Performance Upgrades

[patrickhunter614]

Has anyone done any performance upgrades on their vehicles? I have a 2014 PI Utility with the 3.7L, looking to do some new exhaust (no one seems to make aftermarket bolt on), and any another upgrades that will make better power out of that motor, thinking of adding a turbo, not sure on the cost though.

Thanks!

 

[shucker1]

Turbo would be expensive.

Why not just exhaust and performance tune?

You may be surprised with the results.

 

[patrickhunter614]

It's not so much about the speed, but the power, there are times when I tow my dual axle car trailer with a few ATV's on it, now the 3.7 can do it, but it struggles up hills and acceleration.

I get the turbo would be expensive, should have just gotten the 3.5... But since I did not, trying to do my best with the 3.7.

I have yet to find any bolt on upgraded exhaust, such as Magnaflow, or flowmaster.

What sort of performance tune would I be able to do to it?

 

[shucker1]

My personal preference is SCT.

Some guys use Lasota Racing or Livernois Motorsports.

Best bet would be to use the search bar with those terms and see what kind of post you can find.

Ever try looking at Gibson Exhaust?

They might have a system you can use.

Some guys don't like the sound though.

 

[patrickhunter614]

I looked up SCT, which one do you use? I kind of like the Livewire TS+. It says that they do not come with pre loaded tunes, is there anyone that sells them with preloaded tunes?

Have not yet looked into Gibson exhaust, does anyone have any personal experience with it on the PI Utility?

 

[peterk9]

I looked up SCT, which one do you use? I kind of like the Livewire TS+. It says that they do not come with pre loaded tunes, is there anyone that sells them with preloaded tunes?

Have not yet looked into Gibson exhaust, does anyone have any personal experience with it on the PI Utility?

Welcome to the Forum Patrick.
I think that most members are running the Livernois tune. Check out the threads in the 'Modified' sub forum or use the Search feature (upper right) to search on Livernois tunes. I know they have them available for the N/A 3.5L V6.

Peter

 

[patrickhunter614]

Thank's Peter!

I will have to check that out. How exactly do those tunes work? Is it a file that you install onto the programmer, then into the vehicle? I have never tuned a vehicle before so pardon my not knowing. Also it seems like there is a lot available for the 3.5 that is not available for the 3.7.

 

[Jack Daniel]

I am looking at the Livernois product . They have a setup for my 3.5na . Right now I can't talk my self into the $713 Cdn dollars (the dollar exchange). Their website has a good explanation how they do the install, which they say is specific per vehicle. They send you a blank programmer,you hook up to your vehicle, pull specific info and e-mail it to them. They then send you a 'tune' to load,looks fairly straight forward.

 

[patrickhunter614]

I would assume the 3.5na is similar to the 3.7na in regards to aftermarket parts and tunes, not as easy to find. When I search the livernois website for my vehicle nothing tune related comes up but I did read about them sending a blank tuner and reads your vehicle then they write a program for you. Does anyone know if they offer a tuner capable of holding 3 or 4 different tunes that you can change somewhat on the fly? For example, I'd like to have a towing tune for when I'm hauling my trailer, but obviously not needed on a day to day basis, so I'd also like to have a MPG and a performance tune as well.

 

[Inane222]

You might check around for any Mustang mods. The 3.7 is straight out of the Mustang coupe from a few years back. I'm sure you'll run into plenty of Mustang parts that won't work on the Explorer, but you may come up with something to give you a little bump in HP.

 

[peterk9]

I would assume the 3.5na is similar to the 3.7na in regards to aftermarket parts and tunes, not as easy to find. When I search the livernois website for my vehicle nothing tune related comes up but I did read about them sending a blank tuner and reads your vehicle then they write a program for you. Does anyone know if they offer a tuner capable of holding 3 or 4 different tunes that you can change somewhat on the fly? For example, I'd like to have a towing tune for when I'm hauling my trailer, but obviously not needed on a day to day basis, so I'd also like to have a MPG and a performance tune as well.

You can always send Livernois a PM with your questions. I hear they are pretty good at helping out.

Peter

 

[patrickhunter614]

I did read a post somewhere that mentioned it was the same motor out of the mustang, but turned sideways in the Explorer.

I did send an email to livernois today, I would assume they are closed on the 4th though, so hopefully I will hear back tomorrow.

 

[patrickhunter614]

Here is the message I received from Livernois today...

"Unfortunately we do not have a tune for the 3.7 NA engine, we have only done the 3.5 version"

 

[Rongoms]

I'm pretty sure that I'm going to annoy some folks wiht this, but it's an opinion based on three decades of auto racing (rallying, specifically).

Chip-tuning a normally aspirated engine will get you virtually nothing. No more noticable power, no better mileage, no more torques. To get these things in an NA engine, you have to do mechanical work, such as raising compression, lightening internal components, etc.
Cold-air intakes (might) give you a few bhp. Same with exhaust, but there simply isn't much evidence that these "gains" are anything more than the placebo-effect in action.

Can you get appreciable gains from a combination of all these things, plus software?
Depends on your definition of appreciable.

A subaru tuner shop did an interesting test back in the early '00s wiht an NA 2.5 RS Impreza. They added a CAI, 2" exhaust, super thin synthetic oil, remapped the engine management system. They spent, according to their quote, about $3000. They dynoed at the wheels before and after the upgrades. (if you ask me, they should have tested after EACH upgrade, not after them all, but I digress)
Total RWHP gains?
12 bhp. There is no way someone is going to notice a 12 bhp difference in normal (non-dyno) driving.

I don't mean to rain on your parade, but it's just too difficult to make a cost-benefit analysis of upgrading an NA engine. (this is likely why Livernois doesn't offer a chip-tune, other than their throttle response solution.)

\flames


If you totally want to nerd-out over dyno graphs, here's one that says largely the same thing as I have.

 

[patrickhunter614]

I'm pretty sure that I'm going to annoy some folks wiht this, but it's an opinion based on three decades of auto racing (rallying, specifically).

Chip-tuning a normally aspirated engine will get you virtually nothing. No more noticable power, no better mileage, no more torques. To get these things in an NA engine, you have to do mechanical work, such as raising compression, lightening internal components, etc.
Cold-air intakes (might) give you a few bhp. Same with exhaust, but there simply isn't much evidence that these "gains" are anything more than the placebo-effect in action.

Can you get appreciable gains from a combination of all these things, plus software?
Depends on your definition of appreciable.

A subaru tuner shop did an interesting test back in the early '00s wiht an NA 2.5 RS Impreza. They added a CAI, 2" exhaust, super thin synthetic oil, remapped the engine management system. They spent, according to their quote, about $3000. They dynoed at the wheels before and after the upgrades. (if you ask me, they should have tested after EACH upgrade, not after them all, but I digress)
Total RWHP gains?
12 bhp. There is no way someone is going to notice a 12 bhp difference in normal (non-dyno) driving.

I don't mean to rain on your parade, but it's just too difficult to make a cost-benefit analysis of upgrading an NA engine. (this is likely why Livernois doesn't offer a chip-tune, other than their throttle response solution.)

\flames


If you totally want to nerd-out over dyno graphs, here's one that says largely the same thing as I have.

Yea, that had kind of been the concensus that I am seeing so far. Looking back I wish I would have known more about the 3.5 engine before I made the purchase, oh well, too late now. It also would probably be more cost efficient to sell the current vehicle and then purchase one with the 3.5 rather than go through a motor swap, does that sound about right?

Thanks for all the input guys. If I stick with the same vehicle I would like to get some new exhaust, just for better sound, but still have no luck finding anything that will fit, has anyone actually done new exhaust on their 3.7?

 

[Jack Daniel]

I'm pretty sure that I'm going to annoy some folks wiht this, but it's an opinion based on three decades of auto racing (rallying, specifically).

Chip-tuning a normally aspirated engine will get you virtually nothing. No more noticable power, no better mileage, no more torques. To get these things in an NA engine, you have to do mechanical work, such as raising compression, lightening internal components, etc.
Cold-air intakes (might) give you a few bhp. Same with exhaust, but there simply isn't much evidence that these "gains" are anything more than the placebo-effect in action.

Can you get appreciable gains from a combination of all these things, plus software?
Depends on your definition of appreciable.

A subaru tuner shop did an interesting test back in the early '00s wiht an NA 2.5 RS Impreza. They added a CAI, 2" exhaust, super thin synthetic oil, remapped the engine management system. They spent, according to their quote, about $3000. They dynoed at the wheels before and after the upgrades. (if you ask me, they should have tested after EACH upgrade, not after them all, but I digress)
Total RWHP gains?
12 bhp. There is no way someone is going to notice a 12 bhp difference in normal (non-dyno) driving.

I don't mean to rain on your parade, but it's just too difficult to make a cost-benefit analysis of upgrading an NA engine. (this is likely why Livernois doesn't offer a chip-tune, other than their throttle response solution.)

\flames


If you totally want to nerd-out over dyno graphs, here's one that says largely the same thing as I have.

Thanks for the knowledgeable input, You saved me some money and frustration.

 

[peterk9]

..........If I stick with the same vehicle I would like to get some new exhaust, just for better sound, but still have no luck finding anything that will fit, has anyone actually done new exhaust on their 3.7?

There are many posts about aftermarket exhausts but they all seem to be for the Sport (Ecoboost). I don't believe anyone has done one on a 3.7 NA engine since the 5th generation Explorer, except for some Police versions, doesn't have that engine. That may be one reason Levittown hasn't developed a 'tune' for it.

Peter

 

[The Captain]

Well the exhaust system is different on the 3.7L than the 3.5L. Its more quiet on idle and in town driving. But under load the 3.7L does have a good growl and much more satisfying than the 3.5L. The Turbo one I think is its own animal which I've been told and has more HP than the 350 ratings. I have never inspected one myself. But as for upgrades I haven't seen that much for the PIU models except a K&N CAI. These cars really don't need much for mods they get going pretty good. Ive surprised a couple Jeep SRT-8s before.

This is someone who owns a Detective PIU

 

[blob19]

Ive surprised a couple Jeep SRT-8s before.

The SRT-8s raced a police interceptor?

 

[PIUtility]

Since I went through this before, I'll remind the class.


A bolt-on for the 3.7 PIU doesnt exist, kinda. Livernois has a cat-back for the Sport that will work, since the "downpipes" are essentially the same, and the PIU is a real dual exhaust, not like the 3.5 which goes 2-1-2. Otherwise most of the other exhausts will require cutting the post-cat flex pipes and possibly having exhaust leaks. Without more air and fuel coming in, bigger pipes out will do almost nothing except make the truck louder, which you can do with your own choice of muffler and be done with it. There's a decently large resonator in the PIU exhaust up front, but even then it will still drone, and drone bad depending what mufflers you use.

Livernois told me they'd do a 3.7 tune, if someone actually came by and let them have the truck. They must be still waiting.....