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Parts Cleaner in engine????

Discussion in 'Under the Hood' started by x5050160, July 19, 2013.

^^Searches ExplorerForum.com^^





  1. x5050160

    x5050160 Member

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    Not to offend you or anyone else... But do you not know how to read through a post?
    If you have then you should understand that:
    1. I'm going to pull the plugs. (This means no compression on compression stroke)
    2. I'm only going to crank the engine a few times with the starter. (This means the engine will have very minimal load on it. With no compression, it might spin up to 400 RPM)
    3. I'm going to leave the oil cap off, remove the PCV Valve, and pull all of the vacuum hoses off the intake. (This will ensure that the crankcase pressure will not rise at all from the cranking of the starter. Not that it should anyways because there will be no volumetric changes in the crankcase from cranking the engine.)
    4. This Explorer runs like shit!!!

    (I have checked all the voltages on the sensors and all are in spec. The only code I now have is EGR low flow, and Fuel Rich part throttle. DPFE is in good shape. Fuel pump is new, fuel filter is now new, fuel pressure is 41lbs with KOEO and at 38lbs KOER. Still boggs down past 60% throttle. Feels like pulling a manual choke when you get past 60% throttle.)

    So please explain to me how I'm going to need to do a full rebuild on this engine following the procedure described.
     
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  3. x5050160

    x5050160 Member

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    I also stated in the original post that I would fill the intake up also.
    I'm not looking for affirmation. I'm wanting to know if anyone has done this or if they see anything that could go wrong. All I have gotton is people who don't read through posts all the way. No one has givin a single explanation about why this is a bad idea, except for " oh you're gonna need rods and it won't clean anything" Well I have posted a YouTube vid that shows how well this shit cleans up carbon.
    And I do not see how I will hydro lock if I pull the plugs.
     
  4. Bobmbx

    Bobmbx Active Member

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    1. When you pull the plugs and crank the engine your pistons will turn into Chem Dip pumps mixed with gasoline and spray your engine compartment with a toxic, corrosive flammable liquid. I hope you thought about spark sources and finding a way to empty the carb of fuel. I'm sure you've figured out that you'll need to isolate any spark source (like spark plugs, wires, electrical connectors, etc.) in the engine compartment and your garage.

    2. Chem Dip will eat rubber. Keep that in mind as it sprays out of your plug holes onto cabling, vacuum hoses, radiator hose....basically, everything on the engine that isn't metal.

    3. Radiator fan. You've thought about disabling it too, right? Wouldn't want the fan to blow clouds of what is essentially concentrated paint thinner all over your car.

    4. EPA. You've let them know you're about to induce a toxic spill.

    5. You're prepared with HAZMAT suits and appropriate clean up materials, right?

    6. 911. Remember that.
     
  5. Turdle

    Turdle Moderator Staff Member Moderator Elite Explorer

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    Seriously? 24 hours later and still no video?
    You have stretched my attention span beyond repair.
     
  6. FIND

    FIND Well-Known Member

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    If you have changed oil like that on those kinds of short intervals, and your oil is still coming out black, you don't have a problem with deposits in your engine, you have bad rings. All the cleaning in the world isn't going to fix that.



    FWIW, Kerosene does have some lubricity to it. As long as it isn't put under too much stress... but that's why I've always heard of people mixing a quart or two into their oil, just to keep things lubricated well. At least, that's the method I've always used, and everyone else I know who has done that kind of thing.

    I'm sorry I didn't give an in-depth description to you why this wouldn't work the same as something completely different? Maybe you should just trust the various people on here who tell you it is a bad idea. I mean, not like you aren't talking to mechanics and shadetrees. We already told you what would go wrong. Now you are asking us to prove it and insisting the things we said couldn't possibly happen. You don't seem to be satisfied with anything we say, so I say to you, please, PLEASE, by all means, prove yourself right. Feel free to watch how fast you gouge rod bearings when you try and crank an engine that has had all its oil replaced with heavy solvent, among the other various things you are going to do. When you are done, I'll be sure to post in your "help me install my new engine" thread so you can complain I am wrong there too, assuming you don't mess up too many other things.

    INB4 "blah blah blah everyone told such and such brilliant inventor such and such wouldn't work"



    Now get Turdle his video of carnage.
     
    Last edited: July 20, 2013
  7. x5050160

    x5050160 Member

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    Now the radiator fan I didn't think about, good call. I assumed that it wouldn't turn when cranking the engine?? Like the clutch would be disengaged. Ill have to check that out.
    And after a little more research and consideration kerosene seems to be the more appropriate chemical to use. Plus it 2.89 a gallon compared to 18.99 a gallon.
     
  8. swshawaii

    swshawaii Elite Explorer

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    Please keep the lens clean from chemical spray when recording, this could go viral. :eek:
     
  9. Bobmbx

    Bobmbx Active Member

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    Atta boy!

    Don't forget, let the kerosene do the work. Agitation is not required. You just need to spread it around in there and then let it do its thing.

    For the carbon build up in your intake system, if the Sea Foam isn't gettin' it done, then you're looking at an intake tear down. And that isn't all that difficult.
     
  10. x5050160

    x5050160 Member

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    Very well could be. This is cheaper than pulling and tearing down the engine. But I might have to anyway.



    Gonna go this route instead of the Chem Dip



    In no way did I mean the auto washer was the same. Just that it should in theory do pretty much the same thing. I also didn't ask for an explanation on why it's different.
    I did however ask for someone to explain how I'm going to need to do a rebuild after I do this.
    The only reason that I see that anyone told me this was a bad idea is that they didn't read entirely what I am wanting to do. Yes I was told what could go wrong, and I stated what I was doing to ensure that it would be ok.
    I too am a mechanic. I've been working on engines and tractors and race cars and all sorts of other mechanical things for 20 years at least. I was a mechanic on the Indy Lights series before I got a single ASE Certification.
    I didn't want any proof that it would't work just some thoughts on what I was doing. Something along the lines of "the holes for the plugs might not evacuate the fluid fast enough for you to not bend a rod" that i could take into consideration. Not "If you plan on overfilling your motor past the full level, then prepare to purchase connecting rods and a host of other internals." or "Putting ANY liquid in the intake and expecting the motor to run is just stupid..." Nope not satisfied with those responses because they didn't read all of the post. I also stated that I would be leaving the 5 quarts of oil in the crankcase when I did it. I very seriously doubt that with no compression, no load, and maybe 400 RPM i'm going to hurt any bearing on a cold engine. I also won't need your help on my so called " help me install my new engine" thread I have done more than a few of those.
    I wasn't complaining that you were wrong just that you and a few others didn't read my thread all the way before commenting. Also I don't "mess up too many things"
    So all of that being said PLEASE, by all means, go find someone else who just joined this site, who may or may not be an ASE Certified mechanic, who may or not have a degree in engineering, and who may or may not have traveled on a national race tour as a mechanic, and let them indulge in your politeness and wisdom.

    I don't invent shit I engineer shit
     
  11. x5050160

    x5050160 Member

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    Yea I'm down to taking the upper intake off now. But it started to rain so Im going to the store now
     
  12. FIND

    FIND Well-Known Member

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    Pretty sure we told you. Then you said, "Well, I'm definitely going to remove the plugs." Then you got angry that people didn't realize this.

    No, people were saying it was a bad idea because it was a horrible idea. I read exactly what you said and it sounded like a mix of haven't thought things through, and This

    Then I am VERY surprised you asked this question... Even more surprised that your method of auto repair is seafoam the crap out of it, then consider filling it up full of solvent instead of just considering that you have bad rings...

    We gave you our thoughts about what you were doing. We thought you were stupid to consider filling your engine full of a heavy solvent. You started calling all of us idiots because you decided that since we thought it was stupid, we misunderstood you somehow. No. We clearly understood what you were trying to do and told you it was stupid. Sorry if we assumed you were not an engineer/mechanic/billionaire/playboy/philanthropist. Normally people with those types of credentials would think this is a bad idea, so I didn't bother giving you all the technical details. I was hoping, as were many other people, that we wouldn't have to create a mathematical model to predict the engine damage.

    No, we read your thread. You were just angry with our responses telling you that what you wanted to do was wrong and a bad idea.

    Will do buddy... While you are doing that, ponder on the meaning of anonymity on the internet. I don't have your CV or resume sitting right in front of me. I see you coming up with a bad idea, then getting angry when people tell you it is a bad idea, then rage-spiraling when people respond, "No, I know what you want to do, it is still a bad idea."

    I wonder what degrees FIND has and if he at one time had any current ASE certifications?

    Then engineer a better response or a better attitude to people who just tried to help you. You got angry, then insisted we didn't read your post.

    People said, "No, that's a bad idea, do something different instead. That sounds exactly like the first thing anyone will ever tell you to never do." I even said, kerosene, diesel fuel or jet fuel will clean you up. I said that filling your engine will give you problems with draining back. Other people even concurred that that was the best of the options you listed.

    Maybe you were the one guilty of not reading other people's posts?
     
  13. tooltime

    tooltime Member

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    :DAHHHHH, FIND, you are the man! Gee, I guess in my case, I hadn't had enough coffee this morning before I didn't read the full post. Thus allowing me to make an uneducated guess.
    Ok, Mr. Indy Lights Engineer. Let me throw this out there and see how it gets translated. Being an engineer, surely you must have considered the bearing/piston ect tolerances in these new era motors are a whole lot tighter than yester year motors? Try throwing 20w-50 in your little 4.0, then start it up in the morning. Not the same results as the 70' or even the 80's v-8's. Being from a race team, Im sure you agree this to be true. Sorry I don't have time to read thru your post again. So if I forgot something, Im sure someone else will fill in for me! Just remember what we all have said. Just trying to help my man. By the way, thanks for the videos on what a solvent tank is and does. Now that was classic.
    Now if you will excuse me, I need to make a run to the store before the show. Im getting low on popcorn and twizzlers. Please, maybe have two cameras to capture multiple angles when the party starts!:popcorn:
     
  14. x5050160

    x5050160 Member

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    Maybe I didn't mention the plugs coming out right out of the box? But since I was on a forum full of mechanics and shadetree's I thought it was a givin.
    Oh and I didn't get angry.
    Oh wait I clearly addressed the hydro lock concern in my first post. I guess more evidence you didn't read it.

    I don't think its a horrible idea the way I described it. When I started the thread I hadn't thought it all the way through. That's why I started the thread.



    Yep when my alternator went out I "seafoamed it", still wondering why it didn't work.
    I also considered that my rings were bad... but like I said before this is cheaper.


    Ah now your "smarts" are starting to shine through here :)
    First and most of all I didn't call anyone an idiot. I have more respect for the men and women on this forum than that. And obviously more respect for the people on here than you do.
    I don't think anyone misunderstood me, I think some didn't read the first post and the responses before they posted.
    Your "engineer/mechanic/billionaire/playboy/philanthropist" comment just proves what an insecure, and close minded individual you are.
    I would be very surprised if you could give me any "technical details"
    I would also be shocked if you could even comprehend the mathematical formulas involved in engine oil testing, shock and load pressures exerted across a curve or sphere, fluid dynamics, or engine oil Rheology. But hey i'm not going to make make as you and assume that you dont know



    Who is this "we"? Are you speaking for everyone? Maybe "we" read my and others post's, but "you" clearly did not.
    Once again I'm not angry. I'm laughing. So is my wife, and my kid.


    When... and I'm not the guy "doing that" you're supposed to be remember. I have taken the time to ponder the meaning of internet anonymity.
    Again not angry. Never raged on anyone either.

    I wonder also... I have also pondered if he at one time had any current ASE certifications?
    I came up with this; If he had at any one time held ASE Certification, it would have to had been current when it was held.


    I didn't get angry for the third time I think

    I am going to use kerosene now.
    I did read them thats how I knew I should switch to kerosene.
     
  15. x5050160

    x5050160 Member

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    Ok thats Mr. Indy lights mechanic. And maybe I should put a nice 20W-50. In there to see if my oil stays a little cleaner when I do the 50 mile interval change
    I should run this and see what happens[​IMG]
     
  16. FIND

    FIND Well-Known Member

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    Well buddy, whatever it takes to make yourself feel better. Good luck with it.

    Just going to quote this little bit here, just so everyone else who has spent any time on this forum can have a good laugh.
     
  17. x5050160

    x5050160 Member

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    Well I got the upper intake off and cleaned up. looks pretty nasty but 30 minutes in the kerosene and a little scrubbing and its as good as new. Well almost the outside is pretty stainded. Is there anything that will take the light black stains out of the pitted aluminum finish? Got the kerosene strained and Im gonna pour it into the crankcase here in a few. Got the plugs out and they look pretty good. I know that the 4,6L V8 like the motor craft plugs. I wanna put Champion Platinum in it but I don't wanna change them in 5000 miles cause this engine doesn't like them. Anyways gonna go fill it up with the kerosene now and prep it to crank.
     
  18. 03 Explorer XLT

    03 Explorer XLT Active Member

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    What's going to happen when you fill the cylinders with kerosene and pump it into the exhaust system?
     
  19. tooltime

    tooltime Member

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    :crazy:
     
    Last edited: July 29, 2013
  20. MustangP51

    MustangP51 Well-Known Member

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    Why not do a borescope to check for engine sludge before doing something as drastic as this?
     
  21. tooltime

    tooltime Member

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    Dude, I call total Bullshit on your 70w race motor oil!!! I happen to know what Cup and Nationwide cars are using for Qual, and Race day. Unless your Indy Lights cars have clearances like old school 1960 motors, you would have to prove to me those Indy Lights ran that heavy of an oil! Until you can give me absolute proof, I think you need to smoke another doobie.
    See fellas, now this is getting fun. Good thing I stocked up on twizzlers and popcorn yesterday.
    As far as plugs on a stock motor, I have always kept with the Ford OEM, iridium, or platinums, what ever they are. Cant remember. Getting old and been hit in the head a lot as a kid! If I get time, I want to investigate your oil claim. I could be wrong, but
    70w? That one is hard for me to fatham. Lets keep the fun going. Im sure I speak for many in here, that we are curious as to the final results of your chemistry experiment.
     

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