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Build your Wrangler fighter here!

Discussion in 'Auto Industry News' started by Rick, August 10, 2000.

^^Searches ExplorerForum.com^^





  1. rpenner54

    rpenner54 Moderator Emeritus Moderator Emeritus

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    Re: AHEM... Back to the Subject

    Wrinkled Sheet metal rules!!! :D
     
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  3. donkey boy

    donkey boy Well-Known Member

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    Bronco as Defender Sports Version

     
  4. AFUinCO

    AFUinCO New Member

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    Your wishes may come true!

    Again, I strolled in from another forum, and have posted a thread on what I saw when I attended a market research study a couple weeks ago.

    http://www.outdoorwire.com/ubb/Forum68/HTML/000752.html

    A couple observations since and reading your thread here.

    1) I am not sure if it is 2002 or 2003, but this IS going to be built SOON. Personal feelings are very good. The sizing is comparable to an Explorer/Eplorer Sport and Rodeo/Rodeo Sport(Amigo), slighty larger than the Wrangler and Cherokee.

    2) I did not see any type of option for a larger engine than the 4.0, although I did suggest the 4.6L V-8 or somethin of that nature.

    3) Why on Earth is Ford changing the Explorer to 4WIS in 2002?! That is obnoxious!


    HTH,
     
  5. GJarrett

    GJarrett Elite Explorer Moderator Emeritus

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    Michael, you are right of course. I should have worded my thought a little differently. I was thinking exactly like you -- I don't want a Defender, but the drivetrain and base vehicle can still be used to make a real Retro-Bronco with another body. My thought was that going that route would cut out a billion or so in capital development expenses (enabling a much more affordable MSRP to the consumer since Ford wouldn't have to amortize that expense into the line), and get the project into the market a year or two sooner.

    I still want a Retro-Bronco, not a Defender. All your points are dead on, excellently worded, and precisely what I had in mind but worded poorly.

    AFUinCO: I just read your link. That is very exciting news. Do you have any pictures, etc?

    [Edited by GJarrett on 08-22-2000 at 02:06 PM]
     
  6. AFUinCO

    AFUinCO New Member

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    Sorry,

    No cameras were allowed. They were VERY impressive though. Unfortunate they choose to run IFS/torsion springs, and NOT offer a "push-button locker". I was always a big fan of the "ORIGINAL BRONCO".
     
  7. donkey boy

    donkey boy Well-Known Member

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    TEAMWORK!!

    Gerald, I'm thankful you understood what I ment :) English not being my native language let's me sometimes struggle to come to the exact point ;)

    Would be nice to be invited by Ford for a little brainstorming, wouldn't it? :D

    [Edited by donkey boy on 08-22-2000 at 02:32 PM]
     
  8. GJarrett

    GJarrett Elite Explorer Moderator Emeritus

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    Re: Pictures?

    Michael, I don't recall Rick starting very many meaningless threads for no particular reason. I have a feeling you may have already been invited and have already brainstormed. ;)
     
  9. Not Yet

    Not Yet New Member

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    Bronco Proto

    Thanks for sharing the info, Keith...I'm always starving for news on this topic, so anytime anyone hears anything, share it! How the hell did you get in on that deal, anyway?

    Overall, I'm very happy that it'll be a retro/throwback to the early Bronco...the most capable out-of-the box 'wheeler ever, in the eyes of those of us who love 'em so.

    After reading your "report" on the Proto Bronco...I'm still excited, but it's tempered by what I'd feared- Inferior Front Suspension. When the AP article mentioned it would share a chassis with the Ranger, I figured as much, but will continue to hope and lobby for a SOLID FRONT AXLE. Remember, the 2002 Wrangler is rumored to have IFS, so a solid-axle Bronco would stand out and above in that important aspect.

    From a marketing standpoint, I think of Jeep (Wrangler) drivers in 3 groups: Group #1, the hard-core Jeep crowd ("...you wouldn't understand"). Group #2, the folks that drive Jeeps because they're the most capable stock 'wheeler on the market. Group #3, the expatriots, specifically from Ford, who finally got sick and tired of waiting for a capable 'wheeler (read: BRONCO) with a blue oval on it.

    Group #1 is untouchable...forget about them. It's Groups #2 & 3 that a new Bronco can win over/back. Build a Bronco in the true spirit of the original, and they (we) will come. Build another version of the Explorer, and we're (still) gone. HUGE opportunity to do right by some loyal people, and win business from those who only care about (off-road) performance, not the nameplate.

    I've pretty much decided that I won't buy a new truck until this new one unfolds. If it's a real Bronco, I'll buy it. If not, I'm buying a Jeep. Plain and simple.

    SOLID AXLES
    MANUAL, MANUAL, MANUAL
    -Transfer Case, Transmission, Hubs
    V8 OPTION
    DIESEL OPTION

    I want more, but I'm focusing my mantra on what I consider essential.
     
  10. AFUinCO

    AFUinCO New Member

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    How I got in that market research study

    Well, I received a letter saying that since I was the owner of a 99 Amigo (one of the camparing vehicles), that I was selected to participate in this study. I called the number did a survey, they called back a week later with another qualifying survey and I went down to the studay a couple weeks later. Was compensated for my time, and really enjoyed the experience. That's about it.

    On another note, as far as "capable, out of the box vehicle", the 98+ Amigo is a very stout and capable package with the 3.2L V6.
    Even though it unfortunately has IFS, we are shouting for a solid axle, it has about the most IFS travel I have ever seen in an IFS.
    Where the third member mounts, the amount of lift required for a solid conversion isn't worth it IMHO.

    Feel free to stop by the http://www.4x4wire.com forums. There is a lot of good information there too.
     
  11. Paul Gagnon

    Paul Gagnon Poseur SUV Moderator Emeritus

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    Bronco Bronco Bronco

    If Ford does this right they will have another run away success just like the Explorer. Only thing is that there should ONLY be a two door model not a four door. And it NEEDS to have a solid axle in the front. NO IFS!!! NO IFS!!!! Did I say NO IFS?
     
  12. donkey boy

    donkey boy Well-Known Member

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    Paul, why no 4 door?

    A 4 door convertible or with hardtop would be pretty :cool: unique. Just as long as the wheelbase is not more than about 100 inches. My opinion.

    p.s. And I think you forgott to say: NO IFS :D :D
     
  13. Paul Gagnon

    Paul Gagnon Poseur SUV Moderator Emeritus

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    The Explorer is the 4 door wouldn't you say?
     
  14. Sandy

    Sandy Well-Known Member

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    Hello to all,
    I have not read all of the posts but great ideas.

    Ford has under the Defender badge a great vehicle; I have seen a number of tests in different truck mags where the Defender bettered the Jeep. Not by much but it was better.

    My opinion is that Ford should upgrade the Defender with heavier axles, at least a 44 in the front and rear full floater or maybe 60's all the way around, a NV4500 5-speed or HD five speed auto, both with granny low option, the T/C like the Atlas II. The engine, well that can be a problem, I guess the engine could be either the 4.6 or bring back the 5.0L, the turbo diesel sounds interesting too. The engine cannot be too large or heavy and don't forget a really flexable suspension.
    Sell it under a Ford badge, call it "The Ford Tuff Truck". The nameplate can be "FTT".

    Hey, how about a contest to name a new Ford Wrangler Killer.


    Tnx for listening,


    [Edited by Sandy on 08-28-2000 at 09:41 AM]
     
  15. donkey boy

    donkey boy Well-Known Member

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    Sandy

    Your post sounds like a great alternative to a Defender :D

    I personally would not mess with the Defender's drivetrain, except for the main gearbox. Axles are pretty strong, if something breaks, it's the halfshafts, which are easy to replace. If you want, you can add an ARB in the rear. The transfercase is the absolute best thing I know, specially because the central diff can be locked indipendently, in high and low gears, mechanicly with the same lever you shift the lowbox. Just the main gearbox is not really famous (I killed one after just 4000 miles, not my fault, honestly :D ).
     
  16. donkey boy

    donkey boy Well-Known Member

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    Wrangler Fighter "Cup"

    OK, maybe I take it already one step too far here: In Europe, there are race series on circuits ("cups") where identical cars, mostly inexpensive compacts, compete against eachother. The cars can be bought at the dealership readily equipped with rollbar, beefed-up engine and suspension etc. (OK, then, they are not sooo inexpensive anymore). What that factory does not offer, is illegal for the races, which keeps costs resonable.

    Why not taking the cup idea of identical cars competing against eachother off road? What about Ford offering a "cup version" of the Wrangler fighter (with taller wheels, locking differential and some other goodies for example) and then organizing a series of off road events througout the country.

    The events could be something like RTV trials, which are extremely popular throughout Europe (you need to pass obstacles without touching the poles marking the way. Touching the poles, reversing, using several attemps to pass an obstacle etc. gets punished with penalty points. Winner is who adds up the fewest points) Trials mostly are non-damaging to the vehicle and therefore a good oportunity for newbys to get off road experience without risking too much. On the other hand, it requires extreme driving skills for not adding up lot's of penalty points, which means it's very challanging and competitive for the experienced 4-wheelers. Just drivers who really dominate their rig have a chance for over all victory.

    Compared to other motor sports events, trials are not very expensive, but they are very attractive for spectators, because there is a lot of action going on in a restricted area. They could help Ford to establsih themselves in the 4-wheel community.

    Just an idea on Labor Day :D

    [Edited by donkey boy on 09-04-2000 at 08:30 AM]
     
  17. BExplorer

    BExplorer Active Member

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    Trials

    I agree with donkey boy, trial groups would be great. Even for my actual Explorer, it would be fun to get my wife to know more about 4x4 other than "I broke an axle,and the trans...". I dont want extreme trail, just some occasionnal fun with my stock four by.
     
  18. donkey boy

    donkey boy Well-Known Member

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    No new ideas?

    Just pushing this thread back to the top of the list!
     
  19. rpenner54

    rpenner54 Moderator Emeritus Moderator Emeritus

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    New ideas? No not really. Accually I just sit there and think that its gonna be cheaper for me to build something the way I want to then to wait for a manufacturer to come out with anything worth while. So I would much prefer to start with something older anyway. :) Something simple. :) KISS is something that is totaly lost on most car makers at this point in time.
     
  20. SteveVB

    SteveVB Elite Explorer

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    It looks like Ford is going to bring back the Defender to the US. A redesign to make it more " recreation friendly", less military and farm like. Hope they dont go too far. Will still be a premium branded product, meaning $$$$$- maybe they debadge it and sell it as a Ford Ex???...

    Blurb this am

    http://www.auto.com/autonews/iwirf20_20000920.htm
     
  21. Goober

    Goober Well-Known Member

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    All I see in this rebadging is the company to make another well prices 'Yuppie' cruiser. Telling the people that the redesigned defender( whatever the new name is) is sporting a full floating locker in the rear and manual hub,.... are selling points to only a select few who are going to use them to their fullest. I look at Infinity, BMW, Mercedes and see nothing but people trying to impress someone else with their trophy. Spend the money on whatever you want now, or save it for later when you will need it.

    I know, kinda off the subject.
     

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