not only 3/4 ton.. its 4x4 conversion by Pathfinder..

BUT.. I'm pretty sure the 2wd ones were coil spring too..

~Mark

love the motor colors ,crazy looking but what do you mean it was a conversion by pathfinder?

love the motor colors ,crazy looking but what do you mean it was a conversion by pathfinder?

Vans have never come 4x4 from the factory. Pathfinder is a company that does/used to do 4x4 conversions on vans.

Quigley does them still now check it out

4x4 Vans (http://www.quigley4x4.com/)

Edit:FROADER beat me to the punch

Exactly.. Pathfinder Equipment Co. existed until around 1992. There is a another company with a similar name that is run by Gordon.. He sells replacement parts etc for the pathfinder vans..

http://www.pathfinder-vans.com/html/about_us.html

~Mark

Vans have never come 4x4 from the factory. Pathfinder is a company that does/used to do 4x4 conversions on vans.

what really, i always wanted a 4x4 van for hunting/camping or long beach fishing trips.haha yea i had no clue what he meant thought it had a Nissan pathfinder 4x4 under it!!:dunno::dunno:

Sure you have the fuel pump in the right way ?

I got a chance to work on the Van again.. The fuel pump is on the right way.. I've just never seen one with the gold part on top.. but its right...

~Mark

Installed the motor over the weekend, broke in the cam today...

Still have a bunch to go, but it runs...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=er796eQBQxI

~Mark

bad ass my friend bad ass
Posted via Mobile Device

Awesome. Brings new meaning to the term "van"

Well, I drove the van a couple days.. and found that the trans is having issues...

the 1-2 shift takes over 3 seconds when under load.. and the 2-3 shift flashes at least 1000 rpms before it shifts.

I pulled the trans out.. and its heading to the trans shop in the morning..

Amazingly, it fits in a honda civic trunk with lots of room to spare.

Pic of it in there with the seats folded down part way.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3465/3880359356_2db39e6785.jpg

~Mark

C6 right? That is a lot of weight in the civic. Stock rebuild or something better for the trans?

Not "planning" on anything special. The trans repair wasn't in the budget. I'll see what "little" upgrades they can do that I can afford. One I'm thinking of is a 13" low stall converter to help cut down heat buildup. That 460 should have enough torque to compensate for the lower stall speed.

btw.. yes, that c6 is heavy.. The car did squat when we dropped it in (its actually behind the rear wheels).

The only other upgrade I was "thinking" of was twin sticking the np205, but I don't think I need to spend the money there.. Manual hubs and transmission upgrades seem like more reasonable places to spend the money.

Besides.. I have only about 6 weeks to get this done, along with a couple other little projects before the Oct truckhaven run.

~Mark

sounds good mark keep up good work

Just a quick update..

After the motor was built and installed I was able to test the transmission..

1-2 shift was very very very slow and the 2-3 had a wicked flare.

I took it in to be rebuilt and turns out someone had tried to modify the VB before and didn't do it right. Soo, I have a new VB.

The trans still isn't perfect but they want me to drive it a few hundred miles before I bring it back for them to tweak the VB some more.

Also, I did my first fuel mileage check. I filled the rear tank, drove it for 2 days and then refilled it. Indicated 146 miles at 17.4 gallons. Thats 8.3ish mpg.

I did a stopwatch check at 60mph to see how far off my speedo is and it looks like it is reading 5% slow. I'll be using a GPS later today to see how far off it really is. If it really is 5% off I'm getting 8.8mpg..

Either way.. That tells me that the 22 gallon tank just ain't gonna cut it. I was thinking of a 33 gallon Bronco tank, but I'm leaning more towards a new '79 f-100 tank (38 gallon extra capacity tank).. Rockauto has the tank/sending unit shipped for < $250.

I still have some things to do.. like get power to the powered vent in the back.. and I have a switch or 2 I need to figure out what they do (they light up when I turn them on, but I don't see anything happening anywhere)..

I also need to get some real gauges in there. I'm going to start with water temp and trans temp.

Oh yea, my new Transmission cooler should be here soon.. its a 45,000 btu cooler (23x11x1.5).

and of course, I have to advertise the 460 :)

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2472/3926465434_654310b5c2.jpg

Its getting really close to being ready for the truckhaven run in 6 weeks..

oh yea.. I need to replace the front hubs.. Looks like the auto hubs are shot.. I want manuals anyway..

~Mark

Are you going to keep it white to reflect as much of the sun as possible? Or are you going to give in and paint it ... light green perhaps? :)

i love that! not only is it a 4x4, not only dose it have a fuel loving big block! but its a hotel on wheels! :thumbsup:

I don't think it will stay white.. It will at least get primer on it.. I have a few little rust spots to take care of (that is a new experience for me)..

The white paint that is on it now is really oxidized. If you wipe your hand on it, your hand turns white.. So that paint will need to be replaced/covered..

And Yes, I wouldn't mind having the entire van Burns Green.. But that may be a little expensive..

I just got back from using a GPS and my stopwatch method was dead on.. The speedo is 5% off.. and the odometer looks like 4% (maybe 5%, but its hard to tell on only a 10 mile quick drive).

That means I've been driving 65-70mph and got 8.8mpg.. I plan on driving 62-65 so that "should" help the mileage get up to 9 mph :) Either way, its a gas love motor :D.

During my little test drive I stomped on it doing 50mph (had to get up to speed for the freeway) and it actually gets up a moves. . and it sure feels like it out accelerates the little 160hp explorer :) I think I should take it to the track, just to see what it will do.. :burnout:

~Mark

oh yea.. I need to replace the front hubs.. Looks like the auto hubs are shot.. I want manuals anyway..



Well, Slap Me Thrice and Hand Me to Me Mama.

Turns out my automatic hubs were working because you have to manually rotate the outside of it. I thought they were auto hubs because they didn't have the little bar to turn in the center.. turns out you turn the entire outside part..

I tested them today.. 4x4 and hubs work just fine..

~Mark

...Now you need to take them off, take some pictures and share with the rest of us...:D

Well, here is a pic of the Hub on the van... This is the 1st time I've seen hubs like this.. I still haven't figured out who made these yet..

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3454/3932697013_c2da1181cc_b.jpg



And.. new parts came in for the Van today..

New 45,000 btu trans cooler and external trans filter.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2627/3946549930_d7256191ba_b.jpg

The new cooler is about twice as thick and much bigger than the old cooler.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3470/3945767169_3d9388eef6.jpg http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2421/3946548836_98b2a63c58.jpg




~Mark

...I found the info on your hubs and thought I would post it here for you...;)
http://www.pathfinder-vans.com/html/locking_hub_i_d____tech.html

Borg Warner Auto Hubs

Borg Warner Auto Locking Hub, found on all types of trucks and vans with Dana 44 or GM 10 bolt axle. If you have one of these and it’s not working. Try soaking the hub in a can of ATF (automatic tranny fluid) for a few days. The ATF will soften up and the hard grease and crud and cause it to fall off. Then set the hubs aside and let the drip out. Only apply grease to the splines on the clutch housing.
http://www.pathfinder-vans.com/assets/images/bw_fulltime_hub.JPG

Manual hubs: Pathfinder Equipment Co., Dual-a-matic, Selectro.

External and internal hub style found on many Pathfinder vans. There have been a number of manufacturers of this type of hub, with minor changes in design depending who was building it. Easy to take apart and reassemble. There is one universal rule to obey when disassembling this hub. There is a group of three screws that attaches the cap to the body of the hub. There is also a set a three screws with tamper proof heads that hold the cam in place. If you take these out, make sure you line up the holes in the cap with those in the cam. If you don’t, you will shatter the cam when you tighten the screws and your hub will be no better than a paper weight for your desk. Cams are hard to find, so be careful.
http://www.pathfinder-vans.com/assets/images/dualmatic_hub.JPG

There have been a number of manufacturers of this type of hub, with minor changes in design depending who was building it.


Thats as much as I found too.. But I can't tell "which" manufacturer it is..

Gordon, at pathfinder-vans.com does sell hubs, but they are the more traditional ones..

Of course, I cant tell which would be stronger, the orig. or a new set of Warn premiums.

~Mark

...I say...:shifty_ey .. you test them out on Show's hill...:D

...I say...:shifty_ey .. you test them out on Show's hill...:D


I second that idea :D

ummm... No.. But I do want to try twisting it up a little in the ditches..

Just not the really deep ones.. just around the edge.. If you thought Teds X turned like a boat, you should see the Van.. It turns like the titanic. Besides solid axle, they have limiter bolts to keep me from turning too far.. Not sure what those are called, but they are on the knuckle and hit the axle when I turn to full lock.

~Mark

they have limiter bolts to keep me from turning too far.. Not sure what those are called, but they are on the knuckle and hit the axle when I turn to full lock.


Steering stops;)

...Mine should be much better now...:biggthump

...I had previously welded bolts on my arms as stops for full lock...This kept the pistons from being compressed by the shock bolts, aka bad brake fade...:(

Steering stops;)

But why? I don't see a reason to have them in there. At least from my limited knowledge of steering geometry.

And Ted, you mean we can't laugh at you as your cursing when your trying to follow someone who can make those corners?

~Mark

...:shifty_ey Who was laughing at me...I want names...:p:

...Sorry, that is one thing that I've already made better...;)

...:shifty_ey Who was laughing at me...I want names...:p:

...Sorry, that is one thing that I've already made better...;)


:bsnicker: Not I :D

But why? I don't see a reason to have them in there. At least from my limited knowledge of steering geometry.


They are most useful (if set properly) in trail riding situations to save your u-joints/shafts from snapping while in hard turns.
The more angle you allow in your steering the higher the risk of breakage.
A good indicator that you are allowing too much angle is if you see a mark on your u-joint caused by the ear of the axleshaft rubbing on it. You would want to adjust your stops accordingly.
Probably not going to be a big deal with the van...hopefully:D

Did some work on the Van this weekend..

We got the 38 gallon tank installed. We used one from a '79 f-100/f-150. We had to make new straps, modify the front mount and fight the fill hose as the fill hose connection on the tank and on the van no longer lined up (about 7" difference).

new tank.. which is a lot bigger than the 22 gallon that was in there.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2648/3959898569_ef4f29d0b0.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2649/3959897691_58d406aa80.jpg

We also cut the exhaust off before the rear axle as the way the were run was going to be in the way.

Since I know I'm going to be changing the sending unit and I don't want to ever have to drop the tank (non oem fuel fill hoses are not very pliable) we put in an access panel.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2598/3960702330_88c88fb8dc.jpg

I also got the new 40k gvwr trans cooler installed along with an external filter. you care barely see the external filter behind and to the left of the radiator.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2537/3959944815_373e989017.jpg

I also got a few other little things done.. The radio now works with the key (before it wouldn't turn off). The radio can pick up stations now that I put in a new antenna. The speedometer now reads correctly (a friend had a 17 tooth gear lying around)..

Oh yea, I fixed the gas leak on the mid tank. The fill hose came off the tank which explains why it would dump gas out :) good thing I found that since the exhaust now lets out about 5" past the end of that tank.

The van is getting close.. Its almost ready for Truckhaven...

All in all it was a good wrenching weekend. I did manage to burn my left wrist when I managed to get my gmaw welder tip inside the glove. I also had a an incident with the grinder. I was grinding on one of the new (modified old) tank straps on the ground and the grinder wheel exploded. It hit my leg hard enough to move my foot.. Another piece bounced off the tire of the van and hit my friend on the ribs. I was wearing my safety shield but I may have to start wearing a cup.

I got lucky, it caught me on the muscle.. so unless I "touch" it.. it doesn't really bother me (its been 2 days now)..

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2673/3960691238_a4d047c189.jpg

~Mark

...:eek:...that can be nasty..

...Are you going to make a skid plate for the tank???

Yikes, looks like that hurt.

Update...

5 days later and my leg is now all kinds of color and less skintone like.. But it doesn't hurt unless I bump it, or jump down off van..

Anyway.. I took the van into town to get the exhaust put back on. I cut them off before the rear axle. I was going to get an H pipe put in, keep my existing mufflers and run duals out.. After looking at what was really on the van we decided to keep the two 2.5" pipes off the manifolds and run them into a magnaflow muffler with two 2.5" in, and a single 3" out. The single 3" out runs to the back corner of the van, back where it was from the factory.. I've only driven a few miles with it, but its much better, no more drone and its not obnoxious like it was, which was going to be bad on the longer trips... The other reason we went with this new system is the old mufflers weren't actually mufflers.. They were empty boxes made to look like old flowmaster mufflers to pass visual inspection in Az.. no wonder it was so loud.

I'll post some pics of it later.

I also filled the van for the 1st time since putting in the big tank. I put in all the fuel I took out of the old tank and drove to town..

It appears we had around 8 gallons of fuel left in both tanks combined.. I'm sure glad gas prices dropped the last couple weeks..


~Mark

I'm still getting the pics of the new exhaust, but I got sound clips.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0EHp88DkEA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWYL0N_Hvkk

~Mark

Oh yeah that'll pull it. :thumbsup:

Sweet!!!

here are the pics..

1st.. My leg is healing.. and its changing colors..

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2485/3971094288_2573b666fb.jpg

Pic of the twin 2.5" exhaust pipes go from the motor to the new magnaflow muffler.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2431/3971102824_c320fc554d_b.jpg

Single 3" exit pipe from the muffler...
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2556/3970333057_d665676b09_b.jpg

They ran the pipe up and over the axle to put it where the factory pipe used to exit.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3425/3971100662_6df41001d4_b.jpg

~Mark

Looking great there Maniak!

thats a pretty kick ass tow rig. the lego engine is awesome, i'm going to have to do one like that !

ummm... YES.. I do want to try twisting up my Van on Show's hill...:biggthump

Just not the really deep ones.. just around the edge.. If you thought Teds X turned like a boat, you should see the Van.. It turns like the titanic. Besides solid axle, they have limiter bolts to keep me from turning too far.. Not sure what those are called, but they are on the knuckle and hit the axle when I turn to full lock.

~Mark

...The stock Dana 35's also have this bolt...It is on the arm and the stop is on the back of the brake casting...This is on my 95 Ranger...
http://www.explorerforum.com/photopost/data/3772/Ranger_repair_008.jpg

We created a gauge pod, and added a coolant temp gauge and the trans. temp gauge.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2673/3988413937_5a7f8d3c86_b.jpg


closeup..
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3533/3989170064_4938174241_b.jpg

~Mark

What brand is the gauge?

Better hope you don't get any voltage spikes on those Cyberdynes.

Cyberdynes..


I was having some oddness with the readings for a day or so..

When i turned on the headlights it would jump the water temp 30 degrees. Today I added a ground strap from the battery to the body and ran a ground wire from the battery to the ground wire I use for the gauges and other Dash type stuff.

I still have to replace the alternator as it is weak. With the lights and the heater fan on high the voltage drops to < 12v.

~Mark

What kind of battery do you have? Are you going to install a high amp alternator?

Just a normal 12V group 34 (I think).. its 900CCA IIRC and I just got it.

The alternator in there is either a 65 or a 42 amp alternator.. I can't tell which, but its not working well.. It doesn't take much load to drop the voltage way down.

I picked up a chevy 1 wire 105 amp alternator to drop in.. I just need to drill the mounting hole a little bigger. the long bolt won't "quite fit".

~Mark

You might want to get a universal alternator bracket. Some auto parts stores sell performance brackets with a chrome finish. This will save you the trouble of having to fabricate or drill.

The bracket seems ok.. the pivot hole on the alternator that the long bolt goes through is too small for the Ford bolt to go through. I'll just drill that hold out a little. I'll also have to make a spacer since the Ford mount has a longer spacer, but thats no big deal, I had had create a spacer for the power steering pump already.

~Mark

Was a somewhat busy weekend..

I did get the alternator in, but I think it has a bad diode. It will kill the battery overnight.

I also found water sitting on top of the timing cover. I pulled the intake manifold off, broke/knocked out the pressed in tube for the water bypass (more like radiator bypass) and put a new one in.

I then changed the oil and filter since I know I got water in it when doing the intake.

I re-timed the motor (dist. had to come out to get the intake out), increased the idle some to around 550 in gear but I may need to bring it up some more (750 is the book #)

I found a bunch of loose exhaust bolts (not "loose", but not tight).

I also checked the flex plate to converter nuts and they were all tight.

The "odd" noise I was hearing, which almost sounded like a rod knock but wasn't coming from the engine is now almost completly gone. I think its a combination of valve noise, and exhaust.

The mid-tank is still having issues, so I either have a pickup issue, filter issue, or the tank selector valve isn't working well.

I drove the Van to work again today with the X on the trailer. It towed great. The rear suspension on the van isn't near as stiff with the trailer on it. I only felt it bounce when the road had a good bump, but it wasn't bad. Otherwise the trailer just sat back there, being dead weight.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3478/4003433974_a39cca9043_b.jpg

We will see how well it does on the way home. There is supposed to be 20mph winds this afternoon.

~Mark

thats good news Mark. I guess the wind tonight will tell all. The Explorer looks pretty cinched down on that thing. Make sure the trailer tires are at max PSI and if you notice any swaying with the wind you can also make sure the Explorer has max PSI instead of trail PSI in the tires, that makes a big difference.

Wow Maniak, you're ready to roll!

Yippeee woo hoo! Truckhaven!!

thats good news Mark. I guess the wind tonight will tell all. The Explorer looks pretty cinched down on that thing. Make sure the trailer tires are at max PSI and if you notice any swaying with the wind you can also make sure the Explorer has max PSI instead of trail PSI in the tires, that makes a big difference.

Well, I made it back. From work to the house is slightly uphill (2200 ft elevation to 3500 ft). Temp averaged about 195F. I was only able to maintain 60mph. I had a head/cross wind most of the way. Other than having to correct steering sometimes, and have to put my foot in it more, I didn't even notice the wind. It was easier to drive than the X is by itself on a windy day.

On the 2 lane I drive a little faster than I did this morning (55mph) and aimed for some of the dips/bumps in the road to see how everything would react. Other than getting the rear of the van to bounce a few times, nothing really happened.

I'm still not sure if I'm gonna stick with the current ball mount or switch to a 4" drop to level out the trailer.

I do know that tomorrow evening I pick up a set of tires for the van. It will either be a set of Falkens (8 ply) or a set of Hercules All trac (10 ply). I'm leaning towards the Hercules tires. Out the door price for raw tires is < $450. I can install them using the neighbors tire machine.

~Mark

I took a drive up to the Phoenix area last night and picked up some tires..

265x75r16 Hercules All Trac AT Load range E
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2558/4011814958_510f51d3d5.jpg

Brand new, out the door was $440, plus about $25 for Gas (used a friends pickup and combined some other errands last evening)..

Once we got back to Tucson, I still had to get them home.. using the Honda.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2444/4011812686_95ecb4c171.jpg

Best price I could find for the same size AT tires in Tucson was $570.

I got them through AZTireClub. Their website is cheesy, their email address is yahoo, but they have a decent sized warehouse and a few hundred tires in it.

Apparently they have a warehouse in Newport Beach Ca too where they can do installs too.

I'll just use the neighbors tire machine and put these on the Van on Friday..

~Mark