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Stop your trendy patriotism

Discussion in 'Exploring everything under the sun!!' started by Hank, September 17, 2001.

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  1. Hank

    Hank Elite Explorer

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    (hg 09/17/00: Before you fire off, read the whole thread and other posts. Let's not get nasty on what has been a great thread. I already admitted my ignorance about becoming old and not realizing that the younger generation had lived during a time of peace ).

    Original post:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------

    Don't get me wrong, I am horrified and saddened by the events of last week. but.... I am pissed off and thanks to the beauty of the internet you are going to hear it...

    Where was your flag before Tuesday? Did you even own one? A American flag has hung in front of my house since the day I moved out on my own. I have never been ashamed of my flag or not being cool because it was there.

    When was the last time you gave blood or donated to the red cross? Oklahoma bombing, gulf war??

    I woke up to a disturbing sight this morning. A neighbor put up a flag pole and hung some artistic artsy-fartsy flag looking thing from it. Gold ribbons, bells all sorts of crap... however THEY DON'T PAY OR FILE THEIR INCOME TAX, and they steel cable. Now they are "patriotic" I say hypocrite not patriot. Go to hell.

    Flags, flags, flags everywhere. It is cool to fly a flag this week. Let's go get one!! These are the same people who forgot about my grandfather and his generations sacrifice in WW2, they S#@T on my father and his generation during Vientnam. Dismissed the gulf war as some big video game.. And now you have the balls to fly a flag and say you stand with pride for your country? What country are you from Nordstroms, Old Navy?



    Go kiss my proud real American butt...

    hg
     
    Last edited: September 17, 2001
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  3. mattadams

    mattadams Moderator Emeritus

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    Hank, while strongly worded, I can see your point. I didn't have a flag before and after this event, I realized how selfish I'd been for not having one.
    I think the reason many people haven't been patriotic is they've been raised in a generation where they haven't had to be patriotic, no one they know died protection our freedom and our liberties, those have just been things that have "always been there" for them.
    By the way, I have always wanted to give blood. I turns out that this is the first time I've actually been able to, due to either getting tattoos within a year or being on accutane which you can't give blood within a year of being on it. I haven't given yet because the local blood center is takinga ppointments weeks out. I also wanted to give blood during hte columbine tragedy but was unable to do so at the time due to having had a tattoo within a year or so.
     
  4. mrsteve

    mrsteve Active Member

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    Wow. Sorry not everyone is as patriotic as you George Washington. Why bitch about a good thing? I'm sure you are proud to be an American, but others are too; even if they don't have a 50' x 75' flag in front of their house. People are coming together as a country and that's great to see. How is someone putting up an American flag a disgusting sight? You said they weren't even citizens. So they aren't citizens yet they still support America. I don't see anything wrong with that.

    Steve
     
  5. JDraper

    JDraper Somewhat Functional Moderator Emeritus

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    I've had an American flag flying in front of every house I have ever owned, starting in '92. I'm not disgusted by those just putting them up now. I'm just saddened that so many still don't have flags up. On my way to work this morning, I bet 75% of the houses between my house and my office (7 miles) didn't have flags.
     
  6. Hank

    Hank Elite Explorer

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    Matt,

    Thank you for your honesty. Patriotism like life goes in cycles. Thanks to our great freedoms in this country people tend to take them for granted. I just wish that more could "do the right thing" on a more regular basis. Not just during a crisis. It would make the country a much better place.


    Mr Steve,

    Sorry I was not clear. It is not disgusting to put up a flag. I just have a big problem with "trendy patriotism" Especially, in this one example, when I know the person(s) putting up the "so called" flag are not contributing to the country (at the bare minimum) by paying or filing their taxes... I would call that hypocritical not patriotic...

    I replaced the word disgusting with disturbing. Thanks for the feedback on that comment.

    BTW: Mine is slightly smaller than 50x75...

    Hope this clears it up.

    Comming together as a country is great. Howeve we would be a much better country if we stayed together.. Which I hope we can in this new world..

    hg
     
    Last edited: September 17, 2001
  7. wabbit

    wabbit Active Member

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    wake up call...

    Hank,
    Although you are right on target regarding the lack of patriotism that has through the years become the norm, it is unfair to condem those that may have sincerely responded to this wake up call. There are lot's of "trendy" displays of the flag and it is discouraging when done by those that still think the beauty of America is a McDonalds on every corner. I would expect there are many more citizens that have been slapped with a dose of reality that has promoted them to embrace and project the true spirit of the term, "Proud to be an American".
    My flag flies proudly in front of my home and serves as a simple notice that I believe in the idea of America, and am proud to be a part of it.
    The extent of my beliefs is defined by my actions in support of our country and my consideration for fellow citizens, not by how big, or how many flags I display.
     
  8. Robert

    Robert Well-Known Member

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    Hank - Unfortunately, it usually takes a major tradegy to bring the country together. Same thing happend during Desert Storm, to a lesser extent. It has been 10 years since Desert Storm so people tend to forget, or were too young to realize what it meant. It took a very hard kick to make people remember. Most people were proud of their country before the attacks, they just took it for granted that everyone knew. Now that we all need to unite and pull together, one way to show that we have united is by displaying the American Flag. I too did not have a flag displayed before all of this happened, however I was just as proud of my country before as I am now. One of those things I took for granted. It certainly doesn't bother me seeing all of the flags popping up in my neighborhood by people that didn't have one before Tuesday. I would be willing to bet that within 6 months, 75% of them won't be put back up again until something else major happens, unless we are in the midst of a war. If we are in the middle of a war, then the flags would probably stay up until several months after the war ended.

    Think of it this way, at the beginning of football season (or baseball, basketball, whatever) you see very few people wearing clothing supporting the home team. If the team takes off and starts kicking some butt (which everyone is now expecting the USA to do), they all start pulling out their old team shirts. All of a sudden most of the city is behind their home team. They just want to show that they are proud of how their home team is doing, one way to do that is to display its colors.
     
  9. Michigander

    Michigander Active Member

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    I agree.... stuff like this changes people lives FOREVER. I am only 18 and until now, haven't had a reason to show my pride in America by displaying flags, etc. I haven't been in this world during a major war or any economic recession. But now I will remember this for the rest of my life, as I'm sure thousands of other Americans will as well.

    It's like you are trying to put down the average american because they are not as hardcore about their patriotism as you are. Don't you see that as kind of sillly? You're judging peoples' patriotism by the flags they are displaying. These people might be more patriotic than yourself, but don't hang a flag in their frontyard. But the instant they do, you say "Go kiss my proud real American butt... "

    Get real. Don't put me down because you have never realized how partriotic I am since I don't have a flag in my front lawn.
     
  10. mmpc

    mmpc Moderator Emeritus

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    Hank,

    I see what you're saying, but don't agree with your harsh tone. It's human nature for many people to require a "stimulus" before they act. Similar to how people become more generous around the season of Christmas. Does this "trendy giving" disgust you as well?

    What about those who have been moved to enlist in the military to defend their country? Should they be turned away because they weren't considering joining before this tragedy? Obviously, that would be absurd.

    Rather than looking down upon people who aren't as patriotic as you evidently are, I'd be rejoicing that people have rediscovered their patriotism! Maybe these feelings will last - they probably won't. Yet I, for one, will always remember how my country rallied during this time of great danger and tragedy; and I'll look back with pride!
     
  11. Hank

    Hank Elite Explorer

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    Robert, your example is right on the money..

    Although I find it sad that patriotism is on the same level as the support for a favorite sports team.

    Wabbit, using your well worded comment.

    "The extent of my beliefs is defined by my actions in support of our country and my consideration for fellow citizens, not by how big, or how many flags I display"

    I ask of those, why do you fly a flag now? If you do, how long will you let it fly?

    I guess my tone in the original message it tough but I stand by it. I am not putting anyone down. Well except those who are jumping on patriotism because Nordstroms is having a sale on RWB pants... This country allows us great freedoms. The freedom to choose if we fly a flag or not for example.

    Perhaps I am forgetting that some of you may be a bit younger than this Old Fart and have lived only in times of peace.. When we worried about the Russians, Vietnam, Lybia, A-bomb drills, Cuban missles crisis.. I could go on.. We have lived in such peace for so long that perhaps we have begun to take our country for granted. If I have offended you, please forgive me. But please do me the favor of not forgetting the feeling of pride you have in your country for the rest of your life..

    Best regards.
    hg
     
    Last edited: September 17, 2001
  12. jimbo74

    jimbo74 Elite Exploder

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    I went out Tuesday night and bought my flags from Wal-Mart, before the whole flag idea cuaght on.... This [​IMG]has been on my truck since tuesday night.... I dont think it is trendy, i truely feel pride for my country...beng 19 and able body i am ready to go to war should i happen to get drafted.... i went out last night and bought "The Roots Remain" by CDB....I am currently listening to "in America" and it kicks!!!! Some may think it is trendy, but I actually have the flag up at halfstaff in memory of all the people that were lost. Especially Fire Fighters and Police... I am currently working to get an A.S. in Fire Science and become a certified Paramedic Fire Fighter
     
  13. Hank

    Hank Elite Explorer

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    Sorry I edited versus posting..

    Perhaps I am forgetting that some of you may be a bit younger than this Old Fart and have lived only in times of peace.. When we worried about the Russians, Vietnam, Lybia, A-bomb drills, Cuban missles crisis.. I could go on.. We have lived in such peace for so long that perhaps we have begun to take our country for granted. If I have offended you, please forgive me. But please do me the favor of not forgetting the feeling of pride you have in your country for the rest of your life..


    It is great to see such well thought and worded comments from you "young kids" Crap, I'm old and have become my father...

    Best regards.

    hg
     
    Last edited: September 17, 2001
  14. Rick

    Rick Pumpkin Pilot Staff Member Admin Elite Explorer

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    On a lighter note... I see you are looking for a black grill for your Explorer. I found a few items at Pep Boys which allows you to paint over the chrome grill and it works great. It is a multi part spray on deal. The first prepares the surface, the second is clear and the third is the paint itself. I used it to paint my grill black (before I got the new frontend) and it worked great and never chipped or peeled.
     
  15. wabbit

    wabbit Active Member

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    This is the issue that needs attention...

    Michigander, think this through...
    There have always been so many reasons. It's just now that you're prompted to take a hard look at them.
    Not that I had it all figured out when I was 18, but an introspective look at one's priorites in the past, and the present, will direct who you will become in the future. I'm glad to see you're moving to a better mindset than you described in the quoted excerpt of your post.
     
  16. Hank

    Hank Elite Explorer

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    Hi Rick!

    Great subject change!! It has gone about as far as it can go anway..

    Although I am happy to see that it never deteriorated into a screaming of flaming match! I love a good debate/contraversy.

    Yes, looking big time for a black grill. Please send me the info on the stuff.

    Thanks
    hg
     
  17. Hank

    Hank Elite Explorer

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    Wabbit/Michlander..

    As I said above.

    "It is great to see such well thought and worded comments from you "young kids" Crap, I'm old and have become my father... "

    The media does not do your generation justice.
     
  18. aldive

    aldive Elite In Memoriam

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    Hank, unfortunately its most often takes just such a tragedy to stir the tide of patriotism.

    Too many of the under 30 crowd don't even understand patriotism. Its not their fault either; they were given such an abbreviated education in American history. They truly don't understand the sacrifices that many generations of Americans had to endure for this to remain the greatest country in the world.

    Please don't put down a new or reborn patriot; this wonderful land we love needs all the patriots we can muster.

    Flying the flag does not make one a patriot; patriotism is an attitude.


    Al, I put this in bold because this is what it's all about
    Thank you.
    Ray L.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: September 17, 2001
  19. 01EB5.0

    01EB5.0 Elite Explorer

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    Many people I see in my neighborhood have flags, but only fly them at like the 4th of jul;y or at times like this. That isn't "trendy" in my point of view. We have a normal old flag that we put out. My parents have had it all my life and we are proud to fly it. Flags are supposed to be lit at night and kept dry, but where my flag goes, neither of those things would be possable.
     
  20. rpenner54

    rpenner54 Moderator Emeritus Moderator Emeritus

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    I have not rushed out to buy a flag. Nor do I really want to. :) Well I have always wanted a newer one but the one I have will do. I moved it from my room to my front window of the house just so all could see it. Its not big but it does the job. Its not one of those little tiny ones either but it does do the job. I like it.
     
  21. BUCHVILLEMAN

    BUCHVILLEMAN Well-Known Member

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    i think that i can relate with hank. my dad is vietnam vet and he has a strick and hardcore sense of patriotism and that was instilled in me. from my life with him and all of my uncles that are all vets i see how they as vets they have been overlooked by our society. then in the 90's it seemed that our view of vietnam started to change and as a nation we started to appreciatte our vets. it was seen as too little too late in my opinion and i think that is similar to what Hank is expressing.

    after the Gulf war there were a series of personal events that made this sink in for me. my dad and i were in a bar a few years ago and a gulf vet was there and he was talking sh!t about how they had whupped ass in the gulf and how we didnt have our act together in vietnam like we did in the gulf. there was all but a bloody fist fight. this guy was a communications squid on a ship 500 miles from the action. my dad was a grunt in the jungle and he has spent the last 30 years dealing with things he saw (he also has to let go of somethings like 4 photo albums full of pics of dead VC.) there was a stark contrast. i believe that there is no shame in being a gulf war vet I AM VERY PROUD of them for participating and taking care of the situation, but it is a similar thing in the aspect that we had so many new patriots after that conflict and though that is admireable and i hope they truly felt compelled to love their country, it is almost an insult to think that their patriotism is equal to an old vet or even just someone who has always loved and supported the country (im talking of general public not vets.)

    im no more an american than the next guy but when the guy next to me at work asks where my flag is on my truck it sets me off. it is trendy patriotism and im glad that Hank started this thread.
    thanks for the vent.
    gabe
     

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