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98 5.0 AWD Auto to 5spd M5R2 and 4406 M

Discussion in 'Modified 1995-2001 Explorers' started by Nick26, June 30, 2009.

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    1. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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    3. 99SportX

      99SportX Elite Explorer

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      I was going to suggest the range sensor. Once mine was out of adjustment and I couldn't start the truck in park. I had to move the selector to neutral and it allowed it to start there.

      When it happened I instantly thought it was a starter problem but then tried neutral and it worked fine.

      It seems that whenever you do any kind of swap on a late model vehicle it is the electronics that really end up slowing things down.

      You could just diagnose the starter and starter circuit itself. See if the starter solenoid is getting voltage and check grounds.

      When I did my V8 swap I found that the starter terminals were real sensitive and they must be very clean and have good connections. Common sense yes, but when I just hooked them up as is it did not work.

      The PCM programming has nothing to do about if it will crank or not. It will just cut ignition and fuel to keep from starting if there is a problem.

      I looked at the wiring diagram for the AT starter circuit diagram and the DTR sensor is definitely needed or you will have to bypass it or wire in place of that a clutch switch. Try removing it from your auto trans and hooking it up if the wiring is still there. Maybe you were not shorting the correct pins?
       
    4. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Yeah I'm kicking myself now because I gave the old tranny to a shop yesterday and I didn't take the TRS off. After looking more closely at my plug I don't even have a wire hooked up to pin 1 and there's no contact in there, so I tried shorting pins 5 and 8 but that didn't matter. I am going to call the shop Monday to ask if I can swing by and take the sensor off it, I hope they didn't trash it yet. The dealership wants $80 for a new one. I'm going to look more closely at the schematics and see what exactly happens when it's in neutral.
       
    5. Lacky01

      Lacky01 Active Member

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      :popcorn:
       
    6. downhillpat

      downhillpat New Member

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      You need to jump pins 10 and 12 on the DTR connector C112. That will signal neutral position. You may also have a PATS problem...
       
    7. downhillpat

      downhillpat New Member

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      Or maybe it's time to throw out the haynes manual...I have never gotten one piece of completely correct info from one on any truck I've had...But!!! It was right that my 87 takes 6 qts of 5w30....
       
    8. 99SportX

      99SportX Elite Explorer

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      Get a real ford cd off of ebay. They are so helpful. That is what I was looking at before when I posted.

      If you get one for your year (1998 truck) then it will have everything correct down to the wire colors.

      Most likely the wire colors on the DTR for my 99 are the same as your 98 so if you need to know which ones to jumper I can look it up.
       
    9. downhillpat

      downhillpat New Member

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      The colors of the wires would be Tan & Red and Pink.
       
    10. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Yeah I have one actually, I was looking through that before.

      thanks i see that now too... and it worked! I got it started but now it sounds like flywheel may be rubbing up against the block plate because there is a loud kind of scraping metal on metal noise. It's not really affecting the engine because the engine runs fine. It almost sounds like if you took a screw driver and scraped it back and forth on a heat shield or something.
       
    11. rriddle1982

      rriddle1982 New Member

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      itll grind away after a while...lol
       
    12. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      I think I'm having the same problem now... you didn't do anything about it and it eventually cleared? haha... I wish I took more pictures when I had it out, I don't remember what it looked like now.
       
    13. rriddle1982

      rriddle1982 New Member

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      yeah. on mine the flywheel rubbed on a lip on the automatic block plate. it was maybe 3/16 or so. i figured out where it was coming from and just left it running for about 30. mins. i later bent it further back when i had my exhaust done while it was on the lift. on mine it didn't hurt a thing. it sounded baddd tho.
       
    14. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Haha... I'll have to pick a good time to let it do that so i don't drive the neighbors nuts...

      I got the reverse lights working too. I just had to short wires Violet/Orange with Black/Pink with the truck in the on position. I'll post the schematics too.
       

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    15. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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    16. 99SportX

      99SportX Elite Explorer

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      So can you now wire the reverse lights into something on the shifter mechanism or a sensor on the transmission itself?

      Does the clutch mechanism have a switch of sorts that you could wire into the starting system to require the clutch to be depressed for starting?
       
    17. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Yeah this right here is the reverse switch. When I pop it into reverse I get continuity between the 2 pins so that actually works out perfect and I am going to just connect the 2 wires to the plug that I have for it.
       

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    18. Cobraguy

      Cobraguy Well-Known Member

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      Are you absolutely certain you have the disk in the right direction?

      Regardless, do NOT let this go like that. You have a bomb rotating inside that bellhousing. You sure don't want something exploding in there and coming through the floorboards.
       
    19. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Are you talking about the clutch disc or the flywheel? The flywheel has an offset bolt pattern and will only go on one way. I know it's not the clutch disc because I have yet to even release the clutch yet. I still have to bleed it more, that's going to take some time apparently. Also the clutch only fits on 1 way, it would hit the flywheel bolts if it was backwards.

      I'm trying to track down a block plate but not having much luck, I contacted some guy on ebay who sells all kinds of block plates for the 302 but he didn't have one for a 96 F150 302 w/ M5R2 and 164 tooth flywheel. If the noise doesn't go away after letting it idle for a little bit then I will probably try and replace the block plate, which I am not looking forward too. I think I remember now there was a small ripple in the block plate around the crank and I think the counterweight on the flywheel is just scraping it every time it goes around. I plan to mark the backside of the flywheel through the access hole then turn the engine over and see where it is hitting.
       
      Last edited: August 10, 2009
    20. 410Fortune

      410Fortune ELITE BRONCO2ERER Moderator Emeritus

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      if the starter clicked, similar to a dead battery, then I dont think its a PATS or computer issue, I think its a power issue.

      The started gets its ground from teh bellhousing, depending on your year and trans.

      You may just need a ground strap to your starter bolt now?

      Lets rule this out first, check for 12+V at the big starter feed, then check for 12V+ the smal signal wire when somebody else cranks the key

      these starters need a ground some gen II trucks have a wire right to the starter some dont, I would confirm my grounds and check for power at the starter
       
    21. Cobraguy

      Cobraguy Well-Known Member

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      I know Nick...but you would be surprised at the number of disks that get installed backwards...even by experienced techs. But it only happens once to them... :) If you haven't depressed the clutch that probably isn't it.

      Also, make sure it isn't something hitting the fingers on your pressure plate. No use destroying a new plate!

      Shoot...with all you've done and figured out...this will be a piece of cake for you to fix! I have a feeling you are going to love driving this thing.
       
    22. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Oops sorry Jamie, I think you are a little behind... I got the start wiring figured out now. Thanks for the input anyway.
       
    23. 410Fortune

      410Fortune ELITE BRONCO2ERER Moderator Emeritus

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      LOL yes I am behind here, just sounded like the starter is not getting enough power, I have been absent a bit lately, 15 week old baby = wowsers
       
    24. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      no problem, wow congratulations!
       
    25. crazyflights

      crazyflights Elite Explorer

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      Love your swap keep up the good work, im doing 5spd swap on my 97 SOHC 4dr lots of stuff is similar. I got my clutch pedal asembally from 98 Ranger and I have extra for next swap.
       
    26. Nick26

      Nick26 Well-Known Member

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      Thanks, yeah I saw your thread too, very nice... you get your clutch bled yet?
       

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