for access to Reviews and Discussion of the 2016 and 2017 Ford Explorer Tech Tips, How to Articles, Off-Road Modification, Events, and more!

Register Today It's free! This box will disappear once registered!

torque converter install problems

Discussion in 'Explorer & Ranger Transmissions, Transfer Cases, &' started by daves97sport, March 22, 2010.

  • Searches ExplorerForum.com
    1. daves97sport

      daves97sport Member

      Joined:
      October 11, 2004
      Messages:
      69
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Tarentum, PA
      Year and Model:
      '97 Sport 5spd 4.0 OHV
      '97 Exp 4.0SOHC, 5R55e
      Doing an engine swap - old motor was froze so converter was pulled with engine. Trying to install converter on the shaft and will not go in the last inch or so - measured 1-5/8" from engine to end of flex plate, and just over 1 inch from bell housing to TC pads...
      Read some threads on "wiggling" but just isn't going on.
      Is there something I'm missing here? Could the pump have become mis-aligned?
      Using a probe rod, I can feel where the notches are (near 3 & 9:00 )that should match up with the end of the TC
      Is there any reason that the rear wheels should be off the ground? The outer shaft is not turning during install tries.
       
    2. Support EF


      Join the Elite Explorers for $20 a year

      Explorer Forum has probably saved you that much already, and will continue to save you money as you learn how to diagnose and fix problems yourself, and learn which modifications work without having to experiment on your own. Elite Explorer members see practically no ads, add your own profile photo, upload photo attachments directly to your posts and Media Gallery, create more private Conversations, and more. Join Today. Your support is greatly appreciated.



      to hide adverts.
    3. daves97sport

      daves97sport Member

      Joined:
      October 11, 2004
      Messages:
      69
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Tarentum, PA
      Year and Model:
      '97 Sport 5spd 4.0 OHV
      Just to add, the TC, flexplate, and spacer are all from existing vehicle.
      2 days of trying to install engine and only made it to the pins just to the edge of the bellhousing.
      Need to get this done and out of borrowed garage - any help or ideas appreciated.
       
    4. gmanpaint

      gmanpaint Torsion Bar Free Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      August 1, 2008
      Messages:
      8,294
      Likes Received:
      13
      Trophy Points:
      58
      City, State:
      STL MO
      Year and Model:
      94 XLT-95 FX4
      Are the T/C bolts tight or loose?

      Getting the engine angle just right is the hard part. Try to get the trans at an angle that helps the engine lined up better. Remove both drive shafts, and loosen the trans mount. use a ratchet strap on the tail housing (or something similar) to lower the rear, thus raising the front, a little at a time.

      It really helps to have 3 people do this. 1 person on each side with pry bars and 1 person operating the hoist.

      The plate can get caught up and bent so be careful.
       
    5. vroomzoomboom

      vroomzoomboom Elite Canuck STOCK SUCKS! Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      January 22, 2007
      Messages:
      8,196
      Likes Received:
      14
      Trophy Points:
      48
      City, State:
      selkirk, manitoba
      Year and Model:
      98 supercharged 347 sport
      also, to keep the plate from falling off the pins (the last motor i did i was ready to toss the dam thing to), put the plate on the pins, then take a chisel and "stake", or put a small bur on the pin so the plate will stay in place.
       
    6. daves97sport

      daves97sport Member

      Joined:
      October 11, 2004
      Messages:
      69
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Tarentum, PA
      Year and Model:
      '97 Sport 5spd 4.0 OHV
      No bolts...
      Engine is out - cannot get the TC (torque converter) to fully mate on the transmission (see above measurements)
       
    7. daves97sport

      daves97sport Member

      Joined:
      October 11, 2004
      Messages:
      69
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Tarentum, PA
      Year and Model:
      '97 Sport 5spd 4.0 OHV
      Great tip on that point! THANKS!!! :)
       
    8. Happy Jack

      Happy Jack Active Member

      Joined:
      June 5, 2004
      Messages:
      715
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Wichita, KS
      Year and Model:
      97 Sport,94 Sport,88 BII
      I have not worked on the trans but the others I have installed a converter on I do the following. When you wiggle rotate the converter. You can try spinning one direction or alternate clockwise and counter clockwise. Try up and down and side to side when you wiggle or shake. When it goes on you will hear it seat all the way back.
       
    9. daves97sport

      daves97sport Member

      Joined:
      October 11, 2004
      Messages:
      69
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Tarentum, PA
      Year and Model:
      '97 Sport 5spd 4.0 OHV
      A good part of last night was spent doing this - all 3 of us tried (with some kicking also involved :rolleyes: ) Then tried with a dowel pin poking beyond the seal to find where the 2 notches should be, tried again and still no luck...
       
    10. Happy Jack

      Happy Jack Active Member

      Joined:
      June 5, 2004
      Messages:
      715
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Wichita, KS
      Year and Model:
      97 Sport,94 Sport,88 BII
      Keep trying. Maybe ur pushing too hard and need a lighter approach. That is the only way to install one. I have never seen or heard of another way. The pump drive is flat on both sides so you can be almost 180 degrees out. So you need spin or rotate clockwise or counter clockwise a bunch. Then again maybe not if you start off close.

      I would never kick on one. You don't need that much force.
       
    11. daves97sport

      daves97sport Member

      Joined:
      October 11, 2004
      Messages:
      69
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Tarentum, PA
      Year and Model:
      '97 Sport 5spd 4.0 OHV
      Still no luck, so we pulle dthe seal out to see better inside. I can see now how much play there is on the pump and would make it difficult. Still no luck engaging.
      Once engaged, will the pump turn easily?

      Also our local Adv auto list seal for the 4R but not the 5R tranny - anyone have a part number for the torque converter seal? Shaft size 1.61", housing 2.44"
       
    12. daves97sport

      daves97sport Member

      Joined:
      October 11, 2004
      Messages:
      69
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Tarentum, PA
      Year and Model:
      '97 Sport 5spd 4.0 OHV
      Got seal from dealer. Tried without the seal in place and still couldn't get mated.
      Removed the bell housing and tried installing on the bench and it went right in.
      Re-installed bellhousing and again several hours of trying unsuccessful
       
    13. ranger7ltr

      ranger7ltr Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      November 17, 2001
      Messages:
      1,261
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      46
      City, State:
      Great State of Texas
      Year and Model:
      1999 Sport
      Is the converter hub out of round or bent?

      If the converter lined up and mated with the bellhousing off then I would think the hub is bent because the bellhousing was stopping the unit from going into the tranny fully...

      Perhaps the hub got bent pulling the engine with the converter attached to the engine...
       
    14. daves97sport

      daves97sport Member

      Joined:
      October 11, 2004
      Messages:
      69
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Tarentum, PA
      Year and Model:
      '97 Sport 5spd 4.0 OHV
      I found this picture of Glaciers A4LD build.

      [​IMG]

      Is this what the pump is supposed to look like for the 5R55E also? Note the bearing race shown.

      On our pump, we saw 2 rows of needles with a carrier - no outer race.

      Also I was told that the output (small inner) shaft should only be protruding showing the splines, about an inch past the end of the larger splined shaft. Ours is out 1 3/4 inch. It will not move in or out either.
       
      Last edited: March 25, 2010
    15. daves97sport

      daves97sport Member

      Joined:
      October 11, 2004
      Messages:
      69
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Tarentum, PA
      Year and Model:
      '97 Sport 5spd 4.0 OHV
      I found this pix on the frankentranny rebuild page that showed the difference in a4/4r (previous pix) and the 5R does look like this...
      [​IMG]
       
    16. BrooklynBay

      BrooklynBay Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

      Joined:
      November 11, 2005
      Messages:
      50,869
      Likes Received:
      18
      Trophy Points:
      58
      City, State:
      Brooklyn, NY
      Year and Model:
      88 89 93 95 96 Aerostars
      It's odd that it would work with the bell housing removed, but not connected. It sounds like the angle was better when the bell housing was removed, so it was easy to install. Have your vehicle tilted at a 45* angle (front up/rear down), and turn the converter clockwise as you apply pressure.
       
    17. 99SportX

      99SportX Well-Known Member

      Joined:
      May 14, 2003
      Messages:
      1,978
      Likes Received:
      1
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Duluth, MN
      Year and Model:
      1999 Ex & Mounty
      I had this problem as well, and what a horrible time I had. I struggled with the trans forever until I realized that the torque converter wasn't seated all the way. The problem lies with that pesky inner splined shaft. When you remove the torque converter it sometimes pulls out a little and you just cant get it back in and seated no matter how hard you try. It binds in a brass bushing. I had to take out all the bolts inside the bellhousing holding the bellhousing to the main case, remove the BH, get the shaft seated properly and reassemble. One should probably replace the gasket if you open it up but I just did not care at that point since I had been working with it on and off for a couple weeks.

      Everything went together so easy after I did that. lol So easy it was just plain sad and I felt like an idiot for wasting all that time.
       
    18. daves97sport

      daves97sport Member

      Joined:
      October 11, 2004
      Messages:
      69
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Tarentum, PA
      Year and Model:
      '97 Sport 5spd 4.0 OHV
      EXACTLY!!!
      Pulled the tranny out Thurs. and after securing it vertical, took the bellhousing off, tried to remove the shaft, and finally broke loose. gathered up gaskets/orings etc and a new Tcase gasket and back together, where we should have been last Sunday :)
       
    19. vintage-racer

      vintage-racer New Member

      Joined:
      June 26, 2011
      Messages:
      2
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      Year and Model:
      98 Ranger 4x4
      input shaft walked out a bit with convertor removal

      I have just found myself experiencing this exact same issue after pulling the convertor with the (blown) motor. My input is sticking out about an inch too far. Shaft turns but feels pretty snug wiggling front to back. The motor is still on a stand.
      --Is it possible to remove the bellhousing and reposition shaft with the transmission still (horizontal) in the truck?
      --Any compications?
      I was freaking out till I read this thread...Thank you :)
      -98 4x4 Ranger
       
      Last edited: June 26, 2011
    20. PopRichie77

      PopRichie77 Well-Known Member

      Joined:
      June 14, 2010
      Messages:
      1,197
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Quakertown, PA
      Year and Model:
      2001 Explorer Sport 4X4
      Are you sure the center shaft is installed correctly? The ends are different and it only goes in the trans one way. The end with the short splines goes into the trans, the long spline end goes into the torque converter.

      If this was a working trans, don't remove the bell housing.
       
    21. 99SportX

      99SportX Well-Known Member

      Joined:
      May 14, 2003
      Messages:
      1,978
      Likes Received:
      1
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Duluth, MN
      Year and Model:
      1999 Ex & Mounty

      Hey man, I saw that you tried to send me a PM but my box was full. As for your issue, you should be able to undo the 6 or 8 large bolts that are inside the bell housing that hold the case together. Once that shaft came out on mine, I could not for the life of me get the shaft back out and in correctly. I had to separate the case and then it pretty much came out by itself. I was then able to reinstall properly and re-tighten the case bolts. This transmission is a severe pain in the butt when it comes to this shaft. The best solution is to never let it come out, but sometimes it does on its own when the converter is removed.
       
    22. PopRichie77

      PopRichie77 Well-Known Member

      Joined:
      June 14, 2010
      Messages:
      1,197
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Quakertown, PA
      Year and Model:
      2001 Explorer Sport 4X4
      If the shaft is the problem, grab the spline with vice grips and tap on the bottom of the vice grips it should come out unless you tried to beat it in.
       
    23. vintage-racer

      vintage-racer New Member

      Joined:
      June 26, 2011
      Messages:
      2
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      Year and Model:
      98 Ranger 4x4
      Thanks a bunch. It was a pretty easy repair ,even with the trans still in the truck. Wish I had found this post before fighting with it for several days. :)
       
    24. ksandman

      ksandman New Member

      Joined:
      January 31, 2006
      Messages:
      11
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Haverhill,Ma
      Year and Model:
      '99 Ranger w/4.0 OHV
      Easier way to put TC back in 5r55e

      Just finished putting 5k replacement tranny back in my 150k ranger w/4.0 OHV. I spent 2 hours trying to wiggle, spin, jiggle, and align TC to get it 1/2 " inside bell housing. I even fastened recommended handles to 2 TC bolts, trying to align tip of splined shaft better. Finally, I turned it upright (vertical) and was able to "feel" the center of the TC to let it drop in that last inch. It honestly took less than 30 seconds. I lost 1 cup of Mercon V (came out tailshaft end), but not out of my pre-filled TC. I hope this helps and remember to put some sort of bolted on bracket in place to hold the TC until you get it close to sliding into pilot at engine.
       
    25. CaptEric

      CaptEric New Member

      Joined:
      October 6, 2011
      Messages:
      1
      Likes Received:
      0
      Trophy Points:
      0
      Digging the archives...

      I know I am reviving a pretty old thread here, but I found it on a Google seach because I was having the same problem. I spent about three hours last night messing with the torque converter on an '06 Explorer 4.0 SOHC. I am ASE and Honda Master Tech, so a torque converter should NOT have kicked my arse like this. The problem ended up being the inner splined shaft sticking out too far; as mentioned here.

      At first, I could not get the inner shaft out, and didn't want to pull the pump cover as mentioned, so I put it in neutral, spun the propeller shaft, and the inner splined shaft came right out. Once it was out, I was able to easily reinstall it FULLY (whew!!!).

      Problem solved. Just wanted to say thanks, and hope anybody else that has the same problem finds this thread. :thumbsup:

      Eric
       
    26. 99SportX

      99SportX Well-Known Member

      Joined:
      May 14, 2003
      Messages:
      1,978
      Likes Received:
      1
      Trophy Points:
      0
      City, State:
      Duluth, MN
      Year and Model:
      1999 Ex & Mounty
      Excellent CaptEric! Rotating the prop shaft must have relieved any binding on the inner shaft. I will give that a try when this inevitably happens to me again because pulling the case apart to relieve the binding was sure a lot of extra work.
       

    Share This Page









    We Support Our Troops!