Front Brake Pins with Rubber Sleeves

swalt · June 14, 2010

Hey guys,

I was servicing the front brakes on our new (used) 2005 Sport Trac. I didn't pay attention when pulling out the pins, but now realize the caliper pins are different. One has a rubber sleeve on it. Looking at the driver side caliper, and anyone tell me if the pin with the rubber sleeve is to go in the top position or the bottom? I will then assume the passenger side is the reverse.

ncranchero · June 15, 2010

Both caliper pins should have rubber boots on them IIRC.

swalt · June 15, 2010

ncranchero said:
Both caliper pins should have rubber boots on them IIRC.

Thanks. Boots yes, they are all in place, but one slider pin on each side has a rubber sleeve covering about a third of the pin when you pull it out of the housing. The pins (top and bottom) are different as one looks like a standard pin, and the other is milled down to accomodate this rubber sleeve. They don't show the pins in your diagram so it is hard to describe. Usually I pull pins out and they are the same top and bottom, but I didn't notice when I did these as I wasn't even looking at them when I pulled each out.

ncranchero · June 15, 2010

http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/we...ake_15310029-P_351_R|GRPBRHWAMS_1144206999___

http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/we...ake_15310064-P_351_R|GRPBRHWAMS_1144215856___

Haven't done mine yet. Either of these look familiar?

swalt · June 15, 2010

ncranchero said:
http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/we...ake_15310029-P_351_R|GRPBRHWAMS_1144206999___

http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/we...ake_15310064-P_351_R|GRPBRHWAMS_1144215856___

Haven't done mine yet. Either of these look familiar?

The second link looks like them, but it is odd as they show four sleeves in the picture. If you look at the pins on the left, those are the ones that accept the rubber sleeves, the ones on the right do not, so it would only be two sleeves. I have found other posts on google asking the same question, but still can't find an answer. I have the pins back in, but not sure if they are installed correct. Top on drivers side and bottom on passenger. I do get a slap from the front brakes now when turning (backing up).

1Aauto · June 17, 2010

swalt did you leave the other side together to use as a reference? Not sure myself which one goes where, but when it comes to servicing brakes I only tear one side down at a time in case you forget how it goes back together you can use it as a reference point.

Erkdajerk · July 5, 2011

I've just dealt with a similar situation on my '03 Explorer (4-door).

No one I asked seemed to know for sure, but the parts diagram in the ford shop manual shows the pin with the rubber sleeve (bushing) in the top position. I re-assembled the calipers with it on top on both sides. It seems to work fine.

Your Sport Trac may use the same brake hardware but I'm not sure.

MidnightRebel07 · July 5, 2011

There should be rubber sleeves on every slider pin (2) on each caliper, front and rear (if you have disc brakes in rear).

Very important to have these and to grease them everytime you take your brakes off because if you don't then they will rust in the caliper and not slide....

...Equals NO brakes or brakes not working properly, Very unsafe.

joelswan · November 15, 2012

Only ONE slider per side has the rubber sleeve - we aren't talking about the rubber boots. Read carefully.

This seems to be an eternal mystery with as many answers as questions. Does the pin with the sleeve go on the top and the pin with the flat spot go on the bottom, or the other way around. One post on the forum seems to come to a conclusion that they are opposites form driver to rider side!

No one form Ford seems to know - or can answer this question.

And YES - only ONE SLIDER PIN on each side of these Explorers (at least the 2002-2003) has a rubber sleeve cover most of the pin - again we are NOT talking about the boots on the end.

We may never find the REAL answer. Sigh.

OffTrac · November 15, 2012

I'll be changing my brakes soon. I'll try to remember to pay attention.

ChallengerDave · November 16, 2012

I know what your talking about. Really not sure what they are for but to be a pain in the butt. Not sure if it matters what spot they are in. I just leave them out if they are swelled up too much for any reason. Never had a problem without them. Most replacement calipers dont even have those rubber pieces. grease it up and run it.

joelswan · November 17, 2012

"not sure", "not sure"....
I appreciate you wanting to be helpful, but sentences that have or start with those words really are not.

Manufacturers don't normally spend money in things that are not needed. I've already found that the rotors don't last as long without the rubberized pins, so they likely do something. After market kits are made to be cheap, so it figured they might not have them. One kit I purchased did have them but had no info on where to use them!

@OffTrac - would be interested in hearing what you find. Are those factory installed calipers you will be working in? What model, year?

OffTrac · November 17, 2012

2001 Job1 4x4. Haven't paid much attention to the calipers but I assume factory. I'll know for sure next week when the parts come in and I start the work. May do UCAs tomorrow and check then.

Markaprice73 · November 17, 2012

though still interesting to see what OffTrac sees. It won't be 100% proof of how they came from the factory, unless he bought his ST brand new and has been the only one to ever grease the original slide pins and re-installed them one at a time. I found quite a few diff styles of replacement pins on rockauto.com. weird. the Motorcraft part just changed the style for some unknown reason and the first Wagner linked one seems to be closest to OEM IIRC. Dorman looks close too IIRC but no rubber sleeve comes with it. All different. Still doesn't explain wich one goes where for each side though. I usually trust Motorcraft. So maybe their new replacement is fine without any sleeve. doesn't look like there is even a cut out for it anyway.
http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=308607&cc=1414538
http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=963235&cc=1414538
http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=381238&cc=1414538
http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=542056&cc=1414538
http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=905840&cc=1414538
I do realize this isn't an answer. But ANY comments always help to come closer to a conclusion.

Markaprice73 · November 17, 2012

found this too. This is a professional tech's answer.
http://www.justanswer.com/ford/3a3hk-2002-ford-explorer-sport-trac-pads-rotors-way-cyl-2wd.html
Though I have been told the Ford service manual is not 100% clear on this matter either.
I have had nice even wear and no issues with the factory pins. drivers side= rubber sleeved pin on top and flat sided pin on bottom.
passenger side= opposite.
I'm just including a link to this other thread to maybe help others in the future or just to add to the confusion.
http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=356678
I have learned to go with ncranchero's knowledge and gut feelings on anything and everything to do with my ST :thumbsup:

OffTrac · November 17, 2012

I have learned to go with ncranchero's knowledge and gut feelings on anything and everything to do with my ST

^This!

Hopefully I'll get to the UCAs tomorrow but no promises, haven't put a deer in the freezer yet. If not tomorrow, Tuesday should be an all day wrenching and detailing event so I should know then, or not :dunno:

. For a little tease, it's not just UCAs and brakes.

No SAS, though , so don't start giving me crap, (Jerry!) lol.

joelswan · November 18, 2012

After carefully feeling for the differences in diameter of the holes receiving the pins, I'm inclined to agree that the rubber sleeved pins go on opposites on each side.

Since one of the holes is a bit larger on each mounting bracket, it seemed right that the rubber sleeved pin went in that hole and the all metal pin went in the smaller one. Tolerances were much better doing so. And since the brackets are identical (unlike the calipers) the larger hole was on top driver's side and bottom rider's side. Doing this seemed to make all tolerances much more even. When the all metal pins were in the larger hole it was very sloppy and the rubber pin was very tight.

So, I've come to the some conclusions. One rubber line per wheel, and though it may not matter whether it's on top or bottom to do it's "job", it does matter per wheel which pin the rubber sleeve goes in. I think the information given on the other discussion here on the forums is right - opposites with the top pin on driver's side being the rubber sleeved pin.

... And I disagree. ANY old discussion is not always helpful.

there should be some real light on the subject or it could add non-truth and ultimately distort other helpful information. But, that's just my technical background speaking.

Pontisteve · November 23, 2013

Rubber piece on caliper pin

I just went thru this with my 03 Explorer. Checked the factory service manual and Motologic (a mechanics resource).

The factory diagram shows the pin with the rubber sleeve to be on top. But that is looking at it from the back side of the driver's brake rotor. It's the same caliper bracket on the left and on the right, so if you set the pins in the way the factory shows you to (regular pin on the bottom, and pin with the rubber sleeve on the top), that is correct for the driver's side. For the passenger side, it IS the opposite.

Easiest way to do this is to assemble the caliper bracket and pins like the picture shows for both sides, and then just bolt the brackets on. You'll find that in order to bolt the bracket onto the right side, you have to flip it over. So yes, the rubber sleeved pin is on top on the driver's side, and on bottom on the passenger side.

I had regreased these a year ago, and when I took them apart today, I found that the one with the rubber grommet had seized. It wasn't water or rust or anything... the grease still looked good even. It was that the rubber sleeve had moved. So I'll be double-checking from now on, a few months after install. This had caused one pin to not move, and wore the brake pads unevenly on the caliper piston side.

This time, I used less grease. Just a thin coat. I made sure the pins were clean, and not greased underneath the rubber sleeve. I gave it a light coat of grease over the pin and rubber sleeve, and gently rotated the rubber sleeve/pin into position. This kept the sleeve from moving on the pin. We will see if this works. The scary part is that I'm pretty sure I did all this the last time too, and somehow my process led to uneven brake pad wear and a seized pin.

It is true that the two sleeves are different sizes. You can feel that they fit better when you assemble them as described here.

swshawaii · November 23, 2013

Even the Ford Workshop Manual doesn't specify where the sleeves go. Also made the same mistake by using too much lube and had the sleeves slip off the pins after having to compress them in the caliper bores by force. Over time regular anti seize will turn into a sticky, tar like substance and cause binding and sticking pins, the main reason for uneven brake pad wear. Clean the bores thoroughly and do NOT get brake cleaner on the rubber sleeves by taking them off the pins. Use caliper lube made specifically for brakes instead of regular anti seize shown on two sleeved pins below.

http://www.permatex.com/products-2/...permatex-ultra-disc-brake-caliper-lube-detail

Pontisteve · November 25, 2013

I'm still unsure about this issue. The regular pin lubes up nicely and is easily compressed and released. I use just a thin coating of grease, not globs. And this same pin had no issues from the last time I did this.

The pin with the rubber sleeve though, is still pretty stiff. It takes 2 or 3 times the amount of pressure to move this one in or out. It is not bound up now, but it was from the last time I did this, and I can see that it is stickier now too, despite my best efforts to be really thin on the lube.

It almost seems like Ford created tighter tolerances for this sleeve to bore on purpose, to slow down pin movement. I am very concerned this will put me back in the same boat again soon, with uneven brake pad wear. Why did Ford use two different pins? What is the purpose of this rubber sleeve????

It seems to me like it might be to delay or slow down the response of that one pin. Could this be an attempt by Ford to make both brake pad ends grab more evenly? If so, I think they may have created more problems than solutions.

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