Explorer_PL
Explorer Addict
- Joined
- November 16, 2007
- Messages
- 2,914
- Reaction score
- 221
- City, State
- Rockland County, NY
- Year, Model & Trim Level
- 06EB V8
Why I pulled my engine out twice in a month - long story.
Ok boys and girls.
Get ready for a long reading
Somewhere in January at 199 k miles, my engine developed a nasty knock and valve train noise especially at lower rpm, and when stopped at a red light or in traffic. I went to one shop, and they diagnosed that I had a batch of bad contaminated (water) fuel and my timing (controlled by PCM) got off and to run some octane boosters and fuel cleaners and it should get better after few tanks. I did that and not much changed. I started reading about the 4.6 and 5.4 camshaft phasers on those motors and the more I read the more I was convinced that this is my issue. Especially since I read that the phasers get stuck even at 60 k miles. I figured, I got plenty out of this motor, so maybe it’s time for a new one. I went to another shop for diagnosis, and once they heard the noise, and learnt that it has 200k miles, they would not even fix it, but they would replace the motor. First shop quoted me 1500-2000 for a motor with 150k miles plus 20 hrs of labor, so I was looking at $ 4000 bill. The second shop said they would only install a crate motor from ford at 4000 plus about 1500 in labor plus “accidentals” meaning whatever goes wrong – extra hours – extra dollars. No way I said, the car is worth maybe 4 grand by the books. I spoke with a friend of mine who is a tech at Acura dealership and pulls engines out at least 1 every few weeks, and used to many more when he worked at a private shop in the past. I found a used 2007 4.6 from a wreck with 55k miles for $ 1600 including shipping, run car fax on the donor car and it checked out. Got the engine, we started one Saturday morning and by 6 PM we had the “new” engine in and running. But it’s throwing P0340 and what was worse, it had the same noises as the old one. I can tell you I was not in the best mood. First thing was to find out why the right camshaft is throwing the code. I took the valve covers off, and found out that one of the tabs was bent so the sensor could not read it. Since I wanted to makes sure that the timing on the new engine is all good, I ordered the whole timing kit including 2 phasers, chains, tensioners, guides and solenoids, and with my friend, we took the front cover off and replaced the whole thing. It still was making that stupid noise and was dropping rpm below 400 at idle. Now the transmission comes to my mind, but once I get going on the highway, it is smooth, shifts perfectly, no shuddering or jerking as when your tranny is going bad or torque converter is shot – none of that. And that was my mistake that I was concentrating on the engine. I finally went to Ford dealership and told them I want to buy an hour of diagnostic time, and tell me what is wrong with my truck. I had my answer within an hour – torque converter stuck in “locked” position, so when you press the brake pedal waiting on the red light, it should disengage the tranny from the motor, but in my case it was still trying to drive forward.
At that point I had a choice of dropping the tranny or pulling out the motor again, and I went with the motor since I knew what to expect.
The tranny could be more time consuming because of the cross members on the frame, transfer case and shafts.
Replacing the TQ was about a 2 minute job.
After I pulled the engine out twice in a month, it is not as bad as one would think. The book calls for 20 hrs, but I believe 10-15 is more reasonable. The biggest obstacles we had was AC compressor and PS pump seized to the block because of those extra-long studs. Also, since I was there, I also replaced both motor mounts, and that took additional half hour. The driver side mount is blocked by the front axle and differential so you need to drop the front axle. In order to do that you need to drop the front stabilizer bar so basically you have to disassemble most of the front to get to one bolt. The passenger side was easy. I also replaced the cat assembly since at 200k miles I was not sure how much longer my catalytic converters will last. I also replaced all the pulleys and idler and accessory belt for peace of mind.
Ok boys and girls.
Get ready for a long reading
Somewhere in January at 199 k miles, my engine developed a nasty knock and valve train noise especially at lower rpm, and when stopped at a red light or in traffic. I went to one shop, and they diagnosed that I had a batch of bad contaminated (water) fuel and my timing (controlled by PCM) got off and to run some octane boosters and fuel cleaners and it should get better after few tanks. I did that and not much changed. I started reading about the 4.6 and 5.4 camshaft phasers on those motors and the more I read the more I was convinced that this is my issue. Especially since I read that the phasers get stuck even at 60 k miles. I figured, I got plenty out of this motor, so maybe it’s time for a new one. I went to another shop for diagnosis, and once they heard the noise, and learnt that it has 200k miles, they would not even fix it, but they would replace the motor. First shop quoted me 1500-2000 for a motor with 150k miles plus 20 hrs of labor, so I was looking at $ 4000 bill. The second shop said they would only install a crate motor from ford at 4000 plus about 1500 in labor plus “accidentals” meaning whatever goes wrong – extra hours – extra dollars. No way I said, the car is worth maybe 4 grand by the books. I spoke with a friend of mine who is a tech at Acura dealership and pulls engines out at least 1 every few weeks, and used to many more when he worked at a private shop in the past. I found a used 2007 4.6 from a wreck with 55k miles for $ 1600 including shipping, run car fax on the donor car and it checked out. Got the engine, we started one Saturday morning and by 6 PM we had the “new” engine in and running. But it’s throwing P0340 and what was worse, it had the same noises as the old one. I can tell you I was not in the best mood. First thing was to find out why the right camshaft is throwing the code. I took the valve covers off, and found out that one of the tabs was bent so the sensor could not read it. Since I wanted to makes sure that the timing on the new engine is all good, I ordered the whole timing kit including 2 phasers, chains, tensioners, guides and solenoids, and with my friend, we took the front cover off and replaced the whole thing. It still was making that stupid noise and was dropping rpm below 400 at idle. Now the transmission comes to my mind, but once I get going on the highway, it is smooth, shifts perfectly, no shuddering or jerking as when your tranny is going bad or torque converter is shot – none of that. And that was my mistake that I was concentrating on the engine. I finally went to Ford dealership and told them I want to buy an hour of diagnostic time, and tell me what is wrong with my truck. I had my answer within an hour – torque converter stuck in “locked” position, so when you press the brake pedal waiting on the red light, it should disengage the tranny from the motor, but in my case it was still trying to drive forward.
At that point I had a choice of dropping the tranny or pulling out the motor again, and I went with the motor since I knew what to expect.
The tranny could be more time consuming because of the cross members on the frame, transfer case and shafts.
Replacing the TQ was about a 2 minute job.
After I pulled the engine out twice in a month, it is not as bad as one would think. The book calls for 20 hrs, but I believe 10-15 is more reasonable. The biggest obstacles we had was AC compressor and PS pump seized to the block because of those extra-long studs. Also, since I was there, I also replaced both motor mounts, and that took additional half hour. The driver side mount is blocked by the front axle and differential so you need to drop the front axle. In order to do that you need to drop the front stabilizer bar so basically you have to disassemble most of the front to get to one bolt. The passenger side was easy. I also replaced the cat assembly since at 200k miles I was not sure how much longer my catalytic converters will last. I also replaced all the pulleys and idler and accessory belt for peace of mind.
