We finally got a puny snow storm here. It was one of those almost snow or rain. Either way it left many patchy ice spots on the highway. I was driving causiously following my buddy in his front wheel drive car at a safe distance and while coming around a corner I lost control. I was able to get it back on the highway by letting off the gas and steered gingerly with out any problems. Just a racing heart and a possible stinky in my pants :D

Just wondering any driving tips people have for icy conditions and use of Auto-4WD and 4WD.

At the time I had it in 2WD. Imediately after I fliped to auto which still scared me and I think doesn't engage after 35 mph to I fliped to 4WD, but didn't want to drive on the highway (curvy) with only patchy spots.

well, the main thing is 4-wheel drive doesn't help you stop much. Like you mentioned, saying a safe distance is also good. When you hit ice the dumbest thing you can do (unless your coming right up to a car, see about tip on staying a safe distance away) is hitting your brakes, ABS or not. Best bet is to just slide through until you hit some pavement again. In addition to not hitting brakes, its also a good idea not ot hit the accelerator, especialyl in a rear-wheel drive vehicle, it could just cause you to loose your ass-end. Don't pay attention to the speed of other drivers, if you feel safe doing 20 and everyone else is doing 30, do 20. But if your going 50 and everyone else is doing 20, maybe they know something you don't? :)

I don't think hitting the brakes applies to when you are sliding sideways. Just a straight line?

If you're sliding sideways, do not brake. Steer in the direction of the spin, and then steer back straight when the spin is controlled, then use the brakes and stop and have a rest because at this point you will be breathing heavily :D

When you are sliding on ice snow rain slicked or whatever you will have SOME controle with your steering wheel so long as your tires are going around. When you hit the brakes you have NO controle.
Go to a parking lot after the store or whatever has closed and test this for yourself. It will also help you understand turning into a skid and learn the limits of your X.
After the first snow each year we have a bunch of fender bender claims. They are not usually from young drivers only as we all tend to forget how slippery it can be.

Easy...take an Austin Martin Vantage and take out the V12, then stick in a small ford v8 and add machine guns and convert it to AWD so it can drive up stairs, anyone else pumped for DIE ANOTHER DAY???

yeah just dont panic and slam the brakes, steer in the direction you want to go and try not to sh*t yourself.
And i guess if you are sliding and see you will hit sumthing pull the E brake so you spin the back end and smash up the back of your truck only....if you have the guts.

After the first snow each year we have a bunch of fender bender claims.

HA, I was laughing at all the people that where in the ditch. This really wasn't anything. I just hate the black ice or what ever it is. NO tractsion!

Originally posted by Silverblade
Easy...take an Austin Martin Vantage and take out the V12, then stick in a small ford v8 and add machine guns and convert it to AWD so it can drive up stairs, anyone else pumped for DIE ANOTHER DAY???


I am! and they got an explorer front axle! don't we all feel famous now? ha ha ha! I can't wait till it comes out! :D

It funny it is your first instinct to hit the breaks when you slide toward some thing. You need to keep your witts about you and stay off the break.
Bottom line when you are sliding there is very little you can do. The key is NOT sliding. That boils down to the afor mentioned , more following space , slower speed , slower reaction , genteler driving.
( genteler , no it's not in the dictionary )

dont touch the brakes it only makes it worse, and also slip it into nuetral quickley...or keep a constant rpm. and the faster you can turn the wheel into the spin the faster you will recover..*only leave in nuetral until you feel the truck/car start to come back under control. The best thing to do is find an empty parking and have at it. Practice practice practice.
dont let the truck go into the ditch sideways...you could roll it. If the road shines like glass be weary and all the input to the controls should be very slow and calculated.

Go find a parking lot that is covered w/ snow and or ice. You might have to wait until the next storm. Then go out and practice. try locking them up, do donuts and practice recovery. practice sliding and recovery. do this as often as you can and at the highest speeds that are SAFE. Don't wrap your vehicle around a lamp post ar some thing like that... Pretty soon the feel and the reflexes will be automatic.

I started doing this when I fist got my license in 1973 in Iowa.. We would somtimes have ice from Nov-April some years. I still will do this when I go some place that has snow and ice on a vacation.

Thanks for all the advise. I guess I was just asking the question because I've never went that far out of control before in my life. I slipped a little in my front wheel drive car and slowed it down a bit and haven't ever had any other problems....... That I haven't brought on myself......

I've done almost everything mentioned here and now I dont' feel stupid or like a little kid with going into parking lots to test out driving in poor conditions.

Last year, my first year with the X, 4WD, ABS, and Auto 4WD, I had the ability with my security job to drive all day long and get paid for it. I really learned how ABS works and how stable and reliable the Auto 4 and ABs really is.

I guess I was just a little amazed, suprised, and ashamed that I lose control that much that I thought I was going into the ditch and I did cross the center lane. In the past I've went over spots that I could tell were slippery. I've even driven 140 miles on the worst traffic (weather related) day of the winter. The roads were so slippery that people would go into the ditch every 25 yards. I got stuck on a bridge that was so slippery that if I touched the gas the tires would spin.

I was impressed that in that short amount of time I actually know that there was no oncomming traffic and that I was far enough away from any vehicles infront or behind me. I actually calculated weather I should aim for the ditch and if I'd be ok and be able to get out, or it I should try to correct and be able to save myself from sliding into the ditch sideways. I guess I did well. Still, I frigg'n hate black ice.

Simple question: Turning into the skid, or in the direction of the skid...does that mean that if you are sliding and the back end is heading to the left and the drivers side of the car is going forward, to turn the wheels to the left to face the direction you are sliding?

Don't think I saw this posted yet but try lowering the air pressure in your tires. It makes them perform better on slick surfaces.

The trick on ice is one most would not do. Anyone that has taken EVOC (emergency vehilce operations course) knows of this. 4WD IS A BIG NO NO. OK think of it this way. You are in a rear wheel drive vehicle. your rear tires spin. this causes your rear to slide out. Now imagine all 4 wheels sliding. You are MORE likely to lose comtrol of the vehicle. Many studies and reports have been done to prove this theory. I know several will not agree so go ahead and flame and yell at me.

Forgot to add. I mean this ONLY for ice and rain. 4wd is excelent for other situations

by the way, coming back from indiana a few years ago, I was driving along doing about 80, no sign of foul weather anywhere, late at night... ALl of a sudden hit a patch of black ice. Truck started swerving all around but I didn't slam on the brake just instead concentrated all my effort on the truck going in the right direction. Managed to do a 360 in the middle of the interstate but never went off the road and there was no one else around to hit. It took me a while to catch my breath though. This was after having a dream that I was in a horribly fiery wreck with my explorer in tow, and I had decided not to tow my explorer behind for that reason. Hate to think of what would have happened if I had had the explorer behind me and hit that patch of ice...

Originally posted by TheRookie
The trick on ice is one most would not do. Anyone that has taken EVOC (emergency vehilce operations course) knows of this. 4WD IS A BIG NO NO. OK think of it this way. You are in a rear wheel drive vehicle. your rear tires spin. this causes your rear to slide out. Now imagine all 4 wheels sliding. You are MORE likely to lose comtrol of the vehicle. Many studies and reports have been done to prove this theory. I know several will not agree so go ahead and flame and yell at me.

4WD makes it harder to loose control, however it makes it harder to gain back the control once it gets lost. I have driven front wheel drives, rear wheel drives and 4 wheel drives on ice and snow. On ice, my 4-wheel drive handling greatly exceeded that of my rear wheel drives and still exceeded the handling of my front wheel drives by a decent amount. The key to staying in control is to overdrive the conditions.

I've done 360s in the middle of the road in my rear wheel drives by hitting the brakes a bit too hard when trying to make a sudden turn or when I've given it a bit too much gas when turning. My front wheel drives were a lot more stable. As soon as I felt the front starting to plow forward, I let off the gas and immediately regain traction. My 4 wheel drive has never slipped except for the few driver induced moments.

Originally posted by TheRookie
Forgot to add. I mean this ONLY for ice and rain. 4wd is excelent for other situations Is this because most people don't know how to control 4 wheels with power? I would say that someone that has mastered ice and rain in 4wd might have an edge up on those that only master rear wheel drive under the same conditions. I think most people on ice and rain get into trouble by stopping or going too fast.

What about automatic 4wd? When the rear begins to spin it will automatically kick in the front? Is this not a good thing under ice and rain?

Have you seen that Volkswagon comercial ???
The one where the guy is thinging to him self about " the wheels that slip transfering to the wheels that grip "
and you look and see him just spinnin' in circles.

Funny comercial.

Just thought I would bring that up for no real reason.

Thanks for reading my post :D

Well after driving in MN for 4 years now in the snow/ice with my X Im starting to feel pretty confident in my winter driving skills....as everyone here has mentioned staying off the brakes and making smooth adjustments is the key.

In 4x4 giving it gas can help you regain control if you know what your doing (in snow that is) by pulling the front end back around, anyway I cant wait for the snow to fly so I can go out and play :) in my 'x' that is :)

-Matt

I love driving in the snow with 4x4 too. It's so fun to pull up next to anyone with a "cool" car (yes this includes ricers) and pull away like it's no ones business. Just have to remember that you're breaking is not any better.

oh yea,

An 4x4 "burn" outs are cool too.

OK 4WD is dangerous period because of the way the system works. Equal power is given to the front and rear wheels. This in theory is great if there was no such thing as friction. Unfortunately, we have moving parts and heat is generated due to the parts rubbing together and that heat is wasted horsepower.

The rear wheels due to the driveshaft from the front of the car, end up getting less power, and you have an uneven distribution of power. This can prove disastrous on the ice. This is why 4WD is a big no no for ice driving. AWD on the other hand is a nice thing to have.

It all depends on your driving habits. Any form of drivertrain is dangerous in its own way. RWD will kick the back-end out, FWD will under-steer, and 4WD will lock the 4 wheels together.

Just remember this one very simple rule to tires. Your tires can do 100% divided anyway you choose among these three things. Turning/Acceleration/Braking. You can do 30/30/40 but you can NOT do 100/20/40. In other words, when you are slamming on those brakes in the ice, they won't have any available grip to help you regain control because they are too busy trying to stop the vehicle.

Hope this helps anybody out there.

Just figures I'd through this up for some added reading

http://www.powertrax.com/traction.htm

After driving rear-wheel drive vehicles in Iowa winter's for every year I've driven( this'll be my 5th winter), I've become pretty good. Been through some hairy situation's that made me skip a heartbeat or 2, but madeit through alright. The only thing 4WD does is give's u better traction when accelerating, and help's pull your front end when u r turning. I see as many 4X4's in the ditch on my way to school as I do small cars, Using your head is and slwoing down is the key.

I've alway's felt much safer having 4WD in the winter, and have it in 4HI all the time when I'm in city traffic.

Growing up in Alaska, I've always felt that I have a superior feel of control for vehicles than many people I've met. In Fairbanks we get lots of ice, and so either you wreck a lot of cars, or you learn how to drive them. After you've put a car in a ditch a certain number of times, you just figure out how to avoid it. Survival of the fitest I guess. Anyways, at the beginning of the winter when we get our first ice, I always go to a big open parking lot and spin around a bit, to help myself remember how to drive on the ice. In general, I pop into 4wd whenever I'm stopped and use it up to about 15 or 20, 4wd provides a much better starting grip as you have all 4 tires to gain traction. This is why 2wd cars and trucks stay at the light for 2 minutes spinning their tires trying to get across the ice. However, once you are moving, 4wd is much more dangerous, especially on us older model Explorers which only have rear anti-lock brakes. If you are coming up on a corner and you can't stop, just keep going until you can slow down, turn around and come back a the turn. better than sliding halfway throuhg the turn and going into the ditch.

Finally, something no one else has mentioned here is downshifting. If its super icy, downshifting provides the best form of slowing down with no chance of locking up your tires. they just try to spin slower without actually stopping. a combination of light breaking and downshifting can actually make you stop pretty fast.

later
chris