Better brakes?

[Yadkin]

I'm on the third set of rotors for my 04 Explorer 4WD. We do a lot of mountain driving and the vehicle doesn't have the necessary brake capacity. Two OEM sets lasted two years each and the third were "high performance" slotted and lasted four. I'm used to them lasting a lot longer. No problem with my 07 Expedition on the same roads. Is there a better set, or other options?

[Ronin8002]

Originally Posted by Yadkin

I'm on the third set of rotors for my 04 Explorer 4WD. We do a lot of mountain driving and the vehicle doesn't have the necessary brake capacity. Two OEM sets lasted two years each and the third were "high performance" slotted and lasted four. I'm used to them lasting a lot longer. No problem with my 07 Expedition on the same roads. Is there a better set, or other options?

you might be doing it already, but have you been downshifting into "3" or lower to take advantage of the engine braking that the transmission provides? That might help prolong the life of the brakes.

[Yadkin]

Originally Posted by Ronin8002

you might be doing it already, but have you been downshifting into "3" or lower to take advantage of the engine braking that the transmission provides? That might help prolong the life of the brakes.

I frequently travel US 421 east from the Blue Ride Parkway, which is a 8% downgrade for a good six miles or more. That and other long, fast descents from the NC High Country, and I use engine braking always. Over the years I've done it in my wife's Ford 500, my 05 V6 Mustang, my 07 Expedition, my wife's '11 BMW 328, and now my '12 Jeep. The 04 Explorer is the only vehicle that I've warped disks with, and as I said earlier I did it with three different sets.

And I'm not wearing out shoes prematurely either.

[Ronin8002]

Sounds like you might be best served continuing to use the slotted ones then, being that they lasted twice as long as the others.

[Limited02]

That doesn't sound bad to me? I've changed my brakes twice in the last 6 years and it's pretty flat here in KS...

So you are saying you are warping the rotors more the you are actually wearing down the pads?

[Yadkin]

Yeah the pads are wearing fine. Both times I have replaced rotors the pads had plenty of life left, but I changed them because I put in new rotors.

I drive with a light foot and use the brakes as little as possible to save fuel, so I can normally make pads last in excess of 100k miles.

I'm looking at these: http://www.autoanything.com/brakes/6...0A2647743.aspx

[Ronin8002]

Originally Posted by Yadkin

Yeah the pads are wearing fine. Both times I have replaced rotors the pads had plenty of life left, but I changed them because I put in new rotors.

I drive with a light foot and use the brakes as little as possible to save fuel, so I can normally make pads last in excess of 100k miles.

I'm looking at these: http://www.autoanything.com/brakes/6...0A2647743.aspx

Those are very good from what I hear. I think you can also get them with dimples (not holes) and slots for a slightly higher price.

EDIT: here's the link for those:

http://www.autoanything.com/brakes/6...0A2647743.aspx

[Limited02]

Originally Posted by Ronin8002

Those are very good from what I hear. I think you can also get them with dimples (not holes) and slots for a slightly higher price.

EDIT: here's the link for those:

http://www.autoanything.com/brakes/6...0A2647743.aspx

I wonder if the problem was you were getting cheaper rotors? My first set I replaced was cheap rotors and pads which wore out quickly and starting to get a little shake while braking. Recently swapped out to a more "premium" rotor and better pads for bite, so far so good.

What you posted looks to be good and I believe EBC is a respectable brand. I'd have no problem buying what you posted and putting that on my Explorer.

If you can get 4 years out of brakes while living in a hilly area, I'd say you are doing something right

[Ronin8002]

Originally Posted by Limited02

I wonder if the problem was you were getting cheaper rotors? My first set I replaced was cheap rotors and pads which wore out quickly and starting to get a little shake while braking. Recently swapped out to a more "premium" rotor and better pads for bite, so far so good.

What you posted looks to be good and I believe EBC is a respectable brand. I'd have no problem buying what you posted and putting that on my Explorer.

If you can get 4 years out of brakes while living in a hilly area, I'd say you are doing something right

I've been looking at getting the EBC rotors myself...another user on this forum, "The Electrician" has them on his 2006 and is very pleased with how they have held up in the hot Saudi Arabia climate:

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/...ghlight=brakes

[JoshMcMadMac]

http://www.stoptech.com/technical-su...nd-other-myths

[Yadkin]

Originally Posted by JoshMcMadMac

http://www.stoptech.com/technical-su...nd-other-myths

Interesting article. The author hasn't seen a warped disk? He attributes the pulsations to "pad material unevenly deposited on the friction surfaces".

I suppose if you are dealing with precision castings for expensive race cars, that may be the case. But I have definitely seen rotors on my mass produced cars where the casting was off relative to the bearing center, and then the friction surface machined to the bearing center. This creates an uneven thickness of the rotor face to the internal cooling fins; more "meat" on one section of the arc then the other. As a result the rotor dissipates heat unevenly and over time, warps. At least that's my theory.

And I've seen rotors "turned" on a machine shop lathe that were definitely warped.

[Yadkin]

Originally Posted by Limited02

If you can get 4 years out of brakes while living in a hilly area, I'd say you are doing something right

Thanks, but I'm looking for even better performance. I drove 82k in my Expedition on these same roads with the original rotors and pads.

The Exploder is now my son's vehicle, and he has a feather foot like I do (since we both hate buying gas), but he still warped the slotted and drilled rotors this past winter coming back from a ski trip loaded down with friends and their gear.

O'Reilly just opened a store nearby and they sell the EBC that I linked to. But the counter guy just recommended a less expensive set from Bosch, "quietcast" with a lifetime warranty. The EBCs only have a one year warranty.

http://test.boschautoparts.com/Brake...astRotors.aspx

[fifthranger]

Thanks, but I'm looking for even better performance. I drove 82k in my Expedition on these same roads with the original rotors and pads.

I'd like to know how that is possible since I've twice in two different Rangers only been able to make it 50,000 miles on flat NE Ohio highways, and both times, the different shops said that I "did pretty well" on stock brakes. And, I don't haul, and I am also easy on brakes.

[not8taxi]

i would go with the EBC brakes...i had them on my ex for almost 4 years now and the rotors started to wear down recently...i would need to replace soon but they still hold up...go with the dimple and slotted with the green stuff pads...those have less dust than the others and stop great...

you can check out the website i get them from also...placeforbrakes.com


ps- i have a heavy foot, pack the ex to full capicity and brake hard so they lasted pretty good for me

[Yadkin]

Originally Posted by fifthranger

I'd like to know how that is possible since I've twice in two different Rangers only been able to make it 50,000 miles on flat NE Ohio highways, and both times, the different shops said that I "did pretty well" on stock brakes. And, I don't haul, and I am also easy on brakes.

My driving style is about saving gas, and the way to do that is to maintain momentum. Every time that you touch the brakes you have just lost momentum by turning it into heat (and brake wear).

• Take your foot off the gas as soon as you see the traffic light turn red, then coast to it.
• Same method for turns, don't use the brake while turning.
• Keep plenty of distance to the car in front of you (three seconds) and anticipate his slowing down. On a highway I can typically see a slow down occurring four or five seconds before the car in front of me reacts, and by that time I've already got my foot off the gas and coasting.
• Use O/D off when descending long steep hills.
• Let the vehicle run up speed on straight downhills just before the flat at the bottom, then coast down to normal speed.

[2002GreyHD150]

what PAD are you running that is lasting so long but seems to warping the rotors?

1. the OE Ford rotors are 210% know as junk. M wife's Monty wore the fronts out in under 15,000 miles. AND the OE pad is CRAP!!! Pads make a HUGE difference.

2. Autozone, O'reilly, Advanced basic rotors are about a 30% upgrade from OE.

3. 4 years is really not bad given the driving terrain you are dealing with.

4. From Stop-Tech, their Parent Company Centric has a reasonably new-ish pad I have really come to like. Posi-Quiet Ceramics. I have them on my WRX, my wife's Monty, and my Mazda 323GT.

5. Dimpled/slotted rotors, Posi-Quiet pads, your already described driving techniques. You should be fine.

Look up Rotor Pros they are on many of the enthusiast forums. Or contact Stop-Tech/Centric. There IS a difference in the metalurgical make up in the iron various companies use in their rotors.

My wife's 2004 Monty, changed to Rotor Pros dimpled/slotted rotors, Performance Friction Z-Pads @ 15,000. they went to 150,000 ish. then switched to Posi-Quiet Ceramics, we are knocking at 200,000 now and no signs of an issue, the rotors are still perfect. we are between Texas, Colorado, Missouri, Arkansas. So hills, mountains, stop-go grid lock. etc.

Just offering another view point.

Rob

[matt0248]

Originally Posted by Yadkin

Interesting article. The author hasn't seen a warped disk? He attributes the pulsations to "pad material unevenly deposited on the friction surfaces".

I suppose if you are dealing with precision castings for expensive race cars, that may be the case. But I have definitely seen rotors on my mass produced cars where the casting was off relative to the bearing center, and then the friction surface machined to the bearing center. This creates an uneven thickness of the rotor face to the internal cooling fins; more "meat" on one section of the arc then the other. As a result the rotor dissipates heat unevenly and over time, warps. At least that's my theory.

And I've seen rotors "turned" on a machine shop lathe that were definitely warped.

I agree, saying that rotors never warp is ridiculous. I have turned many rotors in over 10 years working as a mechanic, where you could measure the parallelism and runout on the surfaces, sometimes there was over 0.050 runout!!! That is NOT uneven pad material buildup. I have also seen where over torquing the lug nuts has distorted the rotor hub causing the rotor surface to warp. just my 2 cents on that.

[Limited02]

Here is the link to brakes I was talking about-

http://topbrakes.com/searchResults.php/39024

[Yadkin]

Originally Posted by 2002GreyHD150

what PAD are you running that is lasting so long but seems to warping the rotors?...

I've been using ceramic pads.

Originally Posted by matt0248

...I have also seen where over torquing the lug nuts has distorted the rotor hub causing the rotor surface to warp. ...

I'm sure that's the case with some, but I'm pretty good at applying correct torque, and in three stages. I went to a driving school one time and mine was the only car out of about 50 that had the correct lug nut torque.

In any event, I decided to go with the Bosch QuietCast rotors, lifetime warranty at O'Rielly's, with Wagner ceramic pads. I just replaced the fronts and the pulsation is gone. I'll leave the rears until later on.

[jrford]

Originally Posted by matt0248

I have also seen where over torquing the lug nuts has distorted the rotor hub causing the rotor surface to warp. just my 2 cents on that.

I'd agree. . .are you torquing the lug nuts using a torque wrench? If not i'd pick one up. I've got a feeling they are real sensitive to the torque specs. I always rotate my own tires and torque them down to 105lbs and never had a problem. I always do it in two stages, first real low 50lbs while on stands in a star pattern, then again in a star pattern to 105lbs on the ground. I also double check after it goes in the shop, once i found one well over 300lbs,
others at 100lbs. That wouldn't take long to warp. . .

I also used EBC greens and Raybestos Advanced Technology Metallurgy rotors.