AWD sucks in snow and then turns off

[Dan Ike]

My 2013 Explorer Sport AWD is terrible in snow compared to my 2013 Escape Titanium AWD and F-150 FX4. I have a gravel driveway in rural area with little to no snow removal. My tires are hancook summer tires which I know are terrible for snow. However, both other vehicles can make it up. The Explorer has traction control off, Snow mode on, and I'm monitoring the AWD gauge on dashboard. It starts with front wheels turning as i have momentum getting up the steep part but then as i start to slip in front, the back wheels don't try to spin, the dashboard just says "AWD turned off" and I have to turn the car off and back on again to get the AWD to say it's on. The AWD gauge DOES SHOW REAR WHEELS GETTING POWER but my brother outside says they don't spin. For testing, i parked on a known sheet of ice and attempted to give it different levels of acceleration but never once does the rear wheels try to spin. Only the front. Is this perhaps a defect i need to have looked at? I've owned many makes and models of AWD vehicles and this has been the least helpful in terms of sending power where it's needed.

 

[peterk9]

Does AWD turn OFF if you leave Traction Control ON? It's also hard to justify saying that "AWD sucks in snow" if you are not running the proper tires regardless of your experience with the other vehicles. I always use dedicated Winter tires during the Winter season since they remain pliable in cold weather regardless of snow. Try your test using 'Sand' mode and see if there is any difference in wheel spin. I've driven in 'Snow' mode in town and on the highway this past week and no issue but I didn't think to bring up the Intelligent AWD display. Will try to make a point of that next time to see what it shows.

Peter

 

[blwnsmoke]

You are runninng summer tires in the winter and complaining about traction? Sorry, but lol..

And if your AWD is turning off, you have a mechanical or electrical failure. I live in NH and my wife drives the Explorer to and from work every week, almost 6 years and 120k... Not once as the AWD ever turned off.

 

[thefranchise713]

Your AWD is faulting out, though I thought that message usually came on for an overtemp concern. (If so, it's probably a false positive for you.)

The behavior is abormal--you need to scan for codes when it fails out next time.

 

[Dan Ike]

Tested with traction control on and all the different terrain modes like sand, normal, snow. AWD turns off in every scenerio. I'll take it in to dealership this week. Thanks

 

[Odrapnew]

1. I agree with blwnsmoke. Summer tires have no place in snow.
2. It does sound like your AWD is not working properly. I can get all 4 wheels spinning in the snow, especially in sand mode.

 

[peterk9]

Does AWD turn OFF if you leave Traction Control ON? It's also hard to justify saying that "AWD sucks in snow" if you are not running the proper tires regardless of your experience with the other vehicles. I always use dedicated Winter tires during the Winter season since they remain pliable in cold weather regardless of snow. Try your test using 'Sand' mode and see if there is any difference in wheel spin. I've driven in 'Snow' mode in town and on the highway this past week and no issue but I didn't think to bring up the Intelligent AWD display. Will try to make a point of that next time to see what it shows.

Peter

I had a chance to try 'Snow' mode and the display shows the power initially going briefly to the rear wheels and then transferring to the front. Did several starts from a dead stop. Did not have Traction Control turned OFF.

 

[CDW6212R]

I had a chance to try 'Snow' mode and the display shows the power initially going briefly to the rear wheels and then transferring to the front. Did several starts from a dead stop. Did not have Traction Control turned OFF.

Peter, how is the late model system working? I ask because I often blast people for calling automatic 4WD, AWD.

AWD should be an absolutely 100% all wheel drive, no turning it off, with no switches, because it has a center differential device(such as a viscous clutch). A4WD doesn't have a center diff, it simply "grabs" the front drive shaft, which makes it 4WD and can't be driven on dry pavement.

I'm asking how the systems have changed, because it doesn't make sense how people describe the later types.

I have AWD in two Explorers(302 AWD), and A4WD in one(99 V6). The AWD will spin at least one tire on each end of the truck, both rears if it has an LS diff. I drove it today on my 53 mile mail route. The tires make the difference, my Blizzak's grab snow or ice well. But enough pedal given, and it'll spin one front and one or two of the rears. Stopping is way more important than pulling, I was happy I had the snow tires, I have enough hills that'd wreck any vehicle with normal tires, even A/S.

 

[peterk9]

Hi Don. I find the system to be seamless. I considerate it to be AWD. The AWD system in the Highlanders I had were as you described, all 4 wheels being driven all the time. I've read several articles on all the different systems and still feel it is more AWD than 4WD. My MKT had the same system minus the Terrain Management System and the badge on the liftgate was AWD. On the display there was little difference between the 'Snow' and 'Normal' modes. What I did notice is the 'Snow' mode takes the 'edge' off the acceleration, especially from a dead stop. In 'Sand' mode it appears to send power to all 4 wheels fairly equally.
I also run the Blizzaks and wouldn't think of driving in the Winter without dedicated tires, plus it extends the life of the OEM tires.
There is a thread in the PIU sub forum where a member was asking about converting his Explorer to Right Hand Drive for mail delivery.

Peter

 

[bigtexan99]

The AWD gauge DOES SHOW REAR WHEELS GETTING POWER but my brother outside says they don't spin. For testing, i parked on a known sheet of ice and attempted to give it different levels of acceleration but never once does the rear wheels try to spin. Only the front. Is this perhaps a defect i need to have looked at?

Your tires should be spinning. Especially with the car sitting on ice. It sounds like power is not being distributed to the rear wheels. Easiest way to check is put the car up on jackstands or a lift at a carshop and then put it in gear. All 4 wheels should try to turn.

Previously Ford used the Haldex system on AWD cars and it could fail which would cause no power to be distributed to the rear wheels with no error message being thrown.

 

[bigtexan99]

I also run the Blizzaks and wouldn't think of driving in the Winter without dedicated tires, plus it extends the life of the OEM tires.

Wait, what? How does it extend the life of the OEM tires? You mean by taking them off the car and not using them?

 

[CDW6212R]

...
There is a thread in the PIU sub forum where a member was asking about converting his Explorer to Right Hand Drive for mail delivery.

Peter

Thanks, I take it that Ford has developed the automatic 4WD much better than the earliest versions of the 90's. Good to hear, I'm okay with how the A4WD works in my one truck, as I'm going to convert my V8 version to the bigger A4WD BW4406 soon. It's just stronger for the power I plan.

That member asking about converting to RHD, if you contact them again, tell them that the USPS has sold some of the RHD Explorers they made. Those were based on the 2nd gen Explorer, V6 SOHC, and those engines we all know are time bombs when not taken care of. The fleet of those evidently is around 22,000, so there should be a lot sold off in the next ten years. I just found out they made them as A4WD up north, while only 2WD down here. My office has one, and they say it'll fly. I'd like to find an imported RHD version for parts. I'd get the whole dash, AC, and much of the firewall. Put that in the mail version, and then a 302/AWD. That would be a slick mail truck. Night,

 

[CDW6212R]

Wait, what? How does it extend the life of the OEM tires? You mean by taking them off the car and not using them?

That's funny, and I get that here by pulling my snow tires off after each snow melts. My snow tires are 9/10 years old, and look almost new. I need to leave them on and wear them out this year or next.

 

[peterk9]

Wait, what? How does it extend the life of the OEM tires? You mean by taking them off the car and not using them?

Yes.

 

[blwnsmoke]

Peter, how is the late model system working? I ask because I often blast people for calling automatic 4WD, AWD.

AWD should be an absolutely 100% all wheel drive, no turning it off, with no switches, because it has a center differential device(such as a viscous clutch). A4WD doesn't have a center diff, it simply "grabs" the front drive shaft, which makes it 4WD and can't be driven on dry pavement.

I'm asking how the systems have changed, because it doesn't make sense how people describe the later types.

I have AWD in two Explorers(302 AWD), and A4WD in one(99 V6). The AWD will spin at least one tire on each end of the truck, both rears if it has an LS diff. I drove it today on my 53 mile mail route. The tires make the difference, my Blizzak's grab snow or ice well. But enough pedal given, and it'll spin one front and one or two of the rears. Stopping is way more important than pulling, I was happy I had the snow tires, I have enough hills that'd wreck any vehicle with normal tires, even A/S.

The 11+ Explorer is AWD, not 4WD. The driveshaft from the PTU is constantly spinning. The difference is that there are clutches front/back and side to side. These clutches allow the power to be changed from wheel to wheel when needed.

There is no on/off button for the AWD. You can turn the terrain management system off or change modes that will allow for more wheel spin (sand mode) and all this does is changes how the wheel/axle clutches behave.

A 4WD system is never 4WD unless you have both a front and rear locking axle. At most, you will have 3WD with a locking rear axle OR 2 1/2 WD because a limited slip diff still allows slippage. It will not transfer power to both rear wheels equally.

You will also get the front wheel hop on a 4wd vehicle when engaged and trying to turn. You will not get this on AWD because of the clutches allowing for the slippage.

 

[J_C]

Your AWD is faulting out, though I thought that message usually came on for an overtemp concern. (If so, it's probably a false positive for you.)

The behavior is abormal--you need to scan for codes when it fails out next time.

This, though it may have already set and stored a code so I'd go ahead and check it now. Can drivetrain set "pending" codes like engine management can?

 

[thefranchise713]

You might be more likely to see a historical code but I can't speak from my own experience.

 

[Dan Ike]

Just got my 2013 Explorer sport back from the dealership. $775 drive shaft replaced with $200 labor and it's driving great in the snow and ice now. Explains everything, luckily no damage was done to the transfer case. Thanks for all the comments

 

[blwnsmoke]

Just got my 2013 Explorer sport back from the dealership. $775 drive shaft replaced with $200 labor and it's driving great in the snow and ice now. Explains everything, luckily no damage was done to the transfer case. Thanks for all the comments

I believe this is the 1st driveshaft replacement I have heard of. Did they say what actually happened?

 

[Dan Ike]

No, they called and asked if I was sitting down. (We have a good relationship so it was a good way of breaking the news) I said yes and from there he started telling me how the drive shaft needs replaced. I didn't understand everything but basically theres a coupler from transfer case connected to drive shaft. The coupler and TC were in good shape but drive shaft wasn't working. He asked if I had noticed any particular time when something happened or heard any strange noise. I couldn't remember anything so I guess he was equally confused how it happened. Anyways, it drives perfectly fine on flat surfaces so who knows how long the drive shaft was bad. The snow and ice on my gravel driveway is what brought everything to light. Glad to have AWD functioning again.