My compressor didn't run, So i recharged the system..The compresser will come on but shut off about 5 seconds later and back on a couple seconds after that and keep repeating itself..The air is still hot..

Describe in some detail how you "recharged" the system?

Chris

Your compressor is shot. When you open it up, most likely you will have 'black death'. Very common for Fords. The oil turns black. Anyway, when the compressor turns on and off like that, it's confused. It doesn't know if it is comming or going. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.

NOTAJP... don't be so hasty. A fast cycle usually is related to the low side cutoff kicking in due to a low charge. The compressor has no brain. It only knows what the clutch tells it to do. That was why I asked the Q of "HOW". I am suspecting a low charge, but want more details.

Go slow Grasshopper.. and the answers will find YOU.


Happy Exploring

Chris

Call me a psychic. You have an acumulator with a foam blanket on it. Lift the foam and notice the rust. Replace the accumulator. Evacuate the system and recharge with 134a and oil. You are back in business.

My guess is that as fast as you put in the 134a it was leaking out.

Good Luck,
mikeh

Easy way to tell if it is seeing a low charge is to jump the low pressure switch.. On first gens it is over by the dryer.. just take off the switch and jump a wire between the 2 connectors (on the plug, not the sensor)..

If it was low pressure, this will keep it on. If low pressure, usually the charge is low, but more can cause it.. (in my case, I do have a bad compressor AND low charge. My compressor doesn't compress anymore.. it used to click when it spun, did that for 100k miles, then it just stopped compressing).

~Mark

Originally posted by Glacier991
NOTAJP... don't be so hasty. A fast cycle usually is related to the low side cutoff kicking in due to a low charge. The compressor has no brain. It only knows what the clutch tells it to do. That was why I asked the Q of "HOW". I am suspecting a low charge, but want more details.

This guy is completely right. It is just most likely that the system doesnt have enough coolant to fully trip the prssure switch that is in there. When you charge your A/c the fill guage in the kit should go from the green area which is in the 25-45 range. So if it is reading lower than this then you got way too low of a charge. I would say go out and buy one or two more cans and then put part of one in and check it and so on till you reach about 40 or so. Dont go over becasue you dont want to overload the system either. Most likely it is just your pressure switch that hasnt been fully tripped yet. In fact have the vehicle running while you charge it. Then you will actually be able to see when it makes the minimum full charge. And then charge it some more because the minimum charge that trips the pressure switch is really low. I mean it wouldnt cool worth a crap. But most likely it is just not enough coolant in it yet. I think we used like at least 2 or 3 R-134a cans to fill my explorer. But it was dead empty not even neg- pressurized. But just follow what the guage says. And if there is too much in the system. Then just bleed some out , hey you didnt hear this from me. UUUUM i meant bleed it out into a atmospheric safe container good for disposal. lol. yeah thats what i meant. lol. Goodluck and most likely that is all it is. especially if the compressor pump worked beforehand.

Listen to Glacier. Tell him what he asks, and he'll steer you in the right direction.

FWIW, when I recently converted my 92 (with valuable help from Glacier), I put 2 cans in. I could see the low side pressure drop to 25, and compressor would kick off. Pressure would quickly rise to 45, and compressor would kick on. It would run 5-10 seconds, and pressure would drop to 25, and compressor would kick off. Air wasn't cold from the vents. Sounds almost exactly what you are seeing.

I then added more freon, and the compressor would run continuosly, and vent air got cold. My guess is you need more freon.

Many thanks to Glacier for his help!!! He's da man!

<blush> thank you Dave!

Chris

Hi and thankyou for these replies..I charged it with a can that had 12oz of 134A and 2oz of oil..,However a little was left in the can and it wouldn't go into the system..,So i figured it was full...Before i charged it the compressor didn't come on at all..So after the charge when i heard it come on i was happy.,But then it just kicked right off about 5 seconds later and back on about 5 seconds after that and so on..I see the thing on the end were the belt is spin and stop..I also hear a little click next to were i recharged it right before it goes off and on..Can someone take a picture of what switch i am suppose to jump to see if the compressor is bad? Thankyou

ttt

Man if your system was dea of refirgerant then it is probably just really low on R-134a. If i were you i would spend the $5.00 and get another can. I mean if you cannot hear anything leaking out really fast then most lilely it doesnt have a leak. Besides, what you descirbe is very characteristic of not having enough refrigerant in there. If you only put one can in then you more than likely need to add at least another can get get it to set the switch off. And then possibly part of another to have enough pressure left inthe can to pressurize the system enough to be close to topping it off. But like i said before, dont overdo it. Just do checks with your guage every little while. You will be fine. And it alot less headache than finding the sensor and jumping it. If it is engaging at all then it most likely has a good pump. Just do what we are saying and you should be good to go.

There is a thread under useful threads describing converting to R-134a from R-12 ansd in it is describes how to charge your system. The can pressure will equalize with the pressure in the system before you have a full charge. How do you get the rest in? You run the air conditioner and let the compressor suck in and compress the gas from the can. KEEP THE CAN RIGHTSIDE UP AS YOU DO THIS!!!! (the other way could introduce liquid refrigerant into the system, and the comopressor cannot compress a liquid, and that could cause damage. You will feel the can get cold during this procedure... it goes faster if you have a coffee can of warm water you can put the can in (the heated water keeps the can pressures higher so it goes in faster).
You never did answer my earlier questions, but I'm just going to assume your charge is low.

As for leaks, check around the accumulator (the black cannister near the passenger side firewall) many rusted through under the little foam covering. As for finding a leak, your hearing is useless. Many significant leaks are undetectable without either dye in the refrigerant, or an electronic "sniffer". If you can HEAR a leak, it's a catastrophic one.

Happy Exploring

Chris

Originally posted by Glacier991
There is a thread under useful threads describing converting to R-134a from R-12 ansd in it is describes how to charge your system. The can pressure will equalize with the pressure in the system before you have a full charge. How do you get the rest in? You run the air conditioner and let the compressor suck in and compress the gas from the can. KEEP THE CAN RIGHTSIDE UP AS YOU DO THIS!!!! (the other way could introduce liquid refrigerant into the system, and the comopressor cannot compress a liquid, and that could cause damage. You will feel the can get cold during this procedure... it goes faster if you have a coffee can of warm water you can put the can in (the heated water keeps the can pressures higher so it goes in faster).
You never did answer my earlier questions, but I'm just going to assume your charge is low.

As for leaks, check around the accumulator (the black cannister near the passenger side firewall) many rusted through under the little foam covering. As for finding a leak, your hearing is useless. Many significant leaks are undetectable without either dye in the refrigerant, or an electronic "sniffer". If you can HEAR a leak, it's a catastrophic one.

Happy Exploring

Chris

I will have to completely agree with him again. Just do as he and i reccomend and you should be fine. Follow it to a "T" and you should be good to go. I really doubt it is actually a bad compressor.

I will buy 2 more cans if i can find it for $5. The last one cost me $15 and i don't want to waste that much if it isn't the problem..I don't have a guage to check the presure so i will be adding till it just doesn't take it anymore..I will do this today and let you all know...I appreciate your help very much! Thankyou

Ok i bought a can with the guage on it..I hooked it up and the guage was in the red at 100.......When i started the truck and turned the AC on high. The guage would go up and down to each click from the compressor..It would go down to the green and back up to the yellow..When i added a bit of stuff and checked it later it was still in the red.

I'm having the same problem. I had a new timing belt put on under warranty on my '97 4.0 sohc at 92k. I get the truck back, and didn't use the air for a couple of weeks. When I tried it, it was hot so I added freon. I had no luck with that and eventually figured out the accumulator had rusted through so I replaced it. Now I've put the system under a vacuum and tried to recharge it. Approximatly half a can of r134a and it goes from a vacuum of 28 inches to 50-55 psi... above what it should be. The compressor clicks on and off with the pressure dropping and quickly rising back up again. Does anybody have any suggestions? I tried this three times, so I'm out of ideas unless the low pressure switch is bad.

Let's try this slowly.... you had a system you evacuated? Using what? What symptoms, other than hot air were present previously? Anything suspect about the compressor operation ? (I am thinking you have an early system failure and a plugged Orifice tube, maybe....) If you could pull a vacuum on it can you recover the charge and see how the OT looks ? Let's go a step at a time.... often the rush to judgment can be counterproductive...

Cool Exploring

Chris

I used one of the harbor freight venturi type vacuum pumps and my air compressor to pull the vacuum. I'm going to try to add oil to it and see if that does anything this morning.

I also bought an orifice tube and didn't replace it when I put the accumulator in... probably a bad idea. I'm thinking of opening the system up again and installing it so I can see what the condition of the old one is in.

scott,


what was the name and/or part number of the harborfreight vac that you used? Also where exactly do you hook it up to the system if you want to evacuate it?
Thanks

I hooked the vac up on top of the accumulator where you add freon to the system. I used the hose with the freon kit and an adapter to go from the R134 style fitting to the R12 style fitting on the vacuum. I don't have a name for the vacuum, just a venturi type vacuum. It cost $12.99 on sale at Harbor Freight. It seems to do a decent job, not great by any means, but for the price it'd be hard to beat. I ran it for about 15 minutes on my compressor.

I had the a similar problem, the switch to jump it is in the corner of the engine bay closest to the passenger door. It sounds like you may have something in the piping blocking the refrigerant from getting to the compressor replace atleast the oriface tube (check it and i bet you'll find it full of gunk) and have it evacuated. In my case the guy that was evacuating my system only did it for twenty minures (suppose to be 30 but he said if it does'nt get everything in twenty its not the problem) needless to say it still did'nt work. So as I was shutting my hood up his boss came and said he wanted to try it. My compressor was coming off and on again everyfew seconds. So he jumped it and sure enough it stayed on. He hooked it up again and evacuated it for the whole 30 minutes and sure enough it worked without him doing anything differently. Some people will tell you that evacuating is not important as my friends tried to tell me, but now i'm a sure believer in doing things the right way now.

I finally got it going earlier today by doing just what you're saying... jumping the electrical switch on top of the accumulator. It seems to be working pretty good right now.

I got everything ready to roll. I am going to be replacing the accum tommorrow morning. THanks to Scott and V8 for all of the advice. I will keep you guys posted.

are you guys talking about the sensor right under were we add a charge? Because mine is still going on and off..

Glad I could help you out some. Yeah, its a little round connecter right under where you add the freon. Just jump it with a small piece of wire.... the compressor will stay on aslong as the two pins are shorted together. Note its a 4 pin connector, but only two of the holes have wires in them.

Guys... jumping this as a test of the compressor is ok... leaving it jumped is NOT. This is NOT some instant FIX. yes the switch COULD be bad, or maybe, just MAYBE it is doing it's job ! Don't expect a panacea. There are a lot of posts and threads on here that will explain the system operation. Read grasshopper.

Cool, long term cool...
Exploring


Chris

ps. the switch is DESIGNED to cut out at 25 psi... to prevent freezing your evaporator. Without a gauge set, you have no idea what it's doing.

Glad I could help you out some. Yeah, its a little round connecter right under where you add the freon. Just jump it with a small piece of wire.... the compressor will stay on aslong as the two pins are shorted together. Note its a 4 pin connector, but only two of the holes have wires in them.

Yeah, be sure to put the connector back on like its supposed to be after you get some freon in it.... don't just jump it and run it like that from now on....

OK guys

I replaced the accum. today per the instructions that Scott, and V8 had posted on the board. Inside Temp with A/C on Max before the replacement. 67-70 degrees. Temp inside after 48-50 degrees, that doesn't sound like a big difference but it is. After I put the accum in, I started the Ex and had A/C on Max, the compressor wasn't doing anything, then I started recharging, the compressor kick on for 15 seconds off for 5 seconds, after I got half way through the second can of freon it started staying on. THanks guys here's another example how the board helps us save $$$$.

Thanks again,
Brian

Ok i jumped that switch were i put the freon in and the compressor stayed on and the air got cold..Also the pipes got cold too...What does this mean? New switch or is something else causing it

what you describe can also be a low charge. Get a gauge and see what your low side pressures are, or take it to someone to have them check. It's not difficult.

Chris

The guage has me in the red at 100 or so..

I'm sorry. Jumper the connection so the AC runs, and THEN read the pressure. 100 PSI or so, hmmm I bet it was in the 90's there when you read it without the engine running. Good guess?

Read the low side with the system opertaing, sorry I should have mentioned that before.

awaiting your response

Happy Exploring

Chris

I'm sorry. Jumper the connection so the AC runs, and THEN read the pressure. 100 PSI or so, hmmm I bet it was in the 90's there when you read it without the engine running. Good guess?

Read the low side with the system opertaing, sorry I should have mentioned that before.

awaiting your response

Happy Exploring

Chris

I found this web page that would make interesting reading for anyone with leaky A/C.
------------------------
http://www.imcool.com/articles/aircondition/corroded_accumulator.htm

I couldnt find my AC leak and found this site a little while back....tore out my air box etc to egt to the accumulator at all sides...peeled off the blanket, and nothing....completely clean and new....

Considering the weird and inconvenient spots I am seeing rust on this truck, I thought for sure this would be the problem..

turns out the condensor has a leak......

Great....so I get to replace BOTH. And I "just" had everything apart to replace the radiator about 3 months ago.... :)

DZ

Originally posted by professorweed
I found this web page that would make interesting reading for anyone with leaky A/C.
------------------------
http://www.imcool.com/articles/aircondition/corroded_accumulator.htm

i dont know if cars are the same way but i do hvac work for a living u can also over charge a system and it will cut off....so under charge over charge both shut it off

sounds like you guys know a lot about ac so maybe i can get some help.i've had my 94 explore for 3 yrs. now.at the begining of every summer, i have to recharge my system because of some leak during the winter season that i can't figure out. this past summer i had to recharge it 2-3 times because it would not hold a charge for more than a month.just last week i put a can in it and it only kicked the compressor on for a few seconds. i'm pretty sure that the compressor is good because i didn't have any problems with it before when there was a charge. i'm almost positive that the eccumulator is good because i changed that out 2 yrs. ago along with the orifice tube. i what i will do next is go buy 2 more cans of r134a and fill it up to make sure that the compressor is good. but what i can't figure out is where is this leak coming from.at first it would hold a charge for a month, now its only a week and just keeps on going down hill.any ideas or suggestions on what it could be.

i made one minor error on the previous comment.i meant to say that i replaced my evaporator not the accumulator.so i may need to check the accumulator from what you guys are saying.also if i change the accumulator, do i have to evacuate the system or can i just put freon in afterward.

There are a lot of places for leaks. The accumulator was a high risk area on Ex's, but you could have a compressor seal leak as well. This is where paying for someone to run a "sniffer" or leak detector over the system could save you a lot of frustrating hours. Otherwise start using 134 with a dye in it and look with a blacklight. Not as easy as a sniffer, but maybe easier for you if you have access to a blacklight. Still leaks can occur in areas difficult to visualize.

Happy Exploring

Chris

If the compressor has a leak on the seal, will it still operate normally or will there be anything noticeably different so that i can be sure that it is the compressor.Also if there is a leak on the seal, can that be fix by a do it yourself person like myself or do i have to get a new one. One more thing, if I change out the accumulator, do i have to evacuate the system or can I just put in the freon and go from there.

A lotta advise but:
I bought a low power black light bulb (cheap) at WAL MART and put it in my drop light to trace the dye.
(as in the garage at night - in the dark that's about it haha)

Now, I won't win a prize at the next A\C Mechanics Convention but it did work for me.

Leaks
Check the schreder valve if you go for the new drier..... the goofy thing was loose out of box when I did mine ...I should have checked

I feel your pain
You will know everything and more about A\Cs when you get it.... and you will get it.

Replacing accum\drier should not require full flush.

i have found that the compressor will stay off of it si below freezing outside

Without pulling the book I think that is OK.

I read one of the reasons that Ford (and others) cycle the A\C on so many climate functions is get keep freon and stuff moving so it doesn't sit for months .... for the seals etc

nhut ... if you pull the accumulator, you need to evacuate the system before you add refrigerant.

Point of clarification:
By definition if to remove the accum\drier you must evacuate the system……my Helm and other reference stuff say you do not have to FLUSH the system after evcauating the sytem while replacing the Accum\Drier…(in the absence of other problems)

Sorry, Did I misspeak? I do that alot.

A distinction. To remove the accumulator dryer, you will need to remove any refrigerant charge remaining (if none, and there is no system pressure, go ahad an open 'er up). Evacuate means pull a vacuum on a closed system. You do not need to do that to remove the accumulator/recvr-dryer. You DO need to do that to recharge the system properly.

I've always "evacuated" the system by attaching a hose to the shreader valve and "let her go" ...... not EPA recommended but ....
...the difference is good to know.
I can see you point

You may find something in this thread of use to you.

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=77626