The controversial question of when to change the fluid in the 5R55E automatic trans

[aldive]

What's a reasonable price to pay a shop to do a complete flush and fill of a transmission ??

Why pay anyone? You can do it yourself in your driveway/garage in about 20 minutes. All it will cost is the price of the 15-16 quarts of ATF.

 

[davidmmm69]

A complete flush takes about 20 minutes and there is no mess whatsoever.

I can't imagine paying someone to do it.

Good luck ....

i knew i seen that somewhere before...lol

 

[davidmmm69]

pumping 16 quarts of nasty Transmission fluid has to be somewhat messy...
unless you have the biggest drain pan known to man.lol

 

[aldive]

pumping 16 quarts of nasty Transmission fluid has to be somewhat messy...
unless you have the biggest drain pan known to man.lol

No mess whatsoever; a 5 gal bucket.

 

[davidmmm69]

still a nasty job.. would rather pay someone a small fee to do it and let them get all nasty with that fluid...

 

[aldive]

still a nasty job.. would rather pay someone a small fee to do it and let them get all nasty with that fluid...

It could be done in a white suit. Not a single drop of fluid is spilled; no mess.

Anyway, I do not want someone else doing anything to my truck that I can do.

 

[mynameisaric]

Aldive: how about you explain this.. or give us a link to how to do this. i'm severely interested because i got my truck at 99,800 and i dont think the previous owner ever flushed or waxed the car, but i'm confident on the oil changes considering its in great mechanical condition. but i'm at 125k and i want to flush it since i wheel it. and have you done a transfer case flush? or do they not need oil(i cant imagine why they wouldnt need it). this would be much appreciated!
Thanks
-Aric

 

[aldive]

Aldive: how about you explain this.. or give us a link to how to do this. i'm severely interested because i got my truck at 99,800 and i dont think the previous owner ever flushed or waxed the car, but i'm confident on the oil changes considering its in great mechanical condition. but i'm at 125k and i want to flush it since i wheel it. and have you done a transfer case flush? or do they not need oil(i cant imagine why they wouldnt need it). this would be much appreciated!
Thanks
-Aric

Here it is ....

I disconnect the "to transmission" hose from my remote filter housing ( or if you do not have a remote filter, from the radiator ). I plugged and clamped the disconnected line and added and hose clamped a 6 ft length of 3/8” fuel line to the housing. The other end went into a calibrated 1 gallon water jug ( now I run the hose to a 5 gallon bucket).

The truck was run at idle in Park while 1 quart is pumped out. Stop the truck and add back 1 quart of new ATF. After you feel comfortable, you can do this continuously.

I used 15 quarts of Amsoil ATF.

After the flush/fill was completed, I added a new Amsoil filter to the housing and reattached the hoses.

The procedure takes my son and I about 15 minutes to complete. There was no mess since we were well prepared for the flush; nary a drop was spilled.

Hope it hekps ....

 

[mynameisaric]

alright, thanks alot!

 

[davidmmm69]

Here it is ....

I disconnect the "to transmission" hose from my remote filter housing ( or if you do not have a remote filter, from the radiator )
QUOTE]

I HAVEDISCONNECTED one line once from the radiator and it made a huge mess.
How can that not make a mess???
you will surely get a bunch well maybe not a gallon but a good size puddle by disconnecting the line from the radiator....


and they do recommend changing transfer case fluid..
they did that at the same time my transmission was flushed at the dealer and also changed axle fluid

 

[CDW6212R]

Do change the transfer case fluid more often than the trans. I was told by a Ford Shop Foreman that that fluid is worked harder than automatic transmission fluid. Good luck,

 

[FL Oil Guy]

The hydraulic fluid used in automatic transmissions is a very specialized fluid because it is required to do a lot more than just lubricate. It is subjected to very severe service and is one of the most complex fluids used in an automotive system. The primary functions of an automatic transmission fluid (ATF) are:

To transfer power from the engine to the driveline via the torque converter.
To absorb and transmit heat from the torque converter to the cooler located in the front of the vehicle and to act as a clutch pack friction element coolant. It must absorb and dissipate the heat energy dissipated by a clutch or band engagement.
To transmit hydraulic pressure through a complex hydraulic control system which uses valves, servos, pumps, clutch cylinders and fluid lines and passages.
To act as a lubricant and coolant for the planetary gears, bearings, servos, clutches and bushings.
An ATF can be subject to extremely high temperatures during engagement of clutch plates and this must be absorbed and dissipated effectively. If the transmission fluid cannot withstand the heat it will oxidize and can result in destroyed friction materials, sticking valves and servos and plugged passages and filters. An ATF must also have high resistance to varnish and sludge build-up that results from high heat generated in the torque converter. It must also reduce wear and corrosion, prevent foaming and act as a sealant and control the quality (shift feel) of the clutch and band engagement. It must be fully compatible with the materials used in within the transmission such as seal materials and friction plates. An ATF must also be able to maintain a stable viscosity throughout a wide range of operating conditions and temperatures. At low temperatures it must be “thin” enough to be able to flow for proper cold weather shifting but not so “thin” that it cannot effectively operate the pumps, pistons and servos in order to maintain proper hydraulic pressures at high operating temperatures.

This is a simplified overview intended to demonstrate the complexity required of an automatic transmission fluid. It is not my intention to cover the intricacies of how an automatic transmission functions or the specific details of base stocks chemicals and additives engineered into an ATF.

There are three main types of ATF in use today for cars and light trucks: The GM Dexron II and III, Ford Mercon and Mercon V and Chrysler ATF+ thru ATF+4. There are some other automotive manufacturers, such as specific newer models and years of Honda vehicles, which have their own ATF that is specified to be used, although they do state that in a situation where Honda fluid is not available that GM Dexron III is acceptable for short term use only. Most other automotive manufacturers accept fluids that fall into one of the three main categories above and perform extensive testing to ensure that the fluids are fully compatible with their transmission designs. There is also an Allison C-3 and C-4 and a Caterpillar TO-2, TO-3 and TO-4 fluid, which are commonly used in heavy truck and heavy diesel off road equipment.

Most common petroleum ATF’s are specified to be changed at approximately 15,000 to 30,000 mile intervals. Many automotive manufacturers have recognized the need for superior transmission fluids that can withstand severe operating conditions for longer periods of time and now there are some manufacturers that specify 50,000 mile changes or even 100,000 mile changes under normal operating conditions. Towing heavy trailers, hauling heavy loads, stop and go driving and/or other severe operating conditions can significantly reduce these recommend normal service intervals. These extended drain interval specified fluids are either a synthetic or a semi-synthetic blend. The automatic transmissions on passenger cars and light trucks are typically one of the most neglected service items. The extended drain intervals specified on many newer vehicles are the manufacturers response to address these issues, however I must stress again that these recommended extended service intervals are for normal operating conditions.

The semi-synthetic blends are typically a petroleum ATF with 10-20% PAO’s added to the fluid. The PAO’s lowers the temperature at which the fluid forms a wax gel but the other advantages that accompany the small amount of PAO such as improved oxidation resistance or flash points are small or negligible.

I have also seen some newer vehicles that have no ATF filler tube. At 100,000 miles (based on normal service conditions) the vehicle is supposed to be taken into the dealership and have the fluid pumped out using a special fluid exchange machine. The machine will pump all the old ATF out and pump the new fluid in with an efficiency in the 98-99+% range, meaning these machines are highly effective in getting the old fluid out and the new fluid in. I also recommend these machines for anyone that is changing their fluid from a petroleum ATF to a premium quality synthetic ATF. The cost to pay to have this service performed is very nominal and will save you a lot of time and headaches than if you try to do the job yourself. You cannot get enough fluid out by simply doing a pan drain and refill. You’ll still have a lot of old fluid in the torque converter, valve body, pumps, lines and cooler. Just make sure you take it to a reputable and qualified service center and that the premium quality synthetic you bring them actually is put in the vehicle.

Also, it is a good idea to have a new filter installed at this time so you know exactly when it was changed. Normally, ATF filters do not need changing very often. I personally install the new filter when I install the synthetic ATF and then I will not change again it unless something in the oil analysis test results indicate it is necessary to change the filter or the fluid. I also install remote ATF fluid filters under-hood on my vehicles, which adds an increased measure of filtration protection as well as makes it very quick and easy to service the filter.

I highly recommend using a premium quality synthetic ATF vs. a petroleum ATF or a semi-synthetic blend. The benefits of using a premium quality synthetic lubricant include significantly lower operating temperatures. Heat is the killer of automatic transmissions. I have measured these differences with transmissions that have been instrumented with thermocouples and specialized recording equipment, however it is also dependent on the vehicle operating and load conditions. A premium quality synthetic ATF will also provide exceptional resistance to oxidation and thermal degradation and maintain a very stable high temperature viscosity. Low temperature performance is excellent as well as significantly improved anti-wear performance along with extended drain intervals in the range of three times longer than petroleum oil under severe service conditions or up to approximately five times longer under normal operating conditions. As previously stated with engine oils I also recommend performing periodic oil analysis testing on your synthetic ATF in order to get an accurate reading of how well it is performing and when it may need to be changed.

As I have previously mentioned and will explain again due to its importance is that synthetic ATF is not more “slippery” than petroleum ATF. The base fluids, whether or not petroleum oil or synthetic oil, play no direct role in the relative friction levels of wet clutches. The friction-modifying additives developed for petroleum oils work just as expected in synthetic PAO fluids. The longer the fluid resists oxidation, the longer the original frictional properties remain. The superior oxidative stability demonstrated for synthetic ATF’s thereby leads to extended retention of frictional properties.

 

[Katmandu]

The hydraulic fluid used in automatic transmissions is a very specialized fluid because it is required to do a lot more than just lubricate. It is subjected to very severe service and is one of the most complex fluids used in an automotive system. The primary functions of an automatic transmission fluid (ATF) are:

That is the most comprehensive detailed articles I've ever read on ATF! Great work!

Now, how often do YOU change out your ATF ?? What method do you use and what type/brand ATF do you use ??

 

[davidmmm69]

HEHE where did you get that info.. I would like to see the web site.

 

[FL Oil Guy]

I have most of that info on my website. My business partner wrote that article. Out of respect for the owner of this website I try not to advertise on here because they have sponsors that bring in money to support this site. If you have any questions feel free to email myself or visit my site in my profile. I try to supply info only that will help out other indvidules with lubrication questions.

 

[davidmmm69]

ok thanks

 

[Runnin'OnEmpty]

FlOilGuy, lots of great info in that post.

I believe this was a typo:

The PAO’s lowers the temperature at which the fluid forms a wax gel

Shouldn't it have read 'raises'?.......PAO's RAISES the temperature at which the fluid forms a wax gel.......

 

[GR8REVIL]

Preventative Maintenance

By Mitchell standards (derived from OE) the 2nd generation explorer requires a COMPLETE transmission fluid flush using a specialized transmission flush machine every 21,000 (severe service - most cars) - 30,000 (standard) miles, replacing all fluid in the process, even torque converter. Filter replacement is not necessary at these intervels, and provides no further protection. We recommend changing the filter every 60,000 miles.

change these fluids every 30,000 miles:
Front Differential
Rear Differential
Transfer Case Fluid
Auto Transmission Fluid
or Manual Transmission Fluid
Brake Fluid
Power-steering Fluid

Estimated Costs for 30,000 mile service $550.00 professionally done
Little maintenance for Long service life

Mike's Auto Repair
ASE Certified Parts Specialist
Service Manager
GR8REVIL

 

[purevenom1]

I have around 240,000 miles on mine. Bought it w. 174,000 and didnt have any records of it being serviced but thought it did since it was very clean inside and out. After a couple of oil changes on the engine I noticed some bolts were loose on the mounts. Possible trans was repalced but couldnt find any records. Just started getting the O/D light to blink once awhile ago and some slippage when getting on or off of the freeway when it needs to shift from overdrive but thats it. I am w/ some of the others heard the ole' saying if you havent changed it and you do then it prob will quit. I am also w/ changing it every time it needs it but just hate to do it now and then it quits on me and my wife dont have anything to drive. Any thoughts

 

[J.Rovirosa]

My parents have 156K on their '03 and no trans. problems ever. The first few times we had the trans. flushed at around 20-40K mile intervals, but given the bad luck I've had with flushes on my '95, I decided to just drain/replace the filter in the '03 the last time.

Seems like a lot of these boxes are hit-or-miss.