Water pump failure leads to dead engine

[Keith N]

I think so. I had mine right at cold mark in fall. Then a few weeks later with cold weather it was .5 inches lower. Stayed there all winter.

 

[RhinoQuartz]

I think so. I had mine right at cold mark in fall. Then a few weeks later with cold weather it was .5 inches lower. Stayed there all winter.

The colder a liquid, the less volume it takes up.

 

[03WIExplorerLtd]

Weather hasn't changed in a fashion to make a difference. It was quite a bit lower recently my coolant flush), and then came back up quite a bit, then seemed to go down again. Now it up and it hasn't been serviced since then. So its not the weather for me.

 

[MBerg]

Today I was informed, After my vehicle unexpectedly died getting on interstate with loss of all power and no warning, That I need a new engine. Failed Water pump, Repair cost of $7500. 2011 ford fusion sport, 61000 miles. Babied, Coolant flushed, Oil changed religiously. 3.5l engine. I signed up for the class action. Please everyone else do the same. They should be warning people. I would of much rather known about this, I would of taken preventive measures. If my vehicle had over 100k, I would probably be less upset. I am 57 years old. Bought my first ford in 1987. a ford escort new, Then a 1989 ford aerostar, then a new 2000 taurus, Then a new explorer. then a 2006 fusion, then traded that for this 2011. I feel Sad, I have a beautiful car that is basically totalled now (Blue book is in the 8--10k range. Looking at Toyota's, always stayed with Ford because of American Made. Vehicle. I have a fusion for sale, Needs engine, It is completely unacceptable that a failed water pump should not give you a warning. This reminds me of 1970's era junk cars. Ford is doing well on the stock market, This needs to get out. I have a feeling that this is going to become a HUGE thing.

 

[MBerg]

I was planning on buying a new edge by the end of this year. I have always had great luck with Fords, Yet feel Betrayed. Sad day, My Dad was a Ford Guy (RIP) as was my father in law.

The Class Action Lawsuit says---- T""he chain-driven water pump in the Ford Cyclone Engine is located internal to the engine. When the water pump prematurely fails, coolant leaks from the water pump directly into engine parts or the oil pan, destroying essential engine components or mixing with the engine's oil. In many cases, this mixture of engine oil and coolant is carried throughout the engine, leading to destruction of the engine. This often occurs with little to no warning. Despite having knowledge of this defect, Ford has continued selling defective vehicles, has failed to disclose the defect to owners and lessees, has not issued a recall, and has not remedied the issue and/or compensated owners and lessees of the defective vehicles."""

 

[MBerg]

There have been several law firms posting here. Did you initiate the contact? Does the 2010 Ford Edge have the same issue?

Peter

Here is list of vehicles, this issue involves
Ford Edge (2007-2018);
Ford Explorer (2011-2018);
Ford F150 (2015-2017);
Ford Flex (2009-2018);
Ford Fusion (2010-2012);
Ford Taurus (2008-2018);
Lincoln MKX (2007-2010);
Lincoln MKZ (2007-2012); and
Mercury Sable (2008-2009)

 

[MBerg]

Hi Motoarzan,

I work for a law firm in Ontario that is investigating this matter, and am wondering if you would be interested in speaking to me?

Id be glad to speak with you. This just happened this weekend to me 62000 miles

 

[Wes Hawkins]

We’re do I go to find out information about this class action suit so I can be prepared if or when it happens to mine. I’m already having problems with the paint bubbling on the hood from the aluminum getting contaminated before painting. Thing is only a little more than 3 years old.

 

[RhinoQuartz]

We’re do I go to find out information about this class action suit so I can be prepared if or when it happens to mine. I’m already having problems with the paint bubbling on the hood from the aluminum getting contaminated before painting. Thing is only a little more than 3 years old.

Posted earlier in this thread, if I remember correctly - Kessler Topaz Meltzer & Check, LLP Announces A Consumer Class Action Filed Against Ford For Defective Water Pumps

 

[MBerg]

I’m considering a small claims suit against dealership, they should be informing all customers to at least keep a close eye on coolant levels. For those of you who this has not happened too, I would be checking coolant level every time I drove the car. They all know about this defect. I notice Ford Flex forum has a lot of people who have had issue. I’m stubborn, I know I will tell everyone every where I go that drives a vehicle never buy ford again.

 

[Wes Hawkins]

Posted earlier in this thread, if I remember correctly - Kessler Topaz Meltzer & Check, LLP Announces A Consumer Class Action Filed Against Ford For Defective Water Pumps

Thanks.

 

[MBerg]

I saw a video on You tube about what A GREAT Engine this 3.5l is. Mechanic said he thought it was on of the best engines he ever worked on. Thought it could last 300-500k, EXCEPT for one fatal flaw--------- the water pump.

So, If i knew then what I know now. I would check my coolant level 2-3 times a week, while pulling dipstick to check oil at same time.

I suspect that maybe I had a slow leak into engine, Never got an indicator light because there was enough coolant to cool engine. Didnt know anything until the bearings went out and engine was damaged.

So, those of you who have this engine, do your due diligence and take comfort in the fact if you do check it constantly you'll probably be OK. Unless ,I suppose, The seal just goes completely bad at once. versus over time.

Those are my thoughts. FORD should just warn people. Then, action can be taken. That is my biggest gripe. The fact that people dont know until it happens, or, if they are a member of a great forum like this.

 

[metroplex]

I was thinking about this for awhile. What's the failure mode of the water pump? It's obvious the pump isn't weeping coolant out of the channel by the alternator as intended. I saw lots of photos of broken impellers (it is plastic BTW). And the coolant is being dumped into the engine. So is it a bearing seal leak for the pump itself?

One thing I can think of is the timing chain tensioner isn't working right or is causing the bearing/seal to prematurely wear out. Possibly due to the 5W-20 or 5W-30 oil being too thin or run too long causing it to thin out.

What if synthetic xW-40 or xW-50 was used? Would this help reduce the amount of timing chain tensioner wear/damage that might induce the pump failure?

 

[Wes Hawkins]

I was thinking about this for awhile. What's the failure mode of the water pump? It's obvious the pump isn't weeping coolant out of the channel by the alternator as intended. I saw lots of photos of broken impellers (it is plastic BTW). And the coolant is being dumped into the engine. So is it a bearing seal leak for the pump itself?

One thing I can think of is the timing chain tensioner isn't working right or is causing the bearing/seal to prematurely wear out. Possibly due to the 5W-20 or 5W-30 oil being too thin or run too long causing it to thin out.

What if synthetic xW-40 or xW-50 was used? Would this help reduce the amount of timing chain tensioner wear/damage that might induce the pump failure?

We bought a 2016 Explorer new at the end of 2015 knowing that the water pump could be a concern. I do all my own work and change the oil every 3000 to 3500 miles with full synthetic. I look it over every time. I did buy the extended warranty package and take it in to the dealer every other oil change. The car is of course over the 3 year B to B warranty now even though it only has 24,000 miles on it and I had a small issue that I found the extended warranty probably isn’t worth the paper it’s written on. Won’t ever buy one again. I’ve had three new cars from three different manufacturers since 1991 and have had issues with all three. I don’t think anyone builds a decent car anymore. The problem with the auto industry is that government is building them because of all the environment regulations the factories have to abide by.

 

[aypanthony]

From my understanding, the coolant side bearing seal of the WP fails allowing coolant to first enter the bearings, then the oil side seal fails, allowing coolant to enter engine oil. Once the WP coolant side seal fails, the cascade of failure is pretty quick, since the coolant system is pressurized. Water is a poor lubricant.
The cause of failure could be:
1) Coolant becomes old and acidic, eating away at the coolant side bearing seal.
2) Slack in the timing chain(tensioner failure) causes vibration on the WP bearing, causing premature seal and bearing wear.

Since the WP has a double seal on the mating surface, the weep hole only directs coolant to the weep hole if the inner seal fails. Not the same failure mode as outlined above.

I was thinking about this for awhile. What's the failure mode of the water pump? It's obvious the pump isn't weeping coolant out of the channel by the alternator as intended. I saw lots of photos of broken impellers (it is plastic BTW). And the coolant is being dumped into the engine. So is it a bearing seal leak for the pump itself?

One thing I can think of is the timing chain tensioner isn't working right or is causing the bearing/seal to prematurely wear out. Possibly due to the 5W-20 or 5W-30 oil being too thin or run too long causing it to thin out.



What if synthetic xW-40 or xW-50 was used? Would this help reduce the amount of timing chain tensioner wear/damage that might induce the pump failure?

 

[metroplex]

Some of the Police Interceptor water pumps are failing at 50k miles at an earlier time than most civilian drive cycles. I doubt the coolant is becoming acidic in such a short time, if that were the case then all the other police vehicles (with external water pumps) using Dex-Cool would be spewing/leaking coolant at around the same time and mileage. This leads me to suspect the timing chain/tensioner system as this is the unique part of the transverse 3.5 water pump design.

My girlfriend's Grand Am GT1 had almost 210k miles and 16 years of usage before its water pump started spraying coolant all over the engine compartment (literally, slinging coolant everywhere) and it used Dex-Cool since day one (granted it is a different pump altogether and belt driven). Crown Vic were used as police cars and those water pumps weren't known to prematurely fail.But these are all metal impellers, while the Ford 3.5 uses a plastic impeller.

A co-worker has a 2011 Flex (3.5 N/A, FWD) with 111k miles and never had to replace the water pump. She doesn't seem like the person that would keep regular maintenance of her vehicle aside from oil changes.

 

[aypanthony]

Yeah, could be. I think people have to pay attention to 2 things relating to this issue. Coolant levels, and start up noise. I think a lot of people ignore the start up timing chain rattle, thinking it's normal.

Some of the Police Interceptor water pumps are failing at 50k miles at an earlier time than most civilian drive cycles. I doubt the coolant is becoming acidic in such a short time, if that were the case then all the other police vehicles (with external water pumps) using Dex-Cool would be spewing/leaking coolant at around the same time and mileage. This leads me to suspect the timing chain/tensioner system as this is the unique part of the transverse 3.5 water pump design.

 

[metroplex]

Since the Explorer Sports are having water pump failures, 5W-30 wouldn't necessarily be the answer but the GTDI EcoBoost takes a toll on engine oil. I'm wondering if the use of a synthetic xW-40 or xW-50 would help prevent the timing chain/tensioner issues.

 

[613GT500]

Some of the Police Interceptor water pumps are failing at 50k miles at an earlier time than most civilian drive cycles. I doubt the coolant is becoming acidic in such a short time, if that were the case then all the other police vehicles (with external water pumps) using Dex-Cool would be spewing/leaking coolant at around the same time and mileage. This leads me to suspect the timing chain/tensioner system as this is the unique part of the transverse 3.5 water pump design.

My girlfriend's Grand Am GT1 had almost 210k miles and 16 years of usage before its water pump started spraying coolant all over the engine compartment (literally, slinging coolant everywhere) and it used Dex-Cool since day one (granted it is a different pump altogether and belt driven). Crown Vic were used as police cars and those water pumps weren't known to prematurely fail.But these are all metal impellers, while the Ford 3.5 uses a plastic impeller.

A co-worker has a 2011 Flex (3.5 N/A, FWD) with 111k miles and never had to replace the water pump. She doesn't seem like the person that would keep regular maintenance of her vehicle aside from oil changes.

To her defense, there's really no maintenance schedule to prevent an early water pump failure.
You either replace it at the factory's recommended mileage, or when there are signs of a potential problem.

 

[aypanthony]

I am not sure better oil will prevent the TC tensioner from premature failure or help prevent some timing chain stretch.

Since the Explorer Sports are having water pump failures, 5W-30 wouldn't necessarily be the answer but the GTDI EcoBoost takes a toll on engine oil. I'm wondering if the use of a synthetic xW-40 or xW-50 would help prevent the timing chain/tensioner issues.