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Next project vehicle?

Discussion in 'Need for Speed!' started by 2000StreetRod, November 9, 2014.

^^Searches ExplorerForum.com^^
  1. 2000StreetRod

    2000StreetRod Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    Pre-Luber Test 1

    This morning I kluged together a setup for my first test of the pre-luber. The pump came fitted with -10 (or -12) O ring to -6 AN adapter at the outlet port and -10 (or -12) O ring to -8 AN (I think) adapter at the inlet port. The collection of fittings that came with the pre-luber contained appropriate hose barb fittings for 13/32 in. dia. and 1/2 in. dia. hose that I had on hand. The lift is about 24 inches from the bottom of the bucket containing a gallon of old oil to the top bend of the inlet hose. I inserted a small flat blade screwdriver into the yellow wire connector and connected the battery charger negative alligator clip to the screwdriver shaft. The positive alligator clip is connected to the red wire terminal.
    Test1.jpg
    The pump motor ran fast just a few seconds after the battery charger was plugged into the extension cord and then slowed when oil reached the pump. I didn't have time to measure the flow but there was considerable activity in the bucket. Current flow is about 15 amps at turn on and then varies between 10 and 12 amps continuously. The pump is not very quiet laying on the metal step stool but came with 3 mounting insulators that should quiet it some. My next test will be to measure the flow and then add a pressure gauge and an outlet restriction to compare the flow under pressure. 11 amps at 13.6 volts equals 150 watts or .2 hp. The current flow will probably increase with pressure. I have a 30 amp relay that should be adequate to enable/disable the pump.

    Edit: The pump flow with the hose configuration shown about 1.5 gal/min. which is less than RB Racing's smaller pump ($300) rated 2.6 gal/min at 0 psi.
    oilpumps_034_035.jpg
     
    Last edited: September 24, 2016
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  3. 2000StreetRod

    2000StreetRod Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    My 2003 Explorer/Mountaineer Workshop Manual and Wiring Diagrams arrived today.
    ShopManuals.jpg
    While glancing thru the workshop manual I realized that for the 3rd generation models the integrated radiator/transmission cooler has been eliminated. My 2004 Aviator workshop manual also indicates no liquid-to-liquid transmission cooler in the radiator. My experience indicates that liquid-to-liquid coolers are more efficient than air-to-liquid coolers but when the latter fails there is contamination of the coolant with ATF or vice versa. The ATF cooler mounted in front of the radiator is fairly large and may be adequate but I haven't really paid much attention to my ATF temperature this summer. But last November when the OAT was 56 deg. F. the ATF temperature after a short drive I watched the TFT increase to 171 deg. F. and continue upward while sitting in the driveway in Reverse with the engine idling. When I replaced my Sport's single row radiator with a double row the temperature of the radiator was normally around 150 deg. F. on a warm day according to my remote reading thermometer. I think that is the ideal temperature for ATF. I wonder if there is a V6 mounting configuration that accommodates the side tank for the internal ATF cooler.
     
  4. 2000StreetRod

    2000StreetRod Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    An Amsoil EaBP90 bypass oil filter arrived today.
    EaBP90.jpg
    The cost has increased since the last time I bought one. The cheapest I could find was on eBay for $45 with free shipping. If I can find space I'll install it on my Centennial. Otherwise, it's a future replacement filter for my Sport.
     
  5. 87350gta

    87350gta Active Member

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    All of the 3rd gen explorers have the same radiator, be they v6 or v8. The only variance was the aviator. It switched to a top/bottom tank setup instead of a side to side tank rad. They are all external trans coolers sandwiched between the condenser and radiator. That might be a little on the cool side for a trans. I think 160-180 is a better operating temp, but I am not sure. I think I read that somewhere. You could get an oil to water cooler from a newer superduty. They are pretty compact and obviously work well enough to cool a heavy duty unit.
     
  6. 2000StreetRod

    2000StreetRod Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    The thermostat in my 5R55E was set to open the external cooling loop at 150 deg. F. so I assumed that Ford engineering must have determined that was the optimum temperature. I wasn't aware there are any Ford oil to water coolers and haven't been able to find one for a Super Duty. Is it a transmission or engine cooler?
     
  7. 87350gta

    87350gta Active Member

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  8. 2000StreetRod

    2000StreetRod Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    Thanks Luke! That looks interesting. I found a photo of one but haven't found any dimensions.
    ATFCooler.jpg
    I'm puzzled about the mating ATF port connectors.
    ATFCoolerPNs.jpg
     
  9. 87350gta

    87350gta Active Member

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    The connections are the standard1/2" quick connect that ford uses on practically everything now. In fact, the '06 and newer explorers use these lines, but they also use a rad mounted cooler in addition to an external cooler.
     
  10. 2000StreetRod

    2000StreetRod Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    So is this a Dorman equivalent of what's mounted on the ATF cooler?
    ATFQuickCnx.jpg
    If so, can I just remove the quick connect fitting and install a standard NPT to hose barb fitting? I wonder where the cooler would fit. It appears to be medium height and length but pretty thick.
     
  11. 87350gta

    87350gta Active Member

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    Correct, those are the same fittings. I am not 100 % sure they are removable for the cooler, but it looks like they are from the picture. That cooler, if I remember correctly, is about 12x4x4 or so.
     
  12. 2000StreetRod

    2000StreetRod Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    The optimum functional location for efficiency should have the coolant flow in series between the cool outlet of the radiator and the thermostat inlet. That way the temperature of the coolant would be around 150 deg. F. For that location the coolant inlet and outlet ports should be comparable in diameter to the radiator ports to prevent flow restriction. I suspect the location of the ATF flow should be between the transmission external cooling loop outlet and the inlet to the stock air to ATF cooler. For that configuration the coolant to ATF cooler could drop the ATF temperature to the cool end of the radiator (150 deg. F.) and the air to ATF cooler could drop the ATF temperature further to that of ambient air plus the amount warmed by the A/C condenser. Do you know if that is the configuration for the Super Duty? I wonder if the cooler would fit in the engine compartment below the battery tray. I was potentially planning the space for an electric power steering pump and replacing the mechanical pump with a second alternator. Battery technology is rapidly evolving and I still haven't given up on the possibility of an electric motor driven supercharger for modest boost at low engine speeds.
     
  13. CDW6212R

    CDW6212R Hauls the mail. Elite Explorer

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    Speaking of battery technology, have you read much of the LiFePO4 type of batteries? Those are slowly gaining in popularity for all motorsports besides cars. They are made by various brands, and different charging control technologies. Prices are stable, but with two improvements, they might be worth looking at for automobiles.

    The one down side I found was they have limited amperage charging limits. The brand I liked the best(EarthX), can only be charged with 60 amp maximum, or it destroys the battery. If they can find a way to control the charge rate, then I'd want to consider them. The price range for a couple to handle a V8 is still over $450 or so, thus it's just an idea to watch.

    http://www.power-barn.com/earthx-lithium-batteries-for-watercraft/
     
  14. 87350gta

    87350gta Active Member

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    I am not sure if that's how the super duty trans cooler is ran. They use 2 separate cooling systems on the 6.7L an I can't remember which one does what. It's weird. 2 thermostats in 1 housing that feed different halves of the radiator. There is also a fuel cooler system and a air to water intercooler.

    I mounted my remote oil filter under the battery tray. There is quite a bit of vertical room there. The pass side in the same place is where all of my heat exchanger hoses and pump are located.
     
  15. 2000StreetRod

    2000StreetRod Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    Most of the available space in the left front area appears to be forward and below of the battery tray.
    LFBot1.jpg
    The best location is taken up by the anti-lock brake system module and hydraulic control unit. There may be some space in the bumper vicinity. I'd really like to install one of those coolers.
     
  16. 2000StreetRod

    2000StreetRod Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    I found a potential location for the Super Duty ATF cooler.
    PwrStrgCooler.jpg
    The power steering fluid cooler is mounted on a flat area several inches tall and a couple of feet wide. If the power steering fluid cooler is moved from the center to left or right there will be enough room to mount the ATF cooler. I found a new unit for sale on eBay for $60 with free shipping so I bought it.
    ATFCooler1.jpg
    ATFCooler2.jpg
    The seller had previously purchased it but never installed it. There's another possible location but not very likely.
    RadLwrCnx.jpg
    It's where the hose/pipe and shroud is below the radiator. I traced the hose/pipe to its other end that connects to the bottom of the degas bottle. The other port in the lower left corner of the radiator connects to the block inlet port. The connections generally agree with the 4.6L cooling flow diagram I found.
    4.6LCoolantFlow.jpg
    My Centennial differs in that the radiator has two lower ports instead of a single port connected to a large T fitting and the degas hose is located under the radiator. I doubt there is any significant warm flow (dark arrows) from the degas bottle to the block. The only flow would be from thermal contraction after the engine is shut off or filling the cooling system with the degas cap removed. I think the degas hose diameter is much greater than needed. It will take me some time to devise a cooling system incorporating the Super Duty ATF cooler, the Aviator bypass assembly and oil filter/thermostat housing adapter, the Centennial radiator and degas bottle and the minimum number of interconnecting hoses and fittings.
     
  17. 87350gta

    87350gta Active Member

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    You are going to need to change the trans cooler lines, and trans case fittings. The 2006-2010 v6 explorers have what you need, that's what I used anyway. You might be able to use a mustang setup also. Since the explorer lines are for a v6, they need some "tweaking" to clear the bellhousing. You are correct, that lower hose from the degas bottle has zero flow. I made the mistake of plumbing into it for my heater core on the first attempt.
     
  18. 87350gta

    87350gta Active Member

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    Also, the frame looks so clean on that explorer. Has it ever been driven? Lol.
     
  19. 2000StreetRod

    2000StreetRod Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    Using numerous fittings and hose clamps I was able to set up another test to measure the pre-luber oil flow under pressure.
    Test2.jpg
    I installed a 1/8 inch dia. hose barb fitting at the end of the outlet hose. When I plugged in the battery charger I was surprised to see the pressure gauge jump to about 50 psi but then settle to continuous pressure varying from 35 to 37 psi. The pump flow was still more than 1 gpm so I think it will be adequate. One possible horizontal mounting location is the outside of the driver side chassis rail just aft of the beginning of the step bar. I haven't checked the inside of the chassis rail yet but it's probably too close to the exhaust system.
     
  20. 2000StreetRod

    2000StreetRod Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    The Super Duty ATF cooler arrived today and I was pleased to find out that the ATF connectors are removable. They appear to be NPT threads with an O ring seal. I possibly have brass fittings on hand to confirm the thread. I may be able to just use sealant instead of O rings with standard NPT to hose barb fittings.
    ATFCooler.jpg
    The coolant connectors are for 5/8 inch dia. hose which is too small (restrictive) to be inline between the radiator main outlet and the block inlet. My initial idea now is to add a reducing splitter on the passenger side to the hose at the bottom of the radiator to the hose that connects to the degas bottle. One port of the splitter (5/8 inch dia.) would go to the degas bottle and the other port would go to the ATF cooler coolant inlet port. The ATF cooler coolant outlet port would have a hose that connects to the main return hose between the radiator and the block. The ATF cooler inlet port will be connected to the transmission external loop outlet because the efficiency of liquid-to-liquid coolers is greater than air-to-liquid coolers and the average temperature of the coolant leaving the radiator is typically greater than ambient air temperature. The outlet of the ATF cooler will be routed to the inlet of the stock ATF cooler. I've never driven my Centennial long enough at one time to determine the characteristics of the stock ATF cooling. Monday I have Meals On Wheels delivery that lasts about 2 hours. I normally drive the Grand Cherokee but this time I'll drive the Centennial and monitor the ATF temperature using my Scan Gauge II.
     
  21. 87350gta

    87350gta Active Member

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    Looks great! I am glad that those fittings were removable. Is there a possibility of not using the air to oil factory cooler at all to maximize airflow to the radiator and condenser?
     






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