RCD shock and mount numbers.

[chad551]

Other reason's you cannot run a 3" O.D spring is because it will rub the CV axle. And then it will hit the Upper control arm, and unless you modify your upper shock mounting bracket the spring could rub the frame. My 800 lb springs have been perfect for me.

Chad

 

[William Schumacher]

This is going to confuse some of you. I technically can run a dual spring setup, but given our application it will not be a "true" dual rate setup. Meaning, I can setup the C/O's to use two springs that in combination with eachother the total length would be 14", but the second spring would compress and not be useful. Therefore, it would not be a "true" dual rate setup. A huge waste of money in my opinion.

CMAX

CMAX

what if you were to run the dual spring setup with the same rated springs ?
not a dual rate,but rated the same ,say 800 or 850 lb,I would think it would be the same as a 14" spring rated at 800 or 850lb ? no ??

 

[cmax13007]

CMAX

what if you were to run the dual spring setup with the same rated springs ?
not a dual rate,but rated the same ,say 800 or 850 lb,I would think it would be the same as a 14" spring rated at 800 or 850lb ? no ??

SRi=initial spring rate
SRm= spring rate of main spring: 850lbs
SRt= spring rate of tender spring: 800lbs
Dual Spring Rate Equation: SRi=(SRm x SRt)/(SRm + SRt) = 412lbs

This tells us that with those to spring rates the intial spring rate of the two spring together is only 412lbs. Thats probably going to compress the tender spring completely. Once this happens the main spring (850lb) becomes your final spring rate. This is how I understand it. I will double check with Sonny at Downsouthmotorsports. You might be right that its an equal spring rate...not sure though.

Another thing to keep in mind is your spring lengths. You want the main spring to be 2" longer than your shock travel length. So in my case a 10inch main and 4inch tender. No since I am restricting the travel to 6inches with limit straps. I probably could get away with a 8inch main and 6 inch tender. Not sure what I'm going to do yet.

CMAX

 

[cmax13007]

Other reason's you cannot run a 3" O.D spring is because it will rub the CV axle. And then it will hit the Upper control arm, and unless you modify your upper shock mounting bracket the spring could rub the frame. My 800 lb springs have been perfect for me.

Chad

Chad,

You saging at all up front with the 800lbs or did you have any break in losses??

CMAX

 

[William Schumacher]

Eibach has 8" 2.5" that go to 1200 lb's
and 6" 2.5 up to 1450 lb's

there has to be something that will work ?
-----------------------------------------------------------------
EDIT:
I spoke with Adam from Eibach today,he wasn't as much help as I expected.......
he sent me a calculator for spring stacking {microsoft Excel}

using a 6" at 1450 lbs stacked with an 8" at 1200 lbs the total is a 658.44 rate per side .

I really thought we would find something within this lineup .

 

[CDW6212R]

If you could figure out how to modify the top shock mount to give clearence for a 3.0 O.D. Spring you could get a much lower spring rate 250-400 lbs I'm told. Anyways, just an idea.

CMAX

That's a promising thought, how much more room is needed for the 1/4" larger radius?

 

[kert0307]

If you extended the shock mounts out closer to the wheel you wouldn't need as high of a spring rate either. (especially the top, but don't extend it out to the point where at full compression, the shock angle to the bottom control arm is greater than 90 degrees)

 

[cmax13007]

Eibach has 8" 2.5" that go to 1200 lb's
and 6" 2.5 up to 1450 lb's

there has to be something that will work ?
-----------------------------------------------------------------
EDIT:
I spoke with Adam from Eibach today,he wasn't as much help as I expected.......
he sent me a calculator for spring stacking {microsoft Excel}

using a 6" at 1450 lbs stacked with an 8" at 1200 lbs the total is a 658.44 rate per side .

I really thought we would find something within this lineup .

The idea of having a 1450lb spring as my final spring rate scares me. I wouldnt want to hit a bump that exceeds that intial spring rate of 658.44lbs and then that 1450lb final spring rate to kick in. Sounds like one good jolt and again buying two springs per side is gettting priceeeeeeeeeeeee.

I am going to measure whether or not a 12" spring is going to work with my current setup. Meaning there is enough thread on the shock body to preload the 12" spring. This should work out ok since I am restricting my travels, so the spring wont pop out. If the 12" spring is two short I probably will design a spacer to take up the difference and allow preloading of a 12" spring. Hope this makes sense.

CMAX

 

[cmax13007]

That's a promising thought, how much more room is needed for the 1/4" larger radius?

They might fit. If you wanna buy the 3" springs and shock hardware I'll try it out and let you know. J/K

If using a 6.5" travel shock you might be able to get the 3" in there, but others have said that the CV's and the top control arm may be in the way. I can only confirm that the top control arm has little clearence. I currently am only running 2WD. Making way for lockers and gears so I took everything out up front.

CMAX

 

[William Schumacher]

I called Chamberlain Spring {604-278-3201} and spoke with Kim Jones in Sales,she said they coiuld build what we need,would even figure out what rate would get it done. if 1 person only did this,there is a $250.00 minimum,and 1 set could be in the $500.00 range

However,if theres a few of us that want to do it, the price comes down and we all split that $250.00.

it doesn't sound too bad and we could tell them what we need exactly ?

 

[cmax13007]

I called Chamberlain Spring {604-278-3201} and spoke with Kim Jones in Sales,she said they coiuld build what we need,would even figure out what rate would get it done. if 1 person only did this,there is a $250.00 minimum,and 1 set could be in the $500.00 range

However,if theres a few of us that want to do it, the price comes down and we all split that $250.00.

it doesn't sound too bad and we could tell them what we need exactly ?

Its going to depend on what travel C/O you go with. Chad is not having problems with the 6.5" travel shock. He even says the 800lb 12" spring is working ok. My only question is whether or not he had any loss of ride height after a few weeks of breaking in the springs. Lastly is he sitting level with the rear.

Anyways, I really do not want to fork out a hold bunch of money but if it comes to that so be it (I'd be insterested). The only reason I went with the 8.5 inch travel shock is because I measured a total extended length of the old shocks of around 23". However I did not subtract the heights of the brackets which bring that down to around 20" of extended shock length. Lastly if I ever decide to go the SAS I can then re-use these shocks. Those were the two biggest reasons for going with the 8.5" C/O.

All I have to do is measure to see if the 12 spring will work. That will tell us where we need to go next to find a solution unless thats the solution.

CMAX

 

[William Schumacher]

does anyone know off hand how much travel the RCD bilstein coilover shock has ?
Is it less than the fox 6.5 coilover ??

and on spring rate,I'm running 12" Eibach 2.5" 750 lb rate.
I'm level with the rear{SOA with 4dr leafpack},but I have no more turns left which means the spring is heavily compressed to gain the needed height.
in such a compressed state,will the spring perform correctly ?

I would think going with at least 850 lb rate,so that the spring isn't as compressed {more space between the coils}

I thought Chad said he was looking into getting 900 lb springs ?

if the 6.5 will work on my truck,this would be sweet !

 

[chad551]

Chad,

You saging at all up front with the 800lbs or did you have any break in losses??

CMAX

Zero sagging. I think I have surpased the break in period by now.

Chad

 

[cmax13007]

does anyone know off hand how much travel the RCD bilstein coilover shock has ?
Is it less than the fox 6.5 coilover ??

and on spring rate,I'm running 12" Eibach 2.5" 750 lb rate.
I'm level with the rear{SOA with 4dr leafpack},but I have no more turns left which means the spring is heavily compressed to gain the needed height.
in such a compressed state,will the spring perform correctly ?

I would think going with at least 850 lb rate,so that the spring isn't as compressed {more space between the coils}

I thought Chad said he was looking into getting 900 lb springs ?

if the 6.5 will work on my truck,this would be sweet !

The 01-03 sport trac & explorer sport, and 95-2001 explorers, mountaineers, & 97or98-05 rangers all have the same front suspension I believe, please correct me if I'm wrong. Meaning yes the 6.5" C/O should work.

If I were you I would just get the 800-850lb spring and be down with it. Unless you want to change the shocks go for it.


Chad,

Are you sitting level?? We though you were going up to a 900lb spring rate, what happened with all that.....

CMAX

 

[William Schumacher]

The 01-03 sport trac & explorer sport, and 95-2001 explorers, mountaineers, & 97or98-05 rangers all have the same front suspension I believe, please correct me if I'm wrong. Meaning yes the 6.5" C/O should work.

If I were you I would just get the 800-850lb spring and be down with it. Unless you want to change the shocks go for it.


Chad,

Are you sitting level?? We though you were going up to a 900lb spring rate, what happened with all that.....

CMAX

the only problem with that is this RCD shock dosen't have much travel I believe it's around 5" or so ?

I'm just about ready to order,I've spoken to Sonny and he was very concerened about the shaft diameter on these shocks ?
I'll let him set up the shock and spring combo. looking at 850 lb if available

lastly,
the bushing kit can't be used on this type of a setup,they will split under load,I'll need something like you guys did ? {any extras laying around }

the shock eyelet issue is going to be a problem for me....

 

[cmax13007]

the only problem with that is this RCD shock dosen't have much travel I believe it's around 5" or so ?

I'm just about ready to order,I've spoken to Sonny and he was very concerened about the shaft diameter on these shocks ?
I'll let him set up the shock and spring combo. looking at 850 lb if available

lastly,
the bushing kit can't be used on this type of a setup,they will split under load,I'll need something like you guys did ? {any extras laying around }

the shock eyelet issue is going to be a problem for me....

Yeah, I have 5/8" shaft. I know there is an option to get 7/8" shafts with the fox 2.5" C/O's, so be sure to ask. No probles yet with the shaft size but wish I would have went with the 7/8" shaft diameter. Just wondering what shock are you going with...6.5 or 8.5 with res or without???

What bushings are you taking about?? Top aluminum bracket bushings I had altered to fit 8.5 coilovers or the eyelet bushings???

I went to the local hardware and found 5/8" OD x 1/2"ID x 1" steel bushings and pressfit them in the bracket eyelets. I then however used the bushings from the kit for spacing. I will have to check them to see if they cracked, that would be bad!!!! Bellow is a link to McMaster Carr for some bushings. Pre-cut lengths too......

McMaster Carr - Bushings

CMAX

 

[William Schumacher]

Yeah, I have 5/8" shaft. I know there is an option to get 7/8" shafts with the fox 2.5" C/O's, so be sure to ask. No probles yet with the shaft size but wish I would have went with the 7/8" shaft diameter. Just wondering what shock are you going with...6.5 or 8.5 with res or without???

What bushings are you taking about?? Top aluminum bracket bushings I had altered to fit 8.5 coilovers or the eyelet bushings???

I went to the local hardware and found 5/8" OD x 1/2"ID x 1" steel bushings and pressfit them in the bracket eyelets. I then however used the bushings from the kit for spacing. I will have to check them to see if they cracked, that would be bad!!!! Bellow is a link to McMaster Carr for some bushings. Pre-cut lengths too......

McMaster Carr - Bushings

CMAX

I was taliking about the 5/8" bushing accessary kit. I believe the ones that come with the shock are fine.

I'm looking at the 6.5" with an 850 lb rate.

Now I understand what you did with those steel bushings !

 

[cmax13007]

I was taliking about the 5/8" bushing accessary kit. I believe the ones that come with the shock are fine.

I'm looking at the 6.5" with an 850 lb rate.

Now I understand what you did with those steel bushings !

Reseviors??? I recommend it!!

CMAX

 

[William Schumacher]

what do the reseviors do ?
is this how your adding pressure ?{through the reseviors?},and without them you can't ?

 

[cmax13007]

what do the reseviors do ?
is this how your adding pressure ?{through the reseviors?},and without them you can't ?

An emulsion shock is a mixture of both the nitrogen gas and oil. The reseviors separate these fluids with a devider. The advantage is a better acting shock. It will also disipate heat more efficiently. Talk to Sonny about it.

CMAX