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98 5.0 AWD Auto to 5spd M5R2 and 4406 M

Discussion in 'Modified 1995-2001 Explorers' started by Nick26, June 30, 2009.

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    1. downhillpat

      downhillpat New Member

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      I just checked about the clutches on a for a 4.2 versus a 5.0, they are different, along with the input shaft length.

      BTW any transfer case that has the round bolt pattern will bolt up, even most dodge and chevy cases.

      I would review this very carefully, make some comparison measurements before you purchase it IE Input shaft length between a 4.2 and a 5.0 tranny, I did find this however:

      Input Shaft:
      REF # Part # Description
      16 M5R2-16 M5R2 Input Shaft 88-95 11" Long
      16 M5R2-16A M5R2 Input Shaft 96-on 11 3/8" Long
       
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    3. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Yeah I was aware of that as well, Thanks a lot for your guys help. My thinking is that in 96 the 11 3/8" input shaft was used with the 5.0 and it was also used the next year with the 4.2, so on the input side I'm hoping everything should be compatible. What I'm wondering now is why the 97-98 4.2 is not interchangeable with the 99-04(according to car-part.com). I do see according to the parts websites it looks like after 98 they changed some syncros so it might just be internal only changes and they probably list them as non-interchangeable in case people want to pick up a tranny for parts.

      I'll post this here for anyone that's interested in parts info...
      http://www.mackstrans.com/MazdaFordM5R24x4.html
       
    4. 410Fortune

      410Fortune ELITE BRONCO2ERER Moderator Emeritus

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      awesome hope this all works out well! have you found your gen II/98 clutch/brake pedal assembly yet?
       
    5. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      thanks... not yet, I'm off today and I was hoping to goto the yard to look but we've just had thunderstorms all day.
       
    6. rwenzing

      rwenzing Active Member

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      Keep an eye out for the pedal assembly from a manual Ranger of the same era - that should help expand your search.
       
    7. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Yeah that's really what I was counting on, I don't have high expectations for actually finding an explorer with stick in the yard.

      So I went and got another 03' M5R2 today except this one is for the 4.2, also it came with a little bonus, check out the pictures...
       

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    8. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      BTW I have 10 days to return the other transmission, but there is a 20% restocking fee so I am trying to sell it(for what I bought it for) before I resort to returning it next week. I have it on craigslist, ebay, and a couple F150 forums, but if anyone knows anyone who might need it let me know.
      Thanks.
       
    9. CDW6212R

      CDW6212R Hauls the mail. Elite Explorer

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      Good pictures, I've been wanting to see the 5.0/4.6 bell housings side by side. They are actually close, the starter pocket seems to be the easiest way to tell them apart.
       
    10. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Yeah, before I return it I plan to take a bunch of measurements just for the sake of documenting it and I'll add them to the image (might as well get something for the 20% restocking fee I'll probably end up paying :)). Also I confirmed the rear shaft I got is definitely going to be too long. If I plug it into the t-case it has a range of 65" to 69" from the front of the t-case to the flange where as the current distance from the seam between the back of the 4r70w to the 8.8 flange is only like 61.5" (measure along the t-case and drive shaft).
       
    11. EMG7895

      EMG7895 Well-Known Member

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      are the shifters in the same location on both?
       
    12. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Yep, they look identical except for the bell housing. You can see them better in this picture. These are both 03's though, the shifter location was different prior to 97, like in the second picture I got from ebay.
       

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    13. 410Fortune

      410Fortune ELITE BRONCO2ERER Moderator Emeritus

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      nice came with the 4406 shifter, that is a hard to find part!!

      I see 5 speed exploders in the junk yards here in CO often, not as many as the auto's, but they are out there!!
       
    14. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      I know, as I was negotiating the price on it I was trying to hold back my excitement about it coming with that. I gave up on trying to find one for my 1354 and fabbed one up but it it's never as good as the factory ones so I wasn't looking forward to doing that again.

      Oh really? If I don't find one in the next couple weeks, and if it's not too much of an inconvenience for you (if you are in the yard anyway) I wonder if you could grab one and I'll pay for your trouble and shipping?

      Are people sure the pedal from a first gen explorer won't work? What about pre-98 rangers? Are the firewalls very different?
       

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    15. Spdrcer34

      Spdrcer34 Well-Known Member

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      The firewalls are VERY different...


      The Brake Pedal Hanger Bracket is TOTALLY different, the location of the throttle cable is also totally different.

      Ryan
       
    16. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Just thought I would update... My parts came in from autozone, so now all I need is the clutch pedal(dealer sells for $83 I found out) and a shifter.
       

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    17. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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    18. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      At this point I removed the transfer case, cross member, most of the bell housing bolts, disconnected trans harness and shift linkage, and completely removed the trans cooler and lines.

      In the pic below what do you guys think I should do with the holes in the radiator where the tranny cooler lines went? Should they be plugged or left open?

      Also now I have a perfectly good 4404, front drive shaft, and tranny cooler for sale if anyone wants it.
       

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    19. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Well i made some more progress this weekend.. I got the old tranny and flexplate out, installed a new rear main seal, the new flywheel, and clutch as well as the clutch pedal, master cylinder, and reservoir. Getting the old pedal out and the new pedal in has been the biggest pain in the ass so far. I didn't want to have to remove the whole dash so getting tools up behind there and trying to finagle the pedal assembly in and out around the wires and the brake booster took a decent amount of time.

      Here's the old tranny, flexplate still on, the engine rear, and a comparison of the flexplate and flywheel I got(they are the exact same diameter and number of teeth so i'm pretty sure I'll be able to reuse my starter.
       

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    20. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Here's the old rear main seal being pulled out. I found a trick on a mustang forum where they say to tap a couple drywall screws into and pull it out with channel locks leveraging against the face of the crank.

      Here's the new rear main seal tapped in.

      New flywheel installed and clutch installed, a first for any V8 explorer that I know of!
       

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    21. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Here's the clutch pedal assembly which I ended up buying straight from the dealer for $80 since all the junk yards near me are either closing their u-pick lots apparently or emptying them out. FastPartsNetwork has it for like $66 but there there was like $12 shipping so it wasn't even worth it.

      Then I was having a hell of a time getting the master cylinder into the pedal assembly because I couldn't push it and twist it at the same time so I tried clamping it to hold it in and then twisted it from the engine bay and that helped me get it in.

      Finally the pedals installed... a V8 explorer with a clutch pedal? :p:
       

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    22. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Also I had to drill out the bell housing holes on the M5R2 from 27/64" to 7/16" (1/64" in size difference). The bolts that held the AOD up were too big to fit in the M5R2 holes.

      And lastly I slid the M5R2 underneath to see about where the shifter will come up through and it looks like it might bump into the cup holder area a little bit. I was hoping it would stay right in the area of the pocket below the heat controls, but we'll see. I have to weld up my own shift lever anyway so maybe I'll do some sort of zig-zag thing. Neither an explorer shifter or one off a 92 F150 were right, both fit on the peg but they were both 90 degrees from facing the right way. In other words, as they are the shifters would be jabbing into the passengers leg.
       

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    23. blueka

      blueka Elite Pickler Elite Explorer

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      subscribing


      Si
       
    24. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      oh yeah forgot to mention taking apart that center console was a real pain too, it was like working on my audi it was so bad. There were hidden screws and 10 different layers and pieces, and I still couldn't remove the thing even though I took out every screw I could find. Also my truck has rear air which runs right down the middle of the center console so I have to figure out how to re-route that when I'm all done.
       
    25. CDW6212R

      CDW6212R Hauls the mail. Elite Explorer

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      The console slides out straight back, along the floor. Four bolts hold it in, two in the center and two in the dash. Pull it straight back, there are hooks in the very back.
       
    26. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      haha, i probably had it all unbolted I just wasn't pulling the right way... oh well it should be fun trying to put it back together at the end.
       

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