Jefe's 700R4 swap | Page 5 | Ford Explorer Forums - Serious Explorations

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Jefe's 700R4 swap

I got tired of the computer deciding when my 5R55E transmission should shift, since it hadn't a clue with all the mods I've done so I decided It was time for a change. The two choices were a manual, or a 700R4 for a lower crawl ratio. I love having an auto in LA traffic (and Its grown on me wheeling) so I figured I'd be the first to put a 700R4 in a 2nd gen. :)

All my pics are here, and I'll link the important ones to the thread.

I grabbed the two Advance Adapters parts (4.0 to 700R4, 700R4 to t-case) back in Feb for a great deal, and waited for some more cash to come around to buy the 700R4. I got the 700R4 (Level II) from Bowtie Overdrives, along with their TV system, 1800 rpm stall torque converter, dip stick, and install kit.

The trans arrives:
DCP_4478.jpg


A few weeks before I put the trans in i decided to install the TV linkage. Somewhere between '91-'94 and 2000 the throttle body linkage changed size, so I got to modify it to fit Bowtie's TV setup. I figured since was modifying anyway I mine as well upgrade and so I threw in a BBK TB.

You can see where i ground the linkage down:
DSC00115.jpg


On another weekend I hacked up my center console and installed the B&M Hammer shifter. It sat a little low sitting on the floor, so I welded up a sub-frame for it out of 1" sq. tube. I plan to glass the cover in with the center console so it looks factory. (anyone want to show me how to glass?)

Part way installed:
SANY0017.jpg


The next step was to throw in the transmission in a weekend and hope everything else went smoothly since this is still my daily driver.

Friday night (5 hrs):
The first job was to get the control arms from the SFA out of the way, along with its bracketry:
SANY0001.jpg

SANY0004.jpg


Next, getting ready to take the t-case and transmission out:
SANY0005.jpg

SANY0006.jpg


Saturday (15 hrs):
With help, and a very tall floor jack (or a bunch of bricks :rolleyes: ) remove t-case and transmission. Compare transmisions (AA tailshaft housing was installed previously, and the 700R4 was built with the AA output shaft):
SANY0012.jpg


Bolt AA adapter to engine:
SANY0014.jpg


Bolt adapter to torque converter and install:
I had to grind down the three bolts in order to get them flush w/ the adapter. Not sure if AA dropped the ball or what.
SANY0013.jpg


Bolt up trans:
SANY0015.jpg


Bolt up t-case:
SANY0016.jpg


Connect TV linkage:
SANY0022.jpg


Reroute cooler lines. I used rubber for now. I plan to replace with either braided stainless or hard lines. I had ordered the Bowtie overdrives lines, but they aren't long enough to reach the drivers side tank of the stock radiator, nor are they the right fittings for the radiator.

Sunday (10 hrs):
Wire up shifter. I brought the wires that went to the shift position switch on the 5R through the same hole as the shift cable. By rewraping the wire harness correctly, i didn't have to extend any wires, which was nice.
Wire up torque converter harness. I got bowties harness w/ manual lockup switch, and replaced my shifter handle with one that has a switch. so now I can lock the converter up when i'm climbing in 3rd gear. It works great.

Connect shifter, fill trans and start engine w/o exhaust Y-pipe to get neighbors attention :D

Modify exhaust. I had to crush the pre-cat on the passenger side in order to get the Y-pipe to fit. The O2 sensor on that side is fine. The O2 sensor on the other side clears the adapter plate by a 1/32", so others may need to grind the adapter to get it to fit. I figured I'd then drive it to an exhaust shop and have them remake my Y-pipe to fit better. However I found out that for such a new vehicle the O2 sensors and pre-cats have to be exact stock distances down the pipe to follow guidlines so no one wanted to help me there. I even talked with the local guy for a good 30 mins coming up with crazy ideas to get it to work, like remoting the oil filter and taking the exhaust around the outside of the frame rail. I ended up just using the tube that AA suplies to extend the Y-pipe so that the cats would bolt up sqaure and clear the trans. I may get to have fun when I need to smog this thing :rolleyes:

exhaust pics:
SANY0024.jpg

SANY0033.jpg

SANY0025.jpg


I know I've left out many details, so if anyone has any questions, ask away.
 



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appx91 said:
Have you ever figured out what was wrong with yours Jefe?
After another 20 miles of driving around town it completely died on me. :mad:
According to Bowtie I broke a hard part (input sprag or drum or something) (was hopeing it was just a hydraulic problem). I am just under a year (and less than 20k miles), so they will repair it under warranty once I take it out and get it to them.
 



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OK just wondering if I should look for another company that makes the 60 deg and maybe try them out since you have already had trouble with yours. Sorry to hear about the tranny Jefe. Thanks for all of your help!!!
 






Jefe said:
After another 20 miles of driving around town it completely died on me. :mad:
According to Bowtie I broke a hard part (input sprag or drum or something) (was hopeing it was just a hydraulic problem). I am just under a year (and less than 20k miles), so they will repair it under warranty once I take it out and get it to them.


Will it ready for the run? :(
 






Stic-o said:
Will it ready for the run? :(
hopefully, a somewhat positive answer tomorrow??
 






Stic-o said:
Will it ready for the run? :(
John and I pulled the trans last night and I dropped it off at Bowtie OD this morning. Should have it back Tue or Wed and installed by Sat.
 






Hey Jefe, any idea what caused the problem? Maybe BowTie can give you some idea of what happened or if it was a deffective part. Just wondering if this is an isolated problem or a if it could go wrong on another BowTie Unit.

As far as the Lokar shifter, I also have one and yes, it transmits all the sound into the cab as well. I want to switch it out eventually, I just haven't got to it yet and it also breaks one of my cardinal rules, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
 






For a shop that deals with only 2 models of transmission you'd think that Bowtie would have every part in stock. They are waiting for an input housing to put mine back together. :fire: I have had to call them twice to get anything out of them.

Diff Whack Daddy said:
Hey Jefe, any idea what caused the problem? Maybe BowTie can give you some idea of what happened or if it was a deffective part. Just wondering if this is an isolated problem or a if it could go wrong on another BowTie Unit.
I will pick the tech's brain when I finally get to pick it up.
 






Jefe,
Was it the input drum that broke?

My first 700r4 from Bowtie had a broken input drum and burned 3-4 clutches..
I think the burned clutches was from them sending the wrong TV cable (it was labled 4.0, but was way too long/big)..

The 2nd one the torque converter broke(that one might have been my fault duing the install) which took out the pump (I drove it 600 miles that way)

I still get a little buzz from the valve body when the trans gets warm, but I've been told its just a valve moving (by bowtie and a local shop) and not to worry about it.

My current tranny I helped them (bowtie) put in.. I paid for the new converter, they ate 1/2 the cost of r&r of the trans, and they ate the cost of the rebuild (and I took a bay from them for 3 days).. On my way out to them (they are 600 miles away) I snapped the chain on teh xfer case.. they replaced it for me (I got a yard xfer case, they put it in).

One thing I still don't like.. I'm supposed to have the 1800 stall HD converter but I am getting 2500+ rpm stall speed (flash stall is 2700ish... and brake stand stall is about the same)..

They do stand behind their transmissions (Saul, Sergio and Chris went way over and above), but they can't dyno test 60 degree v6 700r4 transmissions.. They have an el-camino and a 2wd chevy pickup they install all of the 90 degree transmissions in to test.. but they don't have a test bed for the 60 degree and I was told they don't do very many of them anyway..

BTW I have a stage II transmission from them..

If I had to do it over again, I think I would buy the transmission from someone else (someone closer if possible), put in the Bowtie TV cable system (WITH RED SPRING) and call it a day.. I know they make good transmisions, but with my problems and now Jefe, I'm not sure.

~Mark
 






So who would you go with if you didn't go with bowtie OD. I am have to get a new tranny and I want a 700r4 but I am kind scared of getting a bowtie unit now b/c of the problems you all have been having. Heck my a4ld lasted 155,000 miles.
 






appx91 said:
Heck my a4ld lasted 155,000 miles.

take into consideration that most of the ppl who are using the 700r4 on this board are probably also using them for severe off-road use.

.
 






IZwack said:
take into consideration that most of the ppl who are using the 700r4 on this board are probably also using them for severe off-road use.
Still, a Level 2 700R4 rated for 450 HP should not fail behind a 160 HP V6 under any condition, especially at only 20k miles.

Oh, and still no word from Bowtie on when my trans will be ready. :rolleyes:
 






ask em if you broke the sunshell , I know at least on the newer 4l60E's they breakthem enough we keep 5 in stock at all times. we keep hardened ones called the beast that wont break. Well we seen one break but it was a bad part.
 






Trust me I wheel mine. I have love the skinny pedal.
 






My level 2 from bowtie has the beast upgrade.. and I still broke the transmission that early.. (don't know if the bad tv cable setting due to the wrong spring installed by them and the wrong cable sent to me by them broke it or if the overheating clutches broke it.. which I wouldn't think would happen).

~Mark
 






so maybe a poll is due for those who are using the Bowtie 700r4 to see whether or not they'd go with a different company for this particular transmission...
 






Dumb question-

Can you not get the "kit" without the tranny? Maybe its just me, but damn they charge alot for a 700R4 and they dont seem to be holding up that well either. You can have one monster of a 700 built for $7-800. And on a different note, yes the tv cable setup wrong will smoke one in no time.

Just a few random thoughts...
 






man, I'm glad I didn't go with the 700r4. Hearing all the bad stories so far seem terrible. I just hope my c4 doesn't do the same thing as yours Jefe. That sucks that it only lasted 20k, but it's probably good that it broke now and not 100 miles over the warranty.
:(
 






You are buying the "kit" from advanced adapters.. Then you send the output shaft (from the kit) to whoever builds your transmission... Other than that output shaft, its a regular 60 degree 700r4.

~Mark
 






wow, thank goodness I went 5 oh
 



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Maniak said:
You are buying the "kit" from advanced adapters.. Then you send the output shaft (from the kit) to whoever builds your transmission... Other than that output shaft, its a regular 60 degree 700r4.

~Mark
I believe James was refering to the TV cable kit, and yes you can get that separate.

I went with Bowtie because of their sopposed knowledge of the 700R4 as that is their specialty, for their warranty, and for their location, which saved me shipping in the first place, and has now saved me more since I could deliver the broken trans rather than paying shipping both ways to get it warrantied. I had looked other places and their price is near what any other 'higher end' 700R4 in a V6 case (thats the kicker as most places wanted more for the V6 case) would cost.

However, I'd second guess all that now that its been over a week and I still don't have my trans back, and I have to call them to see whats going on. Sopposedly they've been waiting for a part ever since they pulled it apart a week ago yesterday, and can't tell me when they expect the part to arrive.
 






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