1. for access to reviews and discussion of the 2016 and 2017 Ford Explorer, Tech Tips, How to Articles, Off-Road Modification, Events, and more!

    Register Today It's free! This box will disappear once registered!

Engine tries to explode after M112

Discussion in 'Modified 1995-2001 Explorers' started by volver, January 14, 2010.

  • Searches ExplorerForum.com
    1. volver

      volver Active Member

      Joined:
      November 27, 2008
      Messages:
      257
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Milan, IL Quad City area
      Year and Model:
      1998 XLT AWD
      SO, yeah, M112 supercharger is installed along with 39# injectors. I cranked the engine with no ignition or fuel until the oil pressure was good. Then I connected the ignition and fuel. It fired up, then tried to rev to 3000 rpm. I got scared and shut it down. Tried to start it 3 times after that, it revs high every time and I shut it down.

      [​IMG]






      [​IMG]






      =[​IMG]
       
    2. Support EF


      Join the Elite Explorers for $20 a year

      Explorer Forum has probably saved you that much already, and will continue to save you money as you learn how to diagnose and fix problems yourself, and learn which modifications work without having to experiment on your own. Elite Explorer members see practically no ads, add your own profile photo, upload photo attachments directly to your posts and Media Gallery, create more private Conversations, and more. Join Today. Your support is greatly appreciated.



      to hide adverts.
    3. explorerguy89

      explorerguy89 Active Member

      Joined:
      November 12, 2009
      Messages:
      977
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      16
      City, State:
      Marlton, NJ
      Year and Model:
      1999 xls and 2000 xlt
      =o that doesnt sound good
       
    4. volver

      volver Active Member

      Joined:
      November 27, 2008
      Messages:
      257
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Milan, IL Quad City area
      Year and Model:
      1998 XLT AWD
      The pictures do not show the the finished product.

      I have reconnected all vacuums, and electrical connectors, EGR and what not.

      I need to make a tube that goes from the EGR elbow to the supercharger. In order to make this tube I have to get to a welder the welder is at my parents house 15 miles away it will not work in my garage. I made a tube out of PVC to temporarily get me to the welder.

      so i need this thing to run half way correctly that way i can make the tube and take it to the dyno.

      i need some ideas on how to get the explorer into closed loop quickly so it can tune its self half way.

      what about getting a vacuum pump to put on the vacuum for the fuel regulator? this would drop the fuel pressure from 100 to 35 psi that might stop the over supply of fuel. And the over reving.
       
    5. volver

      volver Active Member

      Joined:
      November 27, 2008
      Messages:
      257
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Milan, IL Quad City area
      Year and Model:
      1998 XLT AWD
      I have the Bypass on the supercharger zip tied open that way there is no boost.

      their may be a vacuum leak between the plates that adapt the M112 to the 5.0..... but i doubt that. they are on there pretty tight and they have gasket between them. the PVC intake could be leaking also. if there is a leak it is in that part.

      normally if i pull off a vacuum the engine just runs like crap.

      it must just have to much fuel.
       
    6. Justawajz

      Justawajz Active Member

      Joined:
      May 23, 2007
      Messages:
      207
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      16
      City, State:
      Annapolis, Md
      Year and Model:
      02 Mountaineer
      Is you maf setup for the larger injectors...?
       
    7. volver

      volver Active Member

      Joined:
      November 27, 2008
      Messages:
      257
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Milan, IL Quad City area
      Year and Model:
      1998 XLT AWD
      nope
       
    8. Justawajz

      Justawajz Active Member

      Joined:
      May 23, 2007
      Messages:
      207
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      16
      City, State:
      Annapolis, Md
      Year and Model:
      02 Mountaineer
      Well you may just just need to get it re-calibrated for them, also I would imagine you would need a tune to get it running right and adjust your a/f ratio and what not....
       
    9. volver

      volver Active Member

      Joined:
      November 27, 2008
      Messages:
      257
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Milan, IL Quad City area
      Year and Model:
      1998 XLT AWD
      I understand that a tune is going to be required. I am looking for a way to tune it without taking the truck to the dyno. Maybe get the dyno to come to me. lol


      I cant pay the 100+ dollars its going to cost to haul the truck to the nearest dyno.


      I know the ECM will tune the engine to run correctly. That way I could drive somewhere and get a tune. I just need to stop the over revving at start up, get the truck warmed up and in closed loop.

      any ideas?
       
    10. LilRoush

      LilRoush New Member

      Joined:
      November 17, 2006
      Messages:
      29
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      South FL
      Year and Model:
      '01 Sport
      You need your MAF to match your injectors. That is where I'd look first.
      After that, sounds like a vac leak somewhere.

      You're probably also seeing some belt slip - if what is in the pic is your current belt wrap.
       
      Last edited: January 15, 2010
    11. slammed98z

      slammed98z Active Member

      Joined:
      January 20, 2009
      Messages:
      176
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Branson West, Missouri 65737
      Year and Model:
      1996 Explorer 2DR
      The truck must have a vaccume leak for it to be reving to 3000 rpm. Grab a spray bottle with some water and a dab or two of soap and start it up and spray everything intake related until you find a leak. could be a IAC problem also.
       
    12. 2000StreetRod

      2000StreetRod Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      May 26, 2009
      Messages:
      10,009
      Likes Received:
      8
      Trophy Points:
      68
      City, State:
      Greenville, SC
      Year and Model:
      00 Sport FI,03 Limited V8
      Stock MAF sensor?

      Are you still using the stock MAF sensor? If so, it should be accurate to 500 cfm. The problem is not with the MAF sensor reading the airflow correctly.

      The problem is probably a combination of an intake leak and larger flow fuel injectors. If you didn't have a leak then the mixture would probably be so rich with the high flow injectors that the engine wouldn't run.

      Do you have the return fuel system or the returnless? If its the returnless then your fuel pressure regulator is in the fuel tank and playing with the vacuum will have very little (if any) affect. If you have the return system, then maximum fuel pressure occurs at no vacuum. Your vacuum should be high at idle which means lower fuel pressure. I doubt that you can pull and hold a higher than idle vacuum long enough to drive to the dyno.

      The PCM enriches the mixture based on engine coolant temperature (ECT). For a cold start my A/F is about 12:1. It then increases as the engine warms achieving 14.7 when the PCM switches from open to closed loop. Even in closed loop the short and long term fuel trim will not be able to compensate for the high flow injectors. Their limits will be exceeded. You can reduce the cold start enrichment by making the PCM think the engine is already warm. Disconnect the ECT electrical connector and insert a 1K or 2K ohm resistor from the connector to ground. That will make the PCM think the engine temperature is more than 200 degrees F. However, as the engine actually warms up the mixture will become excessively rich.

      Find the intake leak first. I doubt even a very rich mixture will result in the engine turning more than 3000 rpm unless there is air getting to it.
       
    13. gijoecam

      gijoecam Village Idiot Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      May 31, 1999
      Messages:
      8,360
      Likes Received:
      1
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Trenton, MI
      Year and Model:
      98 ExSport, '00 F-150
      Wait a second... If you started the motor as it sat there in the pictures, I can see the problem at a glance: There's no intake connected to the supercharger. Doesn't that mean the engine is essentially running at WOT? That can't be good...

      Assuming you have an intake connected to it, I'm leaning towards an un-metered airflow. It's not too much fuel as that will cause it to bog, not rev. What are you using for an intake/throttle body?
       
    14. LilRoush

      LilRoush New Member

      Joined:
      November 17, 2006
      Messages:
      29
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      South FL
      Year and Model:
      '01 Sport
      TPS might be another thing to look at if you are using the Lightning TB and related sensors. When I did the M112 set up on my V6, I had to switch the TPS so the car was getting the right reading from it.
       
    15. BobWiersema

      BobWiersema Well-Known Member

      Joined:
      November 5, 2008
      Messages:
      1,291
      Likes Received:
      1
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Chicago Burbs, Illinois
      Year and Model:
      98 xlt 4.0L SOHC 4x4
      Nice looking blower :D

      I hope you get the bugs worked out quickly. I know you didn't start it without a throttle body, that picture must have been taken before you finished.

      Also, I don't know much about a major mod like that but don't you need some kind of performance chip for forced induction and the larger injectors?

      I saw this one at Blueovalchips but there are probably more cost effective ones out there.

      http://www.blueovalchips.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=2

      Good luck, post more pictures of the finished job when you get a chance. Video would be cool too.
       
    16. LilRoush

      LilRoush New Member

      Joined:
      November 17, 2006
      Messages:
      29
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      South FL
      Year and Model:
      '01 Sport
      The more I'm thinking about this, the more I'd be interested in seeing your vac line set up. I know it was the big bug I faced when M112ing my project a few years back.
       
    17. Dan Whitaker

      Dan Whitaker One fast putty tat Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      December 24, 2001
      Messages:
      7,055
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      46
      City, State:
      Raytown MO (Kansas City suburb)
      Year and Model:
      No Mounty no more.
      What is your intake made from?

      It sure looks like MDF.
       
    18. LilRoush

      LilRoush New Member

      Joined:
      November 17, 2006
      Messages:
      29
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      South FL
      Year and Model:
      '01 Sport
      Looks like 1/4" 6061 or 5052 if I had to guess.
       
    19. cybergasm

      cybergasm B

      Joined:
      January 8, 2006
      Messages:
      6,495
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Humboldt Ks
      Year and Model:
      1997 Mountaineer 5.0
      X2 i believe that wood under yonder
       
    20. shadowless127

      shadowless127 Well-Known Member

      Joined:
      December 13, 2007
      Messages:
      2,724
      Likes Received:
      5
      Trophy Points:
      48
      City, State:
      Long Island, NY
      Year and Model:
      '01 EB AWD 5.0
      You are my hero. I want to supercharge the mounty so bad.
       
    21. volver

      volver Active Member

      Joined:
      November 27, 2008
      Messages:
      257
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Milan, IL Quad City area
      Year and Model:
      1998 XLT AWD
      I took off the GT-40 intake, drew the hole pattern on AutoCAD, drew the hole pattern of the supercharger, designed a way for the adapter to rise above the fuel regulator but stay below the edge of the fire wall.

      I nested the 8 lower plates and the 4 upper plates, and took the drawing to the laser cutter in town. Had them cut the plates out of half inch steel. I wanted to water jet cut them out of aluminum to save weight but the cost was going to be more than double.

      I turned the EGR elbow 90 degrees so it points up. I used brass pipe from Lowes and adapted the EGR tube. Relocated EGR solenoid and sensor. the TB is in the stock location it still connects to the coil which is in the stock location.

      The fuel injectors came from a 2002 Mustang Cobra. The connectors were different so I cut some connectors off of a Dodge ram in the junk yard.

      This thing is becoming a Frankenstein beast. Its got a lot of random parts form different cars. There is a lot of Lowes merchandise and what not strung about.
       
    22. volver

      volver Active Member

      Joined:
      November 27, 2008
      Messages:
      257
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Milan, IL Quad City area
      Year and Model:
      1998 XLT AWD
      [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Found a massive vacuum leak. The crap plastic intake flexed after it was installed. There is about a 1/4 by 5 inch hole now. I couldn't see it last night when I tried to start. have to fill it in with something or brace the top side. That way i can get to a welder to make a proper intake tube.[/FONT]



      [​IMG]


      [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Flexed were the intake meets the SC, mostly on the back side.[/FONT]



      [​IMG]





      [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]WOW this is ghetto. Cant wait to replace this tube.[/FONT]

      [​IMG]




      [FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Hear are the vacuum lines. The top side of the Bypass Solenoid goes to vacuum side of the intake. The vacuum pulls the bypass open. The bottom side goes to the boost side of the supercharger. That way if you flooring it and make boost when you lift off the throttle the bypass will snap open to relive the boost.[/FONT]
       
    23. LilRoush

      LilRoush New Member

      Joined:
      November 17, 2006
      Messages:
      29
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      South FL
      Year and Model:
      '01 Sport
      Couple of suggestions from someone who has done this:

      Make your adaptor out of aluminum instead of steel. It will stay flush and seal up better for you. I made mine out of 1/4" 6061. It's more of a box, so the airflow is improved.

      And as you are finding out, that PVC inlet tubewon't last more than a few seconds, you'll need to find the Lightning plenum or make an aluminum tube/flange for that as well.

      Were are you tapping in to get 'boost' readings? I see how you tapped in the vac lines.
       
    24. XLRVIII

      XLRVIII Active Member

      Joined:
      June 10, 2003
      Messages:
      187
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      South of Houston, Texas
      Year and Model:
      1995 Lincoln Mark VIII
      the pcm will not "tune itself"..that is ludicrous

      dyno time or some expensive hardware and software will be needed.
      either of which will smoke several of those 100.00 bills you dont have

      if 100.00 is hindering you at this point, this is gonna be a huge eye opener for you.

      p.s. you're pretty famous over on tccoa.com

      epic
      http://forums.tccoa.com/showthread.php?t=126842
       
    25. JDraper

      JDraper Somewhat Functional Moderator Emeritus

      Joined:
      January 11, 2001
      Messages:
      15,330
      Likes Received:
      1
      Trophy Points:
      58
      City, State:
      McVeytown, PA
      Year and Model:
      '11 XLT
      To be honest, I think you need to stop right where you are and do a LOT of research on what you are doing before you destroy something. With what you have posted, and what you have rigged together there, it's a disaster waiting to happen.
       
    26. Turdle

      Turdle Step-buddy Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      June 16, 2003
      Messages:
      27,013
      Likes Received:
      49
      Trophy Points:
      68
      City, State:
      Humboldt, KS
      Year and Model:
      2000 Mounty
      You need to send me that blower and I'll hook it up right.

      There are to many things wrong with this " setup" to even begin a diagnosis.
       

    Share This Page








    We Support Our Troops!