Water pump failure leads to dead engine

[Satz]

Still 1 day away from the parts needed. I was looking at the diagram and the oil pump would be just a few bolts away from replacing. Anyone know how many miles or years this pump lasts. Also I see Ford is currently on the 3rd oil pump for this engine. I ignore which one I have and what are the problems related to it. Searching google didn´t yield results and the problems associated with a bad or failing oil pump I can´t relate them to my truck. So a replacement is very unlikely unless someone has some info that makes me decide otherwise. Any input would be greatly appreciated, thanks.

Not sure how long it last but the weep hole is clear and my garage floor too at 10 yrs and 197k . I have never even changed the coolant once.

when time comes I am really thinking of just dropping a newer low mileage engine .I have a local company that sells them .

 

[RonParise]

Not sure how long it last but the weep hole is clear and my garage floor too at 10 yrs and 197k . I have never even changed the coolant once.

when time comes I am really thinking of just dropping a newer low mileage engine .I have a local company that sells them .

The weep hole that might put water on the floor is not the big concern. You see that and replace the pump, an easy decision

The real problem is if the water pump shaft seal fails. this is the seal that keeps oil on one side and water on the other. If it leaks you wont see water on the ground: water will go into the oil. Hopefully you will see some evidence, of the leak; over heating or no water in the expansion tank, or chocolate milk shake instead of oil, before the lack of lubrication takes out the engine. So do you wait for failure and then replace the water pump or the whole engine. or do a preemptive replacement of the water pump, or whole engine

I faced that decision at 200,000 miles. I did a preemptive replacement of the water pump.

If you replace the engine, Id replace the water pump before installing it

 

[94Eddie]

Not sure how long it last but the weep hole is clear and my garage floor too at 10 yrs and 197k . I have never even changed the coolant once.

when time comes I am really thinking of just dropping a newer low mileage engine .I have a local company that sells them .

This is like throwing out the baby with the bath water, IMO. The 3.5L engines are basically bullet proof if maintained well with the exception of the water pump. You can spend a fraction of the cost of buying and installing a used engine if you replace just the pump as a preventative measure. As Ron stated above, it would be very foolish to install a used engine and not replace the water pump as part of the process which makes replacing the water pump as a pre-emptive measure even more justified cost effective. If you have changed the oil regularly then your current engine is very likely good for another 100k-200k miles with the exception of the water pump. If you haven't serviced the transmission and/or PTU then these will likely go before the engine, sans a water pump failure. In my area the cost of a transverse mounted 3.5L water pump replacement is around $1,500-$2,000. If you are doing the work yourself then doing a pre-emptive water pump replacement is a no brainer because the cost of a water pump is peanuts compared to the labor costs involved.

Also, the best way to monitor the water pump is to check the reservoir coolant level religiously. Any drop, and I mean ANY drop, in coolant level in the reservoir is cause for immediate concern. As Ron stated, if the shaft seal goes you will be very luck to catch it before the engine is taken out. This seal can fail quickly and catastrophically with no warning and no way to prevent engine failure. Especially if running at highway speeds when it fails. I check our Edge's coolant level via the reservoir tank 2-3 times a week. I plan to get the water pump replaced around 125k-135k miles. If the chains and guides are in very good condition then I will skip replacing them since they are very robust parts in the 3.5L engines and rarely fail.

 

[Satz]

I am facing oil consumption . A quart every 5k . Not sure if it’s normal. Hence my thinking .

 

[boominXplorer]

I am facing oil consumption . A quart every 5k . Not sure if it’s normal. Hence my thinking .

Since yours is an early model and you might have slid by tsb to replace the valve cover because of pcv juices(oil) getting into the intake tube right before the throttle body. If you drive hard those early NA 5th gens will eat oil right through the intake.

 

[94Eddie]

I am facing oil consumption . A quart every 5k . Not sure if it’s normal. Hence my thinking .

How long has it been consuming oil at this rate?

 

[DogRunner2]

I sure wouldn't worry about a quart every 5k miles on a ten year old vehicle.

 

[mguy13sport]

Install an oil catch can. It makes a big difference especially keeping the intake clean of oil soot. I just emptied mine today and it was full of nasty condensation and oil blowby.

Also, change oil every 3k. I think 5k is too far for high mileage engines. The oil in my car looks pretty dark at 3k and I couldn't imagine going beyond that.

I just saw a great teardown video of our engine where the owner didn't watch the oil and coolant and eventually a nice looking engine turned ugly real fast. They even tried putting a new waterpump / timing kit but thr damage was done.

 

[ivangotus]

2016 EX I'm still loosing slowly some coolant after waterpump,upper gasket manifold ,valve cover gaskets, timing and camshatf componets replaced at ford dealer. Oil is at the same level and clean, never overheated did a combustion test fluid and passed no white smoke on from exhaust pipe checked all hoses and driveway for leaks but nothing. trans oil clean the only thing i can't really see is the raditor with all the frames around it. Is there any where else to check? the ford dealer said my ex passed pressure test even letting it over night with nothing coming out, that was when the waterpump was leaking. Other that that truck runs great like new with zero codes. I may take it to another mechanic soon to do another pressure test just want some opinios. Thanks

 

[94Eddie]

2016 EX I'm still loosing slowly some coolant after waterpump,upper gasket manifold ,valve cover gaskets, timing and camshatf componets replaced at ford dealer. Oil is at the same level and clean, never overheated did a combustion test fluid and passed no white smoke on from exhaust pipe checked all hoses and driveway for leaks but nothing. trans oil clean the only thing i can't really see is the raditor with all the frames around it. Is there any where else to check? the ford dealer said my ex passed pressure test even letting it over night with nothing coming out, that was when the waterpump was leaking. Other that that truck runs great like new with zero codes. I may take it to another mechanic soon to do another pressure test just want some opinios. Thanks

You can put a dye in the coolant that glows green under a black light. Just look for areas that glow green for where a leak is occurring. It can be hard to spot leaks around radiators. Coolant can evaporate before it has a chance to drip to the ground.

 

[ivangotus]

You can put a dye in the coolant that glows green under a black light. Just look for areas that glow green for where a leak is occurring. It can be hard to spot leaks around radiators. Coolant can evaporate before it has a chance to drip to the ground.

i will definitely will try that, thats what i'm hoping for some evaporations. thanks

 

[RonParise]

I now have almost 350,000 miles on my 2011 explorer. I did a preemptive water pump replacement at 200,000. so now its time to start thinking about doing it again.. I check everything regularly but I dont believe that there is anything I can do to protect against the shaft seal failing . I mean I could check the fluid level and look at the oil every morning, but if the seal fails in the afternoon Im looking at a new engine.......

So what I did was to install a water level sensor in the expansion tank. Its a little rough, but i think Im onto something

I bought a small float switch and a red light, and scrounged around my garage for the pvc pipe, wire and washers

*******************************************************************************************************************************************

When the float is in this position the red light is off

In this position the light is on

I suspended the switch so the float is below the cold water level mark on the tank, So if the water level drops, so does the float and the red light comes on

I attached the switch to a washer that was the exact diameter of the outside diameter of the pipe The switch hung below the washer and the washer sets on top of the pipe, The pipe unions I had were too thick walled to fit in the expansion tank so I used tape to to secure the two sections of pipe together,

And then dropped it into the expansion tank

I cut if off so the expansion tank cap would fit and wired it up. I drilled a hole near the the top of the tank for the wires, sealed it with an epoxy and then tested it by removing the hose on the bottom of the tank to drain water from the tank....the red light mounted on my dash went on... I replaced the hose, added water and the light went off....... Success


Im calling this my proof of concept, design or prototype. I intend to find a better way to suspend the switch at the right level without using tape, to hold the two pieces of pipe together or use a non contact fluid level sensor

Call it a work in progress

 

[Odrapnew]

@RonParise - I'm not going to quote your post, but nice job. Simple yet effective.

 

[mguy13sport]

I like the idea but never trust a gadget. If you really wanted to have an "alert" of danger I would put some kind of sensor built into the weep hole area.

 

[DogRunner2]

I like the idea but never trust a gadget. If you really wanted to have an "alert" of danger I would put some kind of sensor built into the weep hole

You mean a different gadget?

 

[RonParise]

I like the idea but never trust a gadget. If you really wanted to have an "alert" of danger I would put some kind of sensor built into the weep hole area.

Im not worried about losing coolant out of the weep hole to the ground. The temp gauge should alert me. The problem is a potential failure of the water pump's shaft seal. That will dump coolant directly into the oil. There are reports of catastrophic engine failure without any warning

Our cars are full of "gadgets", designed and built by ford, Whats wrong with a gadget pieced together in my garage, as long as it works.

The reason I posted this is to get some feedback to answer the question...will it work? Or more to the point...if it works, will there be enough time to to pull over and turn off the engine before engine failure


I will say that the $2200 i spent 150000 miles ago for a preemptive replacemen of the waterpumpt (And will have to spend again pretty soon), dosent sound too bad anymore My car is in the shop now getting new plugs, coils and front brakes. The shop told me to bring $1500 when I pick it up.

If ford had included the waterpump in the recommended maintenance schedule for these cars, and if they had a factory installed "gadget"to alert the driver if the coolant level drops, Id be happy (or at least I wouldnt *****) about replacing it

 

[mguy13sport]

I'm gonna pretend I didn't read that first sentence. And I wouldn't even call that a gadget. That's more of an shark tank "apparatus" . The only gadget I use is OBDLinkMX+ Torque Pro. I was merely suggesting what I think is a better design of your idea... monitor the weep hole versus the coolant bottle. They both achieve the same goal in that you want to detect water pump failure. The weep holes sole purpose is that function.

 

[RonParise]

I'm gonna pretend I didn't read that first sentence. And I wouldn't even call that a gadget. That's more of an shark tank "apparatus" . The only gadget I use is OBDLinkMX+ Torque Pro. I was merely suggesting what I think is a better design of your idea... monitor the weep hole versus the coolant bottle. They both achieve the same goal in that you want to detect water pump failure. The weep holes sole purpose is that function.

When I say Im not worried about coolant at the weep hole, I mean Im not worried about having a sensor. The car will overheat and I do have a temp gauge


My concern, and when I want an alert, is if water leaks into the oil.. That would be water leaking around the shaft seal and a sensor at the weep hold wouldnt detect that

 

[ocracokeBound]

Due to the horrible increases in car prices I went ahead and did the preemptive replacement at 200k. Was about $2200 with new timing chain kit and oil pump.

 

[ncsuengineer256]

Due to the horrible increases in car prices I went ahead and did the preemptive replacement at 200k. Was about $2200 with new timing chain kit and oil pump.

Wow! I'm impressed that you got 200k on the water pump. Did you get the old water pump back from the shop? If so, could you post some pictures of the seals etc? I'm curious now.