Another noise thread..

[07EddyB]

So having fixed the exhaust manifold leak I have had another noise to contend with. I don't know if it was present at the same time and the exhaust leak was louder or if it started later. It starts as soon as I start the engine and continues so it's not a only when hot or only when cold thing. Messing around with my mechanics stethoscope (an old Craftsman flat blade screwdriver) it does appear to be coming from the right side and appears to be concentrated at the front of the valve cover. So cam phasers right? But I thought that was a hot thing only. I have unplugged the VCT solenoids and the noise did not go away. I'm not thinking an exhaust manifold leak because I just went through that and it was different. You could easily tell which side the noise was coming from. So I'm going to share a video - I took this with the hood down to cancel out extraneous noises. I start from the left side and make my way to the right - then back to the left. You can see that I intentionally got close in to the wheel wells. If you have any thoughts please share.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B3ArbHmWxZcTLWtzcXFFeFdkUzRJR2ZDQlBtZkFldjN4NzBz/view?usp=sharing

 

[07EddyB]

Your being a quiet bunch today. Cmon guys - any ideas? BTW - the belt and tensioner are new.

 

[07EddyB]

Things seem to be getting worse so I'm going to drop it off at a shop tomorrow. I've heard good things about them but have only used them so far to press a bearing for me. Funny how when you work on stuff yourself you don't know where the good mechanics are because you never use them. I'll let you know how it turns out. My suspicion is the right cam phaser. But after much research, is it really the cam phaser or is it acting up due to a leaking chain tensioner causing low oil pressure? Or is it the chain slapping due to bad tensioners and broken guides? I would tear into it but I'm afraid it's a week long job and I don't have anything else to drive.
I guess it's time to finally let someone else work on it.

 

[Bill MacLeod]

I know you don't want to hear this, but if I recall from your exhaust manifold thread, there is one cylinder that only has 1 stud. If its the top on #1 cylinder/manifold then I would first verify that its not the issue.

 

[07EddyB]

I know you don't want to hear this, but if I recall from your exhaust manifold thread, there is one cylinder that only has 1 stud. If its the top on #1 cylinder/manifold then I would first verify that its not the issue.

I've definitely thought of that - with the exhaust leak it was much more pronounced on that side. This sound can be heard from both sides - only slightly less from the left. Between my house and my neighbors - before I could only hear it on the right - not I can hear it bounce off both sides. And it doesn't get any better when it warms up. I mean - it could be - but it seems different this time. I've also put my screwdriver stethoscope as close to that missing stud as I could and the sound is stronger at the valve cover than there.

 

[Bill MacLeod]

When the engine is cold, remove the heat shield from the top of the manifold (if still there) try and wrap a rag around the manifold where it meets the head. Wrap it very tight. This might briefly silence an exhaust leak on start-up.

IF, its an exhaust leak. Worth a try.

Heck on a cold start, jam a big rag in there to see if it muffles the sound. As always, be careful of the serp belt.

 

[07EddyB]

When the engine is cold, remove the heat shield from the top of the manifold (if still there) try and wrap a rag around the manifold where it meets the head. Wrap it very tight. This might briefly silence an exhaust leak on start-up.

IF, its an exhaust leak. Worth a try.

Heck on a cold start, jam a big rag in there to see if it muffles the sound. As always, be careful of the serp belt.

I decided not to take it in today - we just installed some new hardware at a remote site and I need to be able to head there at a moments notice - not everything is settled in there yet unfortunately. I hear you on the exhaust - I'll check it out further this weekend but thus far it seems to be centered around the front top of the right valve cover. It's a pain to follow noises on the front because the truck won't run without the snorkel and the snorkel is in the way. I think I'll try listening outside the garage this time to cut down on the background noise echoing off the walls and pull the belt again so I can get to the front of the engine without the belt trying to remove appendages.

 

[tripplec]

What Snorkel? (deep water one?)

 

[Explorer_PL]

Air intake and the box. You need MAF plugged in.

 

[tripplec]

Oh, ok that's the normal intake setup. Yeah, just wondering...

 

[07EddyB]

Oh, ok that's the normal intake setup. Yeah, just wondering...

Yes - the normal intake. I guess I'm showing my age here calling it a snorkel

 

[Bill MacLeod]

And now you have an audience. lol
Good idea to remove the belt. If you are really resourceful, ever thought about a homemade smoke machine.

Of course, non of this will be of help if its a phaser problem. Good luck.

 

[07EddyB]

I stopped by Tractor Supply for something today - as I was leaving my battery light came on. Coincidence or related? I don't know - I will be pulling the belt tomorrow and looking at the alternator more closely. It's very close to the noise. Wishful thinking I know - but maybe.

 

[07EddyB]

I dropped it off this morning. Just for the noise though - the battery light started coming back on again - this time it's happening with alarming regularity. Looks like I'll be replacing an alternator soon. Or I may just let them do it since they have it. I had no idea that 100K was the magical mileage for everything to fall apart. It's been a bad year but hopefully I can get past it.

 

[Explorer_PL]

Hang in there EddyB
It gets better. I replace things now (254k) at the same rate I was replacing them at 75k. It's cyclical.

I do not believe 100k is anything magical, I just fix things as they come, and they happen at various times. I always think "New car payment or $ 170 for a new hub"

 

[07EddyB]

And the verdict is - a lifter. That's what he thinks anyway - actually he thinks I may have a clogged oil passage or something denying a lifter oil. He doesn't think it is any of the timing components - the sound is different and he thinks it is further back. He has a 5.4 liter ford and he told me about all the problems that he has had so he is very familiar with the engine. I get the feeling that he doesn't want to dig any deeper since he couldn't pinpoint it exactly and he would have to pull the engine to do so. When I asked him if he wanted to work on the lifter he said - I can put a new engine in it!
He said no charge - I didn't do anything for you - come see us again. I handed him 10 bucks and said cash - I was never here.
I'm bummed but haven't given up. I think the lifter is the symptom - not the problem. At least I can divert my attention from the timing components. Now off to Google to educate myself some more and formulate a game plan.

 

[Zorin]

EddyB, this is a classic lifter, or roller follower noise. It's also a piece of cake to diagnose and repair yourself.

Pull the valve cover off of the noisiest side, in your case, I'm certain it is the right even though I am not there to listen to it. The roller followers can be pried right out with a prybar as long as the cam is not putting pressure on the spring. Pry the follower away from the lifter, and it will pop right out.

Check to see if the roller bearings have let go, this will make the follower loose, and create this exact noise. Removing a lifter is also a snap, they pull right out. If you have a really squishy one, then you have found a blown out lifter. These should pump up with oil, and stay pretty solid, even when off....they have a check valve in them to keep them that way when the engine is turned off.

Tim

 

[07EddyB]

Well this is odd - no one in town stocks an alternator. I can get one tomorrow but no one stocks it. I think I'll verify that I don't have any wiring issues before I order one since they run almost $200. You know what the worst part is? I have it parked now but while driving it today I couldn't turn the heat or the radio on so I had to listen to that lifter pecking the whole time.

 

[07EddyB]

I pulled the alternator tonight and had it tested. It was only putting out 12.5 volts. Considering how it's messing up my schedule tomorrow not having a vehicle I could put it back in and probably be ok but Murphy told me to order one and wait till tomorrow when it comes in.

 

[07EddyB]

New (well - reman) alternator is on and I'm back above 14 volts at idle. I learned something during this process. There is a huge freaking hole between the block and the intake manifold. I didn't know that until now - the alternator effectively hides it. Gosh - I wonder if the huge resonance chamber located between the block and the cylinder heads and the intake might explain why these engines are so noisy.

That's sarcasm BTW.

While I'm on the subject - what's the tube that goes from the back of the water pump to the back of the engine?