04 Mountaineer Revival. Engine swap 4.6l --> 5.0l?

[Jonathan Velasco]

Ive had this car for a few months now. Bought it as my first vehicle up here in MI as a winter beater since the motor was already giving issues. Thankfully it lasted me long enough to get thru the winter but the motor no longer runs.

Now that the weather is nice out i thought id take some time to bring this beast back to life. the body and interior of the car is great so id like to keep it around for a good couple years.

I got 3 options i wanted to look into if possible.

1. 5.0 swap if possible
2. Pull another 4.6 from a junk yard and drop it in
3. Rebuild the motor i already have. ( still need to pull it out and open it up to see how bad the damage to it is so far. )


Id really like to know if its possible to drop a 5.0 into this thing and what sort of modifications id have to do to get it done the right way. Any help pointing me in the right direction will be greatly appreciated!!.

 

[drdoom]

I think options 2 and 3 are all you have. Don't think a 5.0 will work.

 

[Joe in NY]

Which 5.0?

The 302W (4.9L Ford called the "5.0")
or the 5.0L Coyote motor in the Mustangs?

 

[TechGuru]

Why not the 5.4L Triton since it's the other option to the 4.6L on F150's of that generation at least.

 

[drdoom]

I don't know but I seem to recall perusing a thread here and there was talk about space constraints regarding the Coyote...
http://www.explorerforum.com/forums...0-to-4-6-dohc-swap.416783/page-4#post-3500151

 

[Joe in NY]

The 351W (5.8L) V8 is Physically smaller in every dimension than the 4.6L SOHC. That is how big and space wasting these modular V8s are. It would be easier to fit a good ol' 351W than the 4.6 which is already pretty well packed in these explorers. Now imagine how tight that 5.4 SOHC will be...

I really would like to drop a 351W in an Explorer one day. Easy to get gobs of mid-range torque and hp from one.

 

[MyExplorer03v8Lim]

I'm in the same situation with an 03 limited. Very nice explorer, but engine seems to be gone.

I'm not an engine guy, so I'm faced with a shop installing a Jasper engine for $53-6300, depending on who you talk to. Versus one engine shop who will use a reman engine of unknown brand with a 1yr warranty for $3600. The price sounds right for what youd find on eBay in the reman engines for $2400, plus his labor. The labor seems cheap at 1200, but maybe he's hungry.

And then there's the idea of putting it in myself, which I know I could learn to do, though it'd take me all summer and maybe cost me more than 1200 in tools.

 

[Joe in NY]

I'm in the same situation with an 03 limited. Very nice explorer, but engine seems to be gone.

I'm not an engine guy, so I'm faced with a shop installing a Jasper engine for $53-6300, depending on who you talk to. Versus one engine shop who will use a reman engine of unknown brand with a 1yr warranty for $3600. The price sounds right for what youd find on eBay in the reman engines for $2400, plus his labor. The labor seems cheap at 1200, but maybe he's hungry.

And then there's the idea of putting it in myself, which I know I could learn to do, though it'd take me all summer and maybe cost me more than 1200 in tools.

Stay AWAY From Jasper Engines.

We are in the middle of a HUGE headache with them. In less than 1 (yes One) year we will be getting warranty engine #2. This will be the third Jasper engine going into our Suburban. The first two engines that failed are indeed a fault on Jasper. The first replacement engine was put in by yahoos who don't know what they are doing. Charged hundreds of dollars for parts they broke and other things that Jasper won't cover.

The first replacement engine lasted less than a month. After 50 miles it started ticking extremely loud in the top end. Tried telling them and they ignored me. So I made a youtube video and sent it in. They called me numerous times trying to immediately reach me. What do you know.. The motor was sent out with bad internals and has to be replaced! It was put in last month! Yes in May and it is already bad!

The original Jasper engine that was installed last summer drank 3 quarts going down the highway on May 8th. Refilled it, it drank it again and lost all oil pressure. The car literally said "Stop Driving". Turns out oil had never been getting to the heads and someone at Jasper screwed up because the oil relief valve (which they "upgraded") came apart and went through the oil pump shattering it.

Just some info for when considering Jasper. (my uncle is a mechanic in Florida who extremely good with cars and we trust him a great deal. He is Jasper certified and is very upset with our situation and feels bad for this happening after we followed him with getting a Jasper engine)

 

[shadowless127]

The Coyote fits in the 4th gen engine bay, so it should fit in the 3rd gen engine bay. I think the hardest part is thinking about what transmission to go with since the 5r55 most likely will not be suitable for the power of the Coyote.

If you have the time, money, tools, knowledge, and space, I would just rebuild the engine you have if it's salvageable. You can also add some go-fast goodies while you have the engine torn apart.

 

[Harpua216]

the best option is pulling the motor you have and finding out whats wrong with it. For the cost of a Jasper, with some patience, you can find another 04 complete for the same price.

Why the motor you have? To me, its better to deal with the engine problems I already have rather the someone elses new problems.

These engines are pretty solid other than their Achilles heels and if done right can last very long. Once its out, they get simpler.

Now my buddys mantra is, by the time you tear down the old engine, you can have a junkyard one in there in half the time. He is right, but he always seems to be "pulling" the engine or rebuilding an old one.

as far as a 5.0 or higher, you will run out of space in the bay quickly and some of the accessories will need modification (been there, done that. fun at first, then not so fun) and either a very smart tune for the gear ratios or potentially another transmission (or custom plate).

if it were just dropping the engine with no fuss id say go for it, but theres lots to do and it becomes a bigger project, quickly.

 

[MyExplorer03v8Lim]

To me, its better to deal with the engine problems I already have rather the someone elses new problems.

These engines are pretty solid other than their Achilles heel...

What is their Achilles heel?

 

[Harpua216]

What is their Achilles heel?

Mainly the timing chain tensioners. they were made with plastic the gets very brittle after about 50-100K and start to wear or break up in the engine.. The chains themselves follow next because they start to stretch.

The worst one is when the timing actually jumps. then, basically, its time for another engine.

 

[shadowless127]

What is their Achilles heel?

I think he's referring to the plastic chain cassettes.

 

[Joe in NY]

the best option is pulling the motor you have and finding out whats wrong with it. For the cost of a Jasper, with some patience, you can find another 04 complete for the same price.

Why the motor you have? To me, its better to deal with the engine problems I already have rather the someone elses new problems.

These engines are pretty solid other than their Achilles heels and if done right can last very long. Once its out, they get simpler.

Now my buddys mantra is, by the time you tear down the old engine, you can have a junkyard one in there in half the time. He is right, but he always seems to be "pulling" the engine or rebuilding an old one.

as far as a 5.0 or higher, you will run out of space in the bay quickly and some of the accessories will need modification (been there, done that. fun at first, then not so fun) and either a very smart tune for the gear ratios or potentially another transmission (or custom plate).

if it were just dropping the engine with no fuss id say go for it, but theres lots to do and it becomes a bigger project, quickly.

It all depends which motor he puts in. He could go with a 351W and have MORE room. The 351W is physically smaller than the 4.6 SOHC.

Jasper SUCKS. Stay away

 

[Harpua216]

It all depends which motor he puts in. He could go with a 351W and have MORE room. The 351W is physically smaller than the 4.6 SOHC.

Jasper SUCKS. Stay away

I believe he would have to then modify or at least get a plate for the trans bellhousing. I know that 351W would fit in my in my 99 mountaineer beautifully, and match up the the transmission like butter. but I think some mods have to be done to link that up to the 55R5, though i havent done any looking into that. there would be some more room for sure and you can get a lot out of those 351's - but they are sought after by the newer and classic mustang people pretty hard core.

 

[Joe in NY]

Yes he would have to modify. I'm just stating that more displacement does not mean a physically bigger motor.

 

[shadowless127]

You also have to keep in mind local laws.

For example, it would be illegal for me to drop a 302W or 351W into a 3rd gen and drive it on the street because the engine is older than the vehicle.

Also, I don't understand all the hate for the 4.6. Just build the friggin thing and be done with it. H/C/I and some boost and you're done. No need to modify EVERYTHING.

 

[Harpua216]

You also have to keep in mind local laws.

For example, it would be illegal for me to drop a 302W or 351W into a 3rd gen and drive it on the street because the engine is older than the vehicle.

Also, I don't understand all the hate for the 4.6. Just build the friggin thing and be done with it. H/C/I and some boost and you're done. No need to modify EVERYTHING.

not that anyone would know, but that is interesting, i did not know that, is that local or federal law?

 

[D Hook]

You also have to keep in mind local laws.

For example, it would be illegal for me to drop a 302W or 351W into a 3rd gen and drive it on the street because the engine is older than the vehicle.

I'd be interested in hearing more about this too.