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Bkennedy's SAS and Rebuild Thread

Discussion in 'Offroad Projects' started by BKennedy, June 4, 2013.

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  1. Kirby N.

    Kirby N. Elite Explorer

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    The more they lean the less effective they are because they move less per wheel travel. You are having to make a lot of compromises- but I don’t think you have a ton of options. The only way you could that long shock in there vertical is if you out boarded and got it in the wheel well. Which I am sure is a pain.
     
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  3. gmanpaint

    gmanpaint It's Always Something! Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    The upper looks too far back to me.

    If it helps, I will put an angle finder on my rear 10" shock tomorrow. Might help you out a little with upper placement.

    The lower mount, can it be placed on top of the tube, to gain some shock travel?
     
  4. BKennedy

    BKennedy Elite Loser Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    The axle mount could be placed anywhere, but I like to keep them on the sides of the axle to help with any possible axle wrap. I know the upper is leaning pretty far back. I haven't figured out the travel of these new leaf springs, but they drop a lot when the weight is taken off of them. A lot of rebound and not a lot of compression as they are limited by being directly under the frame. This is going to make shock placement difficult because I am trying to get the most out of the springs. Besides all the junk I have under there isn't helping. I will try again tomorrow, this time taking measurements of ride height, full rebound and estimated compression. I could take the leaf packs apart, leaving the upper leaf but I can also measure to the compressed bump instead.

    Don't think measuring the angle of your shocks will help. I think I need to figure out mounts, then measure for new shocks. If anyone wants nearly new 8" travel 5125 Bilsteins with 225/70 valving, I might have two sets up for sale soon.

    I will post up with ride height, rebound and compression measurements.
     
    Last edited: February 11, 2020
  5. Stic-o

    Stic-o Elite Movie Star Elite Explorer

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    Your thinking you should have joined the FW axle club now and saved your self some headaches:D
     
  6. BKennedy

    BKennedy Elite Loser Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    I went back to look at when I redid the shock mounts last. It was November 2014. Starts on page 43 of this thread.
    This guy helped a lot, but he is no longer on the board.
     
  7. BKennedy

    BKennedy Elite Loser Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    I took some measurements.

    Rebound or droop is 6" from ride height.
    Compression is 5" from ride height (limited by bumps).

    I think my 8" shocks are going to be way too short.

    I'm thinking I might need something like this
    Rancho RS9000XL Shock Absorber - P/N: RS999028
     
    Last edited: February 12, 2020
  8. gmanpaint

    gmanpaint It's Always Something! Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    Those XL shocks work well. I run them on the 94, and used to run them on the 95.

    Not sure if it matters to you, but you have to run the XL, with the can on the bottom mount, & rod to the top. I noticed your mounting them the opposite.

    The RS7000MT series are Monotube, and can be mounted either direction. Those also work very well, and are comparable to the B 5100's. I happen to have a like new set of them in the 10" travel size (RS7286) in a box, getting ready to sell on CL. lol
     
  9. BKennedy

    BKennedy Elite Loser Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    Thanks. The Bilsteins are supposed to be run with the can on top. That's actually the only thing I don't like about the 9000's is the can on the bottom where the rocks are. I have had 9000's before but it was a long time ago but I remember losing a few knobs to rocks. I thought they might be a good option since I use the Explorer for different things and sometimes it has 300 or so extra pounds in the back.
     
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  10. BKennedy

    BKennedy Elite Loser Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    I have been thinking about the upper shock mounts for several days and the best I can figure is I should rebuild the one I had, but stronger. The only location I can figure that will allow me to run the longest shocks possible without cutting holes through the floor. The upper cross bar is still intact so I think I can run sleeve it with another piece of DOM, then rebuild the tubes running up to it in front of where I had them so everything will be straight, and stronger. I have a pretty good idea about how I want to do that.

    The only issue I can think of with using the old cross bar might not be an issue at all. The shock mounts on the cross bar mount the shock bushings perpendicular to the axle. I want to run the new axle mounts parallel but keep the old upper mount perpendicular.

    Does anyone see any issues with having shock bushings 90* to each other top and bottom?

    Old cross bar with multiple mounting points
    20200131_143936.jpg

    Or, should I just order these?
    Axle Side Mount Shock Bracket, Pair

    I also think I can build something similar with that I have here.
     
    Last edited: February 13, 2020
  11. Kirby N.

    Kirby N. Elite Explorer

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    No issue. It will use the bushings through travel but that is what they are for. I have used a shock mount for an xj that would work good for your lowers. Seems like the stock ones and some of the aftermarket ones have a slot in the so the ubolts go through and it gets the mount even further out. Then they have a stud mount. I would try to do something like that if I were you
     
  12. Kirby N.

    Kirby N. Elite Explorer

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  13. Kirby N.

    Kirby N. Elite Explorer

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    The groove might be on the wrong side on one side
     
  14. BKennedy

    BKennedy Elite Loser Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    I think I got it figured out. I cut off the ends of the old cross member and it can be sleeved with 1.25" OD tube. I have some on hand, but its not thick enough wall. Off to the metal supply store I go.
     
  15. BKennedy

    BKennedy Elite Loser Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    The sleeve material I needed was actually 1-1/8" OD. The metal supply store had some remnants of that OD, but 1/4" wall. A little thick, but I didn't want to purchase a entire stick so I grabbed what they had. Besides, I wanted it beefier, well that's about as beef as beef gets. Spent several hours on it today while the wife was at work. The upper mount is nearly finished. Its a lot like the previous version, but I did it all in 90* angles which gave me more room. I also figured out if I unbolted the box around the gas tank fill neck, I can move the fill and vent tube well out of the way of the welder.
    The first thing I did was something that I didn't think was going to work. Sleeve the old 1.5" OD tube with the shock mounts already welded to it. It was a very tight fit. I drilled a few holes on each side for plug welds, figuring I would knock the sleeve tubing in as far as it would go, cut it to size and knock it into the other side. I lightly ran over the entire sleeve material with a flap disc, then coated it with white lithium grease. It took some effort with a BFH, but it went all the way through the tube.
    20200214_113236.jpg
    Fab'd up new side pieces with big gussets this time. Not sure if I am going to plug the ends of the tube. Its so thick its not like its going to rust. Might go find some plastic plugs to knock in there.
    20200214_163147.jpg
    20200214_163150.jpg
    The passenger side frame actually sits almost 2" lower that driver side at this location so I had to measure ten times, cut once.

    Overall picture, cross bar is just set in there for mock-up.
    20200214_163205.jpg
    There is enough room for me to fully weld the cross bar to the uprights, then add more gussets. Its tighter to the underside of the body and it used all the space possible this time. I also moved it back a little over an inch. Need to get the air compressor remounted to make sure it clears before welding it together. I need to fully weld the cross bar to the uprights and the side bars into their sleeves after I measure, order and receive new shocks. Need to wait for new shocks before building the axle mounts to get them set right. Also going to add a gusset from the bottom of the square tube welded to the frame to the inside bottom C-channel. That should keep the top of the frame from flexing so much, which is what I think killed the old mount.
     
  16. BKennedy

    BKennedy Elite Loser Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    I ordered the Rancho RS9000XL's, RS999028. They were the only one's I could find with about 10" travel that should fit. Got them on Amazon for $97 each from Rancho. They are set prices everywhere else at $117, so I was surprised to see them there cheaper. They should be in tomorrow or Wednesday.

    Today I installed the RedHead steering gear. Since I have done it a bunch of times, it went quickly. Also having the fluid cooler makes it much less messy because I disconnect the return line where it meets the hose that comes from the cooler. That hose is long and I can pull it down so all the fluid runs into the pan, completely draining the system. The hardest part of the job is holding that heavy box up with my left arm while trying to thread a bolt with the right. My left shoulder has some tendon issues and let me know quickly it was not happy. Its sitting overnight as per their bleeding instructions. Replaced both hoses with Gates and added a in-line fluid filter. There is no play in the new steering gear. RedHead already refunded me my deposit because I sent the OEM steering gear I pulled out of the donor Explorer. Had to cut the pitman arm off, gotta love Ohio. I am going to take the lifetime warranty steering gear and hoses back to AutoZone get replacements. Might sell them or just throw them in a box for when someone needs them.
    Rock Auto has a bunch of this;
    20200217_142501.jpg

    If anyone is interested, I am selling the Bilstein's I took off the Explorer
    Bilstein 5125 Series 8.25" Travel Shocks - auto parts - by owner -...
     
    Last edited: February 17, 2020 at 7:38 PM
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  17. BKennedy

    BKennedy Elite Loser Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    Amazon truck showed up this morning with one shock. The other should be here someday soon. The one shock should be enough to get the mounts built. Don't have time today, so maybe tomorrow.
     
  18. BKennedy

    BKennedy Elite Loser Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    I got all the mounts built and tacked in place today. Took all day because I spent about an hour trying to figure out why there is a 1/2" difference in length between the right side mounts and the left side mounts when all the mounts are correct. Then I pushed up on the side of the Explorer and ended up with a little less than a 1/4". I was trying to figure that out when my Dad's voice came into my head and reminded me I am "not building the f#$&ing space shuttle". I had to make compromises to get a shock long enough to use most of the leaf spring travel. They are a little lower than I wanted, and leaned in more than I wanted. I should have 5.5" compression and rebound.

    I couldn't find a axle mount I liked so I turned this
    20200208_122230.jpg
    Into this
    20200219_134040.jpg
    20200219_134054.jpg
    I had to weld the nut into the mount because it ends up about 1/8" off the axle.
    20200219_155959.jpg

    I didn't realize how big the 2.75" shock body is on those Rancho's until you pick one up.
    The angle isn't too bad.
    20200219_161505.jpg
    I should get it finish welded tomorrow and back on its feet.

    Edit: I forgot about something until I was washing my hair. While I was getting everything situated, the cross bar fell off its uprights. Of course, it landed directly on my head, then my elbow, then my shin. I was reminded of this when I felt the egg on my head.
     
    Last edited: February 19, 2020 at 9:14 PM

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