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PATS nightmare!

Discussion in 'Stock 1995 - 2001 Explorers' started by Mike Blotzer, January 16, 2019.

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  1. Mike Blotzer

    Mike Blotzer New Member

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    So, some wonderful member of society tried yanking my 99 explorer sport and only anaged to damage the PATS module clip that snaps into ring. After replacing it (just the clip was broken-used exact same module and have both og keys), nada. 2 locksmiths, nothing. Took it to Ford and they (after a week of bullshit) quoted me what was originally $130ish at an insane $936! FOR A 99! My thoughts now are perhaps a short got sent into ECM/PCM etc and thats why no one can get this thing running again...if I had the Ford PATS OBD id be somewhat closer, but whats your thoughts?! Its got ttons of life in it but im about to chuck this bastard off a cliff.
     
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  3. Mbrooks420

    Mbrooks420 High Voltage. Elite Explorer EF Vendor

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    Do you need full coverage for theft damage?

    Does the theft light flash rapidly when it turns over?
     
  4. imp

    imp Well-Known Member

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    @Mbrooks420
    Will a '99 turn over with the wrong key, but kills fuel & spark? My '96 disables the starter circuit by Security Module, but not PATS key, I think. imp
     
  5. Mbrooks420

    Mbrooks420 High Voltage. Elite Explorer EF Vendor

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    I’m not positive, but I think so. My 98 will turn over but the injectors just don’t fire.
     
  6. imp

    imp Well-Known Member

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    @Mbrooks420
    Doesn't it seem impossible Ford would release for general use thousands of vehicles which might not start, but will crank, until the unsuspecting owner drains the battery cranking? I had a 99, but 2WD, kept it only through one winter, steep hill Missouri Ozarks, 10 inches of snow, shopped for a replace: 2004 4X4 but naive then, has 4.0 OHC, '99 had OHV. imp
     
  7. Mbrooks420

    Mbrooks420 High Voltage. Elite Explorer EF Vendor

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    That would require a possible tow to a dealer, and a battery sale. Seems right up Ford’s alley.
     
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  8. koda2000

    koda2000 Explorer Addict

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    I believe a '99 would spin the starter/engine, but the fuel injectors are shut off by the PCM if it does not recognize the key. This is what one of our '01's did when I tried to start it with a non-chipped key (just to see what would happen). When this happens the theft light should be blinking quickly.

    Barring an electrical/wiring issue I don't understand why Ford can't get this straightened out. It sounds like they just do want to be bothered with it. I once had a Chrysler dealership pull this crap on me on an old mini-van. No way I'd pay them nearly $1000 to fix it (if they even can).

    OP - If worse comes to worse there was a member here that had his PCM modified to turn off PATS. IIRC it cost him around $60 and he sent his PCM off to be modified. His Explorer was kept on an island, so bringing his Expl to Ford wan't an option for him. Link below, maybe try PM'ing the poster.
    Another PATS problem

    Have you checked all your fuses? I wonder if something in your PCM got shorted out.
     
    Last edited: January 16, 2019
  9. Mike Blotzer

    Mike Blotzer New Member

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    thanks for the input and the anti PATS suggestion! Its a crank no start, with a 1:3 antitheft flash sequence. I even tried pulling the pats ring off and trying a new one (verified working) and tried to get new keys programmed, shelled out a couple hondo for keys that dont do shit. Locky said something about Ford would have to do something on their end, but considering I literally told them to suck my !@#$ when I was given that quote, sorry-ESTIMATE-I dont see me returning to them anytime soon. I was telling them what to do at the dealership...the dude there had no clue about anything. lol I'll check that link out and thanks...
     
  10. donalds

    donalds Elite Explorer

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    My 99 the pats will just turn off the injectors
    When the battery was bad it did as you describe
    I suggest testing the battery
    Disconnect the battery remove it then touch the 2 battery cables together with a wire for a few minutes
    Also look under the dash &steering wheel cowl
    For broken or rubbing wires
     
  11. Mike Blotzer

    Mike Blotzer New Member

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    thanks donald. new battery, but possible re wiring
     
  12. imp

    imp Well-Known Member

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    @koda2000 "I don't understand why Ford can't get this straightened out."

    They did, but which year, I dunno. My '04 blocks starter, fuel, and ignition, when wrong key turns the lock. In "RUN", light blinks rapidly, continues to do so, about 5 blinks per second. Correct key to RUN light turns on solid, shuts off completely after about 5 seconds, stays off if engine started or not, cycle repeats if you shut OFF. Evidently the PCM quickly "proves out" the info from the transceiver, then either allows, or disallows starting.

    FWIW, I moved my transceiver over the the LH side of the steering column, upside down and under that funky, whatever multi-function or turn signal switch, with my good key 3M Trim cemented right across the face of the transceiver. My wife contributed a tiny bunge which keeps it in place. Lower shroud conceals it nicely. Bunch of keys, chipped incorrectly (this was a big concern, will PCM be confused by TWO chipped keys present?). Nope. My '94 Mustang key, unchipped, of course, fits into the cylinder, so I could get one cut of the unchipped variety to use also.

    Please don't come steal my Explorer! (Or my Mustang!) imp
     
  13. Mbrooks420

    Mbrooks420 High Voltage. Elite Explorer EF Vendor

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    I think he means why they couldn’t solve this one specific PATS issue, not when the “fixed” the PATS functionality.

    I honestly don’t care that it turns over and won’t start. My vehicles don’t need to be idiot-proof. I’ve yet to have any PATS issues on any Ford I’ve had.
     
  14. Mbrooks420

    Mbrooks420 High Voltage. Elite Explorer EF Vendor

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    A high end stereo shop would be able to diagnose/fix this for you. Probably a LOT cheaper than Ford.
     
  15. koda2000

    koda2000 Explorer Addict

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    @Mbrooks420, @imp -Yes I was referring to why the Ford stealership couldn't diagnose/fix this one specific problem, not PATS in general. Furthermore I'm talking about Gen II PATS only. I know nothing about Gen III PATS, nor is it relevant to this conversation.

    Personally I've never experienced a PATS problem other than why my '01 Sport Trac will sometimes do weird stuff, like flashing it's lights on/off for 5-10 seconds for no apparent reason, which is somehow related to using the remote key fob (which is also not relevant).

    Definition - PATS code flash 1:3
    Key code not received. Is key screened by other keys or objects? Try different key: if okay then first key is faulty. If not go to main dealer...

    The OP's transceiver ring may be reading the key code and the PCM has the key code(s) stored in it, but it sounds like the key code is not being sent to the PCM. If this is the case IMO it could either a wiring issue, or that something got/is shorted out. The transceiver is supposed to read the key code and send it to the PATS module (which I have heard described as a dumb bus). The module then sends the code to the PCM, which can be programmed to recognize up to 5 key codes. If the PCM recognizes/verifies the key it turns on the fuel injectors allowing the engine to start. To my knowledge this is how Gen II PATS works. No fuel pump control, no starter motor control, no spark control.

    As the OP's original transceiver ring was damaged during the attempted theft, it seems logical to me that there may also be wiring damage and possibly that something was shorted. I would begin by checking every fuse (not just the ones that seem to be protecting PATS/PCM related circuits) and all the wiring related to the transceiver.

    IMO the Ford mechanic doesn't know what he's doing and/or they can't be bothered trying to fix the problem, so they tell you it's going to cost $1,000 to fix it hoping you'll just go away (or buy a newer car). At this point in time all the knowledgeable Gen II Ford mechanics have retired or moved on. We are talking about a 20 year old vehicle here.

    If this was my vehicle and I couldn't find/fix the problem myself I think I'd go the route paying $60 to having my PCM modified to turn PATS off.

    OP - I guess PATS did it's job, as your thief was not successful in stealing your vehicle.
     
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