2000 Mountaineer blew front diff...possible to "downgrade" to 2WD?

[sshanky]

Hello everyone!

My friend's 2000 Mountaineer (same as explorer of that year, right?) blew the front differential on a road trip and instead of spending the 1000 the mechanic says it will cost to replace it, I was thinking we could just remove it and make it a 2wd vehicle.

I read on this forum somewhere about using the ends of the half shafts to keep the wheels on, but somehow something went wrong and after the project the wheel fell off.

We're trying to figure out what the right way to do this is, and if it's possible to do safely and reliably. The car has about 150k miles on it but runs great and has never had a problem until now. We live in AZ so we really do NOT need 4wd for any reason, and would actually enjoy saving money on the improvement in gas mileage I would expect, and the reduction in weight.

Is this doable? Thanks a lot for your thoughts!

 

[thebrakeman]

Not know exactly what you did (or didn't do), it's hard to give you any help. I believe 2WD and 4WD (stock) will have different hub & bearing assemblies, and perhaps even unique steering knuckles and other components.

So it sounds like you are not wanting to change over everything (to make it like a stock 2WD), but rather cobble something together with minimal cost.

I would go to a mechanic you trust, and ask them about it. Has it been done? Can it be done? You may find that they can do it for a very reasonable cost. Or they may simply tell you what you need to do, if they feel it's not worth their time.

 

[drdoom]

A moderator on here named MountaineerGreen posted in the CV axle thread how to do it.

 

[sshanky]

Thanks, I'll have to check out that thread. In the meantime, here's what happened: The mechanic did his thing (Not sure exactly what he did, but he drove the car for 8 miles and felt that it was working fine), then when my friend picked up the vehicle, the front left wheel fell off about a block out of the parking lot. I was happy no one was hurt...my friend was fine, and I'm really glad the wheel didn't fall off while the mechanic (a friend of mine) was test driving the vehicle on the highway!

So, he just finished working on it, and feels really horrible about what happened, and feels like there will not be a problem again. I have to talk to him about what he did -- I don't know exactly and I have not had a chance to look underneath.

Meanwhile, my friend (the owner) just went outside to her car, which is parked on a slight incline, and she swears it rolled downhill a bit. Is this possible? I do remember reading something about needing to set the parking brake now that the front diff. is no longer in place...anyone know?

I made the car roll a bit, then put it in park, and it stopped instantly...I didn't notice any slipping at all.

Now my friend is a bit nervous about driving. I want to be sure she is safe. Please, let me know if you have any thoughts.

Thanks so much.

 

[MountaineerGreen]

Steve,

You have a few problems, I don't have a whole lot of time to explain, so read this then search threads for more detailed info if needed.

When the mechanic cut the half-shafts out of the CV axles, he undoubtedly plugged the holes in the diff with the diff side, but I'm betting he didn't put the stubs back in the wheel bearings. The stubs are what holds the bearing together, and that is why your wheel fell off.

Secondly, I'll bet your front diff isn't whats bad, its more likely your transfer case if you have a v8 and AWD. With the front driveshaft removed, your Mountaineer will roll even in park, the AWD transfer case slips some power to the front, with no transfer case, the output shaft turns and the vehicle rolls. The only way to fix it is to replace the transfer case or transfer case chain. The front end was making a popping sound under acceleration, correct?

My suggestion- repair or replace the transfer case, you can buy a chain from Ford to fix it for around $150, cheaper than that online. Get a mechanic to split the case and replace the chain and its fixed. Put the driveshaft back, depending on year it may be bad, but Napa makes a great HD replacement for that. Put the cv axles back and keep it AWD, the conversion to 2wd is an expensive one to do right because it requires a transmission.

 

[sshanky]

Hi! Thanks for the great reply. That might be the reason the wheels came off. I am guessing he's rectified that issue by now. The initial problem, though, started when my friend was driving on a highway and started to experience a loss of power and strange grating or grinding noises. When she finally stopped there was splattered oil underneath the front of the car but no fluids appeared to be low. After that the mechanic diagnosed the exploded front differential.

So, the park lock must be somewhere in the transmission, before the transfer case, right? That would explain why it could slip and roll downhill if there is nothing connected to the front output of the transfer case.

The reason for this type of disconnection was to avoid spending so much on a 150k miles car that might have more problems coming its way. My friend never uses 4wd and would probably enjoy getting better than 13 to 15 mpg as she's poor!

Do you think that it's safe as it is? Should I verify anything with him? Or do you think it's got to be repaired with a new differential (or chain in the transfer case -- is there an easy way to be sure if it's the diff or the chain?)?

Thanks a lot, again...

 

[sshanky]

Oh, your question about the clicking noise under acceleration -- it was not making any popping noises until the sudden degradation in power/speed on the highway from Phoenix to Flagstaff. Suddenly the car couldn't go faster than 70, then 60, then 50, etc. She kept driving it until the noise got loud and then pulled over. I think it all happened in a span of five minutes or so.

 

[sshanky]

Hi again

Just talked to the mechanic to find out what he did. He ended up cutting the stubs off and attaching them to the backs of the wheel bearings. It works fine now, other than the supposed rolling on an incline. I am still confused about how the car can roll in park sometimes, but other times not at all. Last night, I let the car roll about 1 or 2 mph and then put it into park, and it stopped and didn't roll at all. But even though we don't exactly remember where we parked it, it seems that it had rolled downhill a few feet in the few hours it had sat outside.

Now that this is all done, and there's no clicking sound, am I safe? Can I keep it like this?

Thanks again.

 

[PopRichie77]

Just don't rely on park to hold the the vehicle, till you try it on a steep hill . 1 to 2 mph is not a good test..

 

[sshanky]

I'll make sure she knows that. It was interesting how it only rolled a little bit and not while we were out there. The driveway it was on is only slightly slanted. But I couldn't push it down, or make it happen. There's some friction there, I wonder what from.

 

[MountaineerGreen]

We've had the rolling in park discussion countless times. It is the way the 4404 handles power that causes the problem, the transmission is in park, yes, but the 4404 uses a viscous coupling between the front and rear driveshafts. Meaning if the front driveshaft is absent, the front output can turn, allowing the rear output to turn, making the whole vehicle move. There is no fix other than a new front diff and a driveshaft. Fuel savings without the front diff are not significant, the font output is still "using" power from the engine whether you are utilizing it or not.

 

[PopRichie77]

Thanks, MountaineerGreen, I understand why it moves, your explanation is good, I suggested the steep hill so that they could actually see that it won't hold in park.

 

[sshanky]

Thanks guys. We will proceed accordingly. I'll update the post if there are any interesting things to report.

 

[sshanky]

One smaller tire!

update:

today we had the car in the shop and the mechanic noticed that the rear left tire is 225/75, the others are all 235. We never bothered to check that, as we bought new tires all around 3 years ago and obviously trusted the seller.

We noticed that the car has been leaning slightly to the left for a long time and assumed it was the spring or something else. Now we know why.

the mechanic thought it might have something to do with the blowing up of the front differential (since the wheel rotated faster than the rest). He also thinks it might have something to do with why the ABS makes noise on braking sometimes (infrequently, but sort of scary when it does, since the car doesn't want to stop)...

So time for a new tire (or set).