Project Expo SAS long travel?

[mastermoose]

I do a lot of trail riding in my explorer and I have come to realize the fall back of my IFS and it's limited amount of travel. I live in southern Nevada so most of the trails are unmaintained wide open dirt roads, stuff a prerunner would thrive on. However, several times a year I like to head into the more forested/ rocky areas to camp, and there have been a few instances where my friends with Jeeps could cross an obstacle, but I couldn't.

I've been reading up on SAS'd and longtravel trucks and I can't seem to find much on solid axle longtavel, like a Jeep and prerunner had a kid. Should I just go straight long travel like a Dixon Bro's kit and just give up on the rock crawling, or is it possible to still do the desert side of things with a solid axle and leaf springs up front? (Like JeepSpeed)

 

[BKennedy]

My SAS, and several others on the site, uses 14" coil over shocks and long radius arms. It seems to work very well on the highway, on open dirt roads, and in the rocks. If you went with say 6-7" compression and the rest for rebound, you would have plenty of suspension for faster driving and a bunch left over for crawling. I did the Mojave Road in mine right after completing the SAS with around 5.5" compression and 8.5" rebound (with poorly tuned shocks) and it performed better than the old TTB ever did. Also does good down the washes at Truckhaven, but really shines in extreme articulation situations or steep ledges. It also performed better all around than my buddy's Rubicon Express long travel suspension'd Jeep. Winching Jeeps is fun!

 

[mastermoose]

If I were to do the sas, could I put a full size dana 44 up front (which I think is 6" wider than the back) with my stock rear axle or do they have to be the same length? It wouldn't be like that forever, just until I'd put a 9" in the rear.

 

[BKennedy]

Yes, its only 3" wider per side. You would need some type of wheel adaptors to match the D44 pattern and you can get them in any width you wish so you can add 1.5" per side, making the total width difference only 3". If you want to go SAS, whatever you are thinking has probably already been done. You should look in here for ideas http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=63

 

[mastermoose]

One thing I'm still not clear on is will I be able to bolt up the stock drive shaft to a Dana 30 or 44? Or will I need to have one custom made? Let's say if I get the Dana 44 out of a f150 can I take the drive shaft out of the f150 and use that to? Or possibly with the Dana 30+ drive shaft out of a jeep xj?

 

[BackBone]

Good info here:

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=237376

 

[MercuryMullet]

Old thread I know but I have a full width TTB 44 with the stock rear. I could help with a lot of your questions or at least give measurements.

 

[mastermoose]

Old thread I know but I have a full width TTB 44 with the stock rear. I could help with a lot of your questions or at least give measurements.

I have a few...

1 Did the stock front drive line bolt straight up to the 44?
2 What kind of leaves did you use (if you're even leaf sprung)?
3 How much money and time was spent on yours?

 

[MercuryMullet]

I have a v8 and did a transfer case swap. Then used a front ford bronco driveshaft. All the years are slightly different so measure yours and figure out which one will work.

I used king coilovers. I wouldn't want leafs for a go fast but if you were pinching pennies I would consider yj leafs. I've seen bronco buckets used because of the coil options and factory dual shock. I actually have a full size bronco front frame so the steering is factory but there are plenty of sas threads to figure out the steering box.

I'm not a good example for money but it took 2 years and 15k for my buddy to finish it. I have a bronco front frame, frame is fully boxed, 64" deavers rear with 3.0 king bypass, headers, cam, xfer case swap, 4:56 with lockers, king coilovers, buckets with harnesses, shift kit, fiberglass, bumpers, winch. Sand paddles, wheels and tires, lights, front and rear driveshafts, limit straps, and partial cage. I'm sure I'm forgetting something but I would check some of the sas swap threads for price since I did everything at once and I did ttb not sas. I can just help with what it will look like with full width front and stock rear.

I used wheel adapter spacers in the rear to help with the width. I have zero offset wheels and the front is 78" with 33 12.50 on 8" wheels. The rear 75.5". If I did it again I would use custom arms to help the tires turn sharper.

 

[MercuryMullet]

I would think $2500-$3000 could get the swap done if all parts where used, all work done yourself, you waited for a deal on all parts and you would have to get a screaming deal on a wagoneer 44 or run a Dana 30 so the wheels will work. You could also be a wagoneer front end and use the leafs from it. But any new part, any fab work that has to be paid for and any changing or rebuilding of used parts will add up fast.

 

[MercuryMullet]

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=407164

This is a dana 30 swap. Axle will be cheaper and save money on wheels and/or spacers. I'm guessing you have stock gears and you could find a donor that matches which would save cash as well.

 

[mastermoose]

Picked up a HP dana out of a 1977 bronco. Gonna throw new seals and bearings in it before I throw it underneath the truck. Not sure if I should go for Deaver type leaf springs or 18" coilovers and a 4 link set up.

 

[BKennedy]

18" shocks are way too long. You would end up with about an inch of compression.

A full-width axle is going to be about 9" wider than stock. I had my HP D44 narrowed to early Bronco width (6" off the long side) and it is 3" wider than stock Explorer wheel width.

 

[mastermoose]

It's an EB axle so it should be fine. What's realistically the most amount of travel I can get out of it with only like 6 inches of lift?

 

[2TimingTom]

Mine, linked above, was originally sitting on XJ 5.5" lift springs (with those pictures taken in that thread) I found they were too soft and switched to stiffer ZJ coils.

I've never really measured wheel travel. It's a lot.

 

[mastermoose]

Here's basically what I had in mind.

 

[mastermoose]

And here's how the beater stands right now.

 

[BKennedy]

It's an EB axle so it should be fine. What's realistically the most amount of travel I can get out of it with only like 6 inches of lift?

Before I purchased shocks for my SAS, I asked a bunch of the coil over crowd what the max length shock would be for Ranger based vehicles. The longest used that I know of is 14". That is quite a bit of wheel travel. You start to have binding issues with steering at around the end of the shocks rebound travel. Its what I went with and it works good.
This pic is not maxed out, you can see the loose limiting strap next to the shock. I ended up with about 5.5" of compression at ride height.

 

[mastermoose]

You think I can still do the fast desert type wheeling (whoops, smaller jumps etc) with a set up like yours? Granted I'd probably go 4 link. I'm basically looking to make a lighter duty ultra 4 style truck.

 

[mounty71]

You can still get a solid axle to work in the faster/bigger stuff, but you need to valve the shocks accordingly. I've seen videos of that 4runner posted above and it looks to work well. The problem with a solid axle though is that you can only get so much up-travel before the axle and oil pan start fighting for space. Up-travel is your friend in go-fast desert stuff, so if you're limited on that then you need to compensate somehow, with either a taller ride height, which creates other challenges, or shock valving. That's why IFS is the favorite with prerunners and desert racers. The Dixon Bros. (now made by Vegas Dezert Fab) kit is a good option, or if you have really deep pockets BTF is finishing up a fully fabbed 4x4 LT kit.