8.8 IFS into an Explorer.....lets discuss this.

[HighRoad]

Hey guys, looking to compile information on IFS.

I have done a lot of searching online, and most ford ifs info leads back to this forum, which does not surprise me. But, the threads I have found, usually end us going the SAS route:thumbdwn:

You may have seen my project on here: http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=373640

My goal is to come up with an option for the front differential for 2nd gen explorers/sport tracs other than the Dana 35. I am looking for more strength and gear/locker options. Makeing the CV's/axles stronger is not a problem as there are several options for going to 930 CV's and stronger axles, especially if you are changing the front suspension like I am. The problem is the front chunk.....

What I think I know:

All A-arm explorers have the dana 35 diff or starting with the 3rd gens, a dana 30. The Dana 30ifs may have some better aftermarket support??? Probably not much if any stronger???

97' newer F-150's/Expeditions have the 8.8 IFS, 28 spline. This differential has multiple locker and gear choices and is probably a decent strength upgrade. I am trying to find one to measure to see what the width and mounting points are like. Most likely the tubes would need to be shortened and obviously the mounts are going to be different. And, I believe they are high pinion, which may make the fit even tighter or necessitate lowering the differential which would not be a good option.

3rd gen explorers have 31 spline low pinion IRS in the rear. Could be run in the front when turned around backwards and be low pinion, but would need axle tubes or a support for the long side axle like a front wheel drive car long side axle. It possibly could be mounted like this off of the front cover bolts:

Does anyone know of a project where the Dana 35 A-arm IFS was replaced with something else? Any other Ideas I am missing.

Thanks for the discussion.

 

[TBMounty50]

I like what you're going after. I too like my IFS and would like more strength/options. Lowering the axle centerline would be good for CV angles but not prop shaft angle so I think you're right on that not being an option.

 

[TBMounty50]

Although, if it's a high pinion then you could lower it to bring it inline and have an acceptable angle on the front shaft and also create a better angle for the half shafts, especially for taller than stock torsion settings. What is your concern about dropping the diff, mounting strength? Ground clearance?

 

[HighRoad]

Lowering the Diff changes the geometry, and will effect the axle/cv plunge. It may or may or may not be a factor, depending on how much travel you are after, but in my case, the axles/cv's even when using aftermarket parts that have a lot more travel than stock, are still the limiting factor in travel.

Any differential run in the front that is not high pinion is running on the coast side of the gear......so, we up the ring&pinion size, but may not gain a lot due loosing 20% (this is a number I have heard used by some large axle/gear companies) strength running on the "wrong" side of the ring gear. But, the stock d35 is low pinion so it is already running on the coast side.

This makes the 8.8ifs attractive, although it may not be very easy to modify due to it being aluminum.
Another option would be a hp d44. The tubes could be shortened, etc, but it has a slightly smaller ring gear than the 8.8. Both the 8.8 and the d44 have 31 spine lockers/carriers available.

Reverse cut gears cannot be used in a housing that is not high pinion, so the low pinion IRS 8.8 out of the rear of a 3rd gen expo for example, would have to run standard cut gears on the coast side in a front application.

Of course anything is possible, but I don't see a good way to get a lot more room for the housing under our rigs, if for example we wanted to use a dana 60 chunk, 9" etc. A steel oil pan could be cut and modified to make more room, but the lower a-arm mount is probably the biggest problem as without completely re-designing the front suspension and all attach points, can this be moved.

I am hoping to get my hands on an 8.8ifs housing to see how it could be made to fit. This is my first choice, but the high pinion may be a deal breaker. If this doesn't work, an 8.8 solid axle housing may work with shortening the tubes etc. I'm going to go out and measure the difference between the size of the center chunk on an 8.8 and the d35........

If anybody has an thoughts or ideas, please jump in on this!

 

[fsumotorhead]

I like the idea of finding a stronger option, 1/2-1 ton '87+ GM trucks come to mind.

But what locker/gear choices do you want that aren't readily available? The D35 IFS is essentially the same rear end as the D35 in 94 and newer Jeeps (yj, xj, tj, etc). You can get gears from 3.27 up to 5.13, and there are a good amount of lockers available.

 

[DriveshaftJoe]

Your right about the gear options fsumotorhead, but unfortunately the locker options are next to nothing. The reason being is that the front application in our Explorers doesn't use a C-clip retainer to keep the axles in the diff, but a cir-clip expansion style retaining ring. The side gears inside the diff carrier are specially machined to match the different retaining rings (Ford specific to the explorer/ranger,) which are different than the Jeep application D35.

Ive been looking at different diff option too HighRoad. I like the lower stance that the A-arms provide and dont want to sacrifice it for a solid axle. Have you thought of the TTB D44. The TTB diffs were built to be self supported, easy to build a bulk head to bolt the housing to and into the stock points on the truck frame. High pinion I believe, so a plus if it fits. Probably could roll it over 180* if it didn't. The housings have a lot of meat on the axle shaft exit holes, easily modded for retainers/axle support - one side already has a support bearing in it. A few issues to sort out - like the long side shaft support at the A-arm pivot point, and sourcing said long side shaft.

 

[HighRoad]

DS, good points.
I have considered the TTB44, but have high hopes for the IFS 8.8. Just need to get my hands on one to see if there is any way it will fit. The wrecking yard wants $150 for a housing, and I am not that desperate yet.

 

[fsumotorhead]

What do the newer F-150s use for a front diff?

I thought they use a 8.8, would it lend itself to easier use then the rear irs 8.8?

 

[HighRoad]

What do the newer F-150s use for a front diff?

I thought they use a 8.8, would it lend itself to easier use then the rear irs 8.8?

Yes, and I hope to make the IFS 8.8 work. But, it is high pinion and this may be a problem getting it to fit.

 

[DriveshaftJoe]

I'm envious of your wreaker prices HighRoad. $150 for a housing is cheap compared to what I'd have to pay here in British Columbia.

 

[Turdle]

Forgive me for butting in, but maybe it would be a good idea to have the whole f150 front frame and all, with steering and axle shafts.
This way you'd have all the brackets and know what had to be modified-shortened to get it attached to the explorer frame.

 

[SLAYERMIKE]

Guys are using these in there IFS buggies, You could make it work with a drive flange and some fab.
http://www.dynatrac.com/products/pro60irs/pro60irs.html
Or I would go with a Spidertrax or Ruffstuff 9" center section, easier to weld brackets on to.
http://www.spidertrax.com/s.nl/sc.2/category.1247/.f
http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/catalog/FORD9.html

 

[newstylecustoms]

From a strength standpoint the TTB D44 (iron) would be a big upgrade but I speak from experience it is a lot bigger and heavier than the D35 (aluminum) housing. If the 8.8 idea turns out to not be workable you might consider the TTB D35 since it is small, light and high pinion. Either way any high pinion is going to present some challenges to mount and will require lowering the diff to clear the driveshaft.

 

[TheJokersGT]

It would probably be easiest to cut down an expedition frame and put it under your EX, and how difficult would that be other than the obvious cutting, welding and strengthening of the frame itself?