Replacing Jackshaft & Left cam cassette tensioners...and more?

[skloczko]

Oh boy

Now can this problem be solved by using the timing kit that locks the crankshaft and the cam in place?

 

[2000StreetRod]

chain guide assembly bolt torque

The specified torque for the timing chain cassette bolt is 89 to 123 inch-lbs. It should not be difficult to get loose and the torque is probably not critical. As long as you don't loosen any of the sprocket bolts you will not have to retime the camshafts. Removing the upper tensioner will allow more slack in the chain but I doubt it will be enough to get the old guide assembly out and the new one in. I think you will have to remove the camshaft sprocket to replace the guide assembly. Do you have access to the camshaft timing tool set (OTC 6488)?

 

[skloczko]

Thanks again!

I dont have access to one of those tools that I know of, I have to ask around...

I think my plan will be to do as much as possible while removing as little as possible. Even if it means 1/8th of a turn at a time on that bolt. It looks like if I can take out the bolt holding the cassette, and the one that goes through the head cover, I can possibly slide the old cassette pieces down and the new ones up in the cover?

The only one that makes me real nervous is that balance shaft tensioner, hopefully once I raise the engine a tad to remove the oil pan I'll be able to get a better look at how to approach it...

 

[2000StreetRod]

jackshaft sprocket hole

I believe that to remove the guide assembly you will have to position the large jackshaft sprocket with one of the holes in it aligned with the guide assembly lower bolt head. Once the bolt is unscrewed you'll have to work it into the sprocket hole to release it from the guide assembly.

I seriously doubt that you can replace the guide assembly without removing the camshaft sprocket. There is a projection (nub) at the head casting larger opening that will block the insertion of the new assembly. The guide assembly is too thick to pass between the head casting and the camshaft sprocket bolt.

As long as you don't loosen the jackshaft sprocket bolt you won't have to retime the right camshaft. It is possible to time the camshafts without the tool set but the results may not be exact. Other members have done it and I plan to attempt it.

 

[gold984by4]

Thanks again!

I dont have access to one of those tools that I know of, I have to ask around...

I think my plan will be to do as much as possible while removing as little as possible. Even if it means 1/8th of a turn at a time on that bolt. It looks like if I can take out the bolt holding the cassette, and the one that goes through the head cover, I can possibly slide the old cassette pieces down and the new ones up in the cover?

The only one that makes me real nervous is that balance shaft tensioner, hopefully once I raise the engine a tad to remove the oil pan I'll be able to get a better look at how to approach it...

Good day,

Okay, a few key points... You should always use the tools that hold the cam in place... I say this cause I get a lot of grief from those that believe it is a must to do this job. I did not use the tools to hold the cams in place... Since the tensioner was shot, there was a little bit of slack in the chain... I rotated the crank until the left cam found a happy point in the rotation... where it didn't have any pressure on it in either direction... I marked the cam, chain, and sprocket to make sure they would all go back in the same location... Check the pics on my post how I did this... I found this a must because I could not get the busted cassette out without removing the cam sprocket... So, you must take great care when removing the sprocket not to drop it - but that is what the marks are for... remove the bolts holding the cassette in, losen and remove the cam sprocket bolt, get your handy grabber tool to pull the cassette out, slide the sprocket off the cam, remove cassette, return sprocket to cam... drink a beer... kiss the wife... rest... then reverse all that with the new cassette... Line up the marks, tighten the sprocket... then move to the pan for the next one... You will have to clean the pan once you get it off... And the pick-up tube screen... I'd also replace the bolts that I noted in my write-up... Those torx heads are just wrong for this location... IMHO anyway...

Good luck and I hope this helps!!

Cheers!!!

 

[skloczko]

Ok.....problem, I kind of expected this actually. When I removed the bolt from the camshaft I had some movement. I couldnt keep it stationary like in Gold984's posts... I know the cam sprocket moved. How can I check/adjust timing? Should it be finding TDC on the 1st piston and adjusting the cam accordingly? Any tips on how to go about this?

PS. Anyone doing what I did this whole post.....get the timing kit for $150-170!!!!

 

[janolsson]

Got some bad news for you.
If the balance shaft tensioner is shot then this requires the upper sump to be removed. This would then require the engine to be raised and or axle dropped to get it out of the way. You then have to line up the upper sump with the rear engine face within a close tolerance as the transmission bolts upto it. Very difficult and if you don't get it right it pi***s oil every where when it breaks the seal. Ask me how i know!!!

Do yourself a favour and pull the motor, put it on a stand and get/borrow the otc6488 tool set.
With the balancer pulley back on there is a tool to lock at TDC you can then align the cams, they have slots that should be parallel to head face at TDC.
Regards
Regards

 

[2000StreetRod]

Jackshaft sprocket bolt

Were you able to remove the left cassette lower mouting bolt without removing the jackshaft sprocket bolt? If so, then you will only have to retime the left camshaft.

Was the crankshaft on the compression stroke and at TDC when you loosened the camshaft bolt?

Have you replaced the jackshaft chain tensioner and guide if you're going to? If so, were you able to do it without loosening the jackshaft sprocket bolt?

I advise you to avoid rotating the crankshaft from TDC with the camshaft sprocket disconnected. You don't want the pistons to contact the valves.

It is possible to retime the camshaft without the tool set. Other members have successfully done it. First finish replacing the components.

 

[skloczko]

Were you able to remove the left cassette lower mouting bolt without removing the jackshaft sprocket bolt? If so, then you will only have to retime the left camshaft.

Was the crankshaft on the compression stroke and at TDC when you loosened the camshaft bolt?

Have you replaced the jackshaft chain tensioner and guide if you're going to? If so, were you able to do it without loosening the jackshaft sprocket bolt?

I advise you to avoid rotating the crankshaft from TDC with the camshaft sprocket disconnected. You don't want the pistons to contact the valves.

It is possible to retime the camshaft without the tool set. Other members have successfully done it. First finish replacing the components.

I was able to replace the cam tensioner without loosening or removing the lower sprocket. Same with the jackshaft tensioner. I had the tension taken up with zip ties on all the chains so nothing else slipped. The cam moved when I was removing the bolt from the cam (Im thinking about 1/8th of a turn at least).

I was at TDC before doing that, but I stupidly tested by hand to make sure the engine would crank over through a few cycles before I put covers back on. So....after putting the cam sprocket back on (undoubtedly in the wrong position slightly), I cranked by hand to make sure I could do that without a problem.

My idea was to reposition the 1st piston back at TDC, and adjust cam accordingly.... Sound like a good way to approach it?

 

[2000StreetRod]

everything's replaced

So you have replaced everything that you planned to and the front timing cover has been installed. Apparently you never removed the right valve cover so you can't use the right camshaft to determine compression stroke for #1 cylinder. If you're confident the left camshaft is only 1/8th of a turn off then you can look for the camshaft position sensor (CPS) to tell you if #1 is in compression when the crankshaft is at TDC. When you feel pressure in the #1 spark plug hole as the crank approaches TDC, the protusion on the left camshaft should be on the upper side of the camshaft where the CPS would detect it.
The correct orientation of the camshaft protusion is shown in photo below by shelbygt:

Once you have confirmed that then you need to concentrate on the timing slot on the rear of the camshaft. The notch must be exactly parallel to the face of the head that mates with the valve cover as shown in the photo below by shelbygt:

I plan to lay a straight edge on the head and then measure the distance from each side of the notch with a caliper. It will be more difficult for you since the engine is still in the vehicle and the firewall will limit your access/visibility.

Even when you get it perfectly set, you have to find a way to tighten the camshaft sprocket bolt without the camshaft and the crankshaft moving. One member removed two camshaft bearing caps, inserted some leather strips and then tightened the caps back down against the leather. Another member cut some strips from a plastic soda bottle and tightened them under two of the camshaft bearing caps. If you use the camshaft bearing cap method, the sheet material inserted must be hard enough to hold the camshaft from turning but soft enough not to damage the bearing surface. Make sure the tensioner is fully inserted before tightening the camshaft sprocket bolt. Also, it's best if you can make sure the traction side of the chain is taught when you tighten the camshaft sprocket bolt. That's why you need to keep the crankshaft from rotating.

 

[skloczko]

You are the man.

 

[skloczko]

Ok, mistake on my end. What I was calling #1 is actually #4 (the front piston on the drivers side....the one that the front left cassette/sprocket/chain is closest to). This might change things a little bit. The left cam is the one that I need to reposition...

According to haynes manual, I can find TDC for #1, count 1/3 turn (12 teeth) on the crankshaft pulley, and that mark should be TDC for #4. Once I get there, I'll need to figure out the correct position of the cam.

Ughhhhhhh. 150$ coulda saved me a lot of trouble....

 

[2000StreetRod]

#1 must be at TDC

All of the camshaft timing (both banks) is done with #1 piston (front cylinder on passenger side) at TDC on the compression stroke.

 

[skloczko]

<<<<<The photos are of the left (driver side) bank. The left and right camshafts are different. Only the left camshaft has the CPS protrusion. The photo shows the correct orientation for the left camshaft when the #1 piston is at top dead center on the compression stroke. If you had the right valve cover off you would see that the camshaft lobes would not be depressing the #1 cylinder valve stems and the notches would be parallel to the head surface and the notch offset would be above the axis of the cam.>>>>>

Is it necessary to remove the right side valve cover? Or can I use the crankshaft pulley to position the engine at #1 TDC and then adjust the left side cam as instructed above?

Thanks again for your help, I've been checking out your other thread as well

 

[2000StreetRod]

Use the balancer TDC mark

. . .
Is it necessary to remove the right side valve cover? Or can I use the crankshaft pulley to position the engine at #1 TDC and then adjust the left side cam as instructed above?
. . .

Using the balancer TDC mark should be fine.

 

[skloczko]

I'm going to give this a go tonight after work, Ill update as to how I make out.

Thank you!

 

[2000StreetRod]

Offset correction

I pulled my valve covers off today to confirm what I told you earlier. I found that the larger part of the camshaft end that has the notch should be above the camshaft axis and not below. The photo above is correct showing the slot/notch below the centerline of the camshaft. Make certain the #1 piston is at TDC and on the compression stroke.

 

[skloczko]

Can anyone confirm or comment on this post:http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=219858

I had experienced a similar problem before I realized the cam was out of time. (This is how I actually figured it out...except mine was about 1/8-1/5 out of phase)

Is this a "interference" engine?

Also....the hydraulic tensioner on the cam chain....how much pressure should it take to compress the little piston? I can put mine between my thumb and one other finger and compress....is this wrong?


Thanks

 

[2000StreetRod]

Cam timing error

Can anyone confirm or comment on this post:http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=219858

I read somewhere that the original Ford instructions could be misinterpreted and engines were destroyed because of it. More recently a couple of members have made the same mistake and timed the cams out of sync with each other.

I have the Ford instructions that came with the updated primary timing chain kit. It states:

"CAUTION: IT IS IMPORTANT THAT THE SPECIAL TOOLS BE INSTALLED CORRECTLY. THE ENGINE CAN RUN BADLY, WITH ONE CAMSHAFT OFF BY 180 DEGREES."

I have read thru the instructions and there is no statement to rotate the engine after timing the right camshaft before timing the left camshaft.

. . . Is this a "interference" engine?

Yes. However, members that timed their cams out of sync did not report any problems after correcting the error.

Also....the hydraulic tensioner on the cam chain....how much pressure should it take to compress the little piston? I can put mine between my thumb and one other finger and compress....is this wrong?
Thanks

I had the same concern when I installed my 00M12 kit. I was hoping that the spring pressure of the new tensioner would be a lot greater than the old one - but it wasn't. Remember that the spring pressure is only important at engine startup until the oil pressure builds.

 

[McSlug]

At TDC on #1 the cam lobes should be facing down on #5 and the CPS facing up. If you only slipped a little bit then just loosen the cam sprocket, turn the cam back and line up the flat surface next to the CPS nub so its level, on the same gradient as the head. You should not need to do the right side.
I would, however remove the right side valve cover to inspect the rear guide.You don't want to put it together and then find out.

I put a thin piece of plastic under one of the cam caps and tightened it up enough to be able to turn the cam by hand, but so it wouldn't turn under spring pressure. Then tightened it right up and tightened the cam sprocket.

Did you get that bolt from behind the jackshaft? I couldn't without removing the sprocket. I removed the jackshaft guide to get more leverage but the chain jumped on the crank due to valve spring pressure on the right side cam. So I had to retime both cams. Which I did with my eye and my piece of plastic.
500klm's of smooth driving and no management light.