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1998 Ford Explorer Map light Vanity Mirror Lights Not Working

Len.Keis

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1998, Explorer XLT
Greetings my fellow Explorer Owners! I read just about every thread relating vanity mirror issues but I still have not been able to solve the problem I’m experiencing. Any help would be greatly appreciated : )

I am restoring a 1998 Explorer. The map light and vanity mirror lights do not work but they have been verified to be in working order. I have posted a crude diagram for reference.
  • There are 3 hot wires that supply power to the accessories.
  • There is continuity from each accessory to all three hot wires.
  • The voltage running through the wires is 0.04 volts with the engine off and 0.1 volts while running. The voltage should be 12.
  • There are other wires running through the A Pillar to the headliner that power the dome light, compass and map light (with dimmer switch engaged) properly.
  • The resistance reading from the map light to the A Pillar wires is 33% lower than from the mirrors.
  • I installed a replacement GEM but it had no affect.
Question: Is the problem more likely to be within the headliner wiring or from some point before the A Pillar?

Thanks : )
 



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Len.Keis

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1998, Explorer XLT
Greetings my fellow Explorer Owners! I read just about every thread relating vanity mirror issues but I still have not been able to solve the problem I’m experiencing. Any help would be greatly appreciated : )

I am restoring a 1998 Explorer. The map light and vanity mirror lights do not work but they have been verified to be in working order. I have posted a crude diagram for reference.
  • There are 3 hot wires that supply power to the accessories.
  • There is continuity from each accessory to all three hot wires.
  • The voltage running through the wires is 0.04 volts with the engine off and 0.1 volts while running. The voltage should be 12.
  • There are other wires running through the A Pillar to the headliner that power the dome light, compass and map light (with dimmer switch engaged) properly.
  • The resistance reading from the map light to the A Pillar wires is 33% lower than from the mirrors.
  • I installed a replacement GEM but it had no affect.
Question: Is the problem more likely to be within the headliner wiring or from some point before the A Pillar?

Thanks : )


Better image link:
 






J_C

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I can't see your picture in IMGUR's site (might be a problem with my browser) but I get the general idea what it shows.

See attached wiring diagram. It splits from one wire into three. I don't know where it does this, but that is where you want to probe for 12V. I imagine the problem is before it split into 3 rather than all 3 wires failing, and it won't be the fuse blown since the same fuse is used for the dome and courtesy lamps that still work. Likewise it won't be the Battery Saver Relay since they also run through it after the fuse.

So if you have a single wire running up through the A-pillar for these three, could be before or after it. If you have 3 wires for these three, then probably before the headliner. I've attached the Workshop Manual Interior Lighting section too, but it seems to stop me finding more with a vague mention of circuit 705 and no link to it, but maybe you'll see something I didn't on it.

Besides the attachments, there are a lot more Wiring Diagrams linked in my sig below that you may find useful in the future.
 

Attachments

  • interior-lights-courtesy-lamps-circuit-1-of-1.pdf
    51.1 KB · Views: 25
  • 1998 Workshop Manual Interior Lighting.pdf
    529.5 KB · Views: 23






Fix4Dirt

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I can't see your picture in IMGUR's site (might be a problem with my browser) but I get the general idea what it shows.

See attached wiring diagram. It splits from one wire into three. I don't know where it does this, but that is where you want to probe for 12V. I imagine the problem is before it split into 3 rather than all 3 wires failing, and it won't be the fuse blown since the same fuse is used for the dome and courtesy lamps that still work. Likewise it won't be the Battery Saver Relay since they also run through it after the fuse.

So if you have a single wire running up through the A-pillar for these three, could be before or after it. If you have 3 wires for these three, then probably before the headliner. I've attached the Workshop Manual Interior Lighting section too, but it seems to stop me finding more with a vague mention of circuit 705 and no link to it, but maybe you'll see something I didn't on it.

Besides the attachments, there are a lot more Wiring Diagrams linked in my sig below that you may find useful in the future.
Screen Shot 2022-04-08 at 12.47.52 PM.png
the imgur doesnt work for me either, but thsi is what i can see based on thepreview it shows without clicking on the link forfull definition...looks like it reads: headliner (the big black box) map light: cenetroval the small boxes look likethey either say manage (unlikely) or mirror (more likely) the red lines say a pillar... something i cant read... then something dashboard... not sure if that helps any...
 






DR98FL

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Here you go.

C1.jpg C2.jpg C3.jpg
 






Len.Keis

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I can't see your picture in IMGUR's site (might be a problem with my browser) but I get the general idea what it shows.

See attached wiring diagram. It splits from one wire into three. I don't know where it does this, but that is where you want to probe for 12V. I imagine the problem is before it split into 3 rather than all 3 wires failing, and it won't be the fuse blown since the same fuse is used for the dome and courtesy lamps that still work. Likewise it won't be the Battery Saver Relay since they also run through it after the fuse.

So if you have a single wire running up through the A-pillar for these three, could be before or after it. If you have 3 wires for these three, then probably before the headliner. I've attached the Workshop Manual Interior Lighting section too, but it seems to stop me finding more with a vague mention of circuit 705 and no link to it, but maybe you'll see something I didn't on it.

Besides the attachments, there are a lot more Wiring Diagrams linked in my sig below that you may find useful in the future.

Hi J_C:

Thank you for confirming what I suspected and the comprehensive diagrams. A mechanic sugested that the headliner had to be removed at a cost of over $1000. I intuitively felt that was wrong.

With your diagrams I feel empowered to fix the problem myself.

THanks again!

Len
 






Len.Keis

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View attachment 428390the imgur doesnt work for me either, but thsi is what i can see based on thepreview it shows without clicking on the link forfull definition...looks like it reads: headliner (the big black box) map light: cenetroval the small boxes look likethey either say manage (unlikely) or mirror (more likely) the red lines say a pillar... something i cant read... then something dashboard... not sure if that helps any...

Dash-1.jpg
 






J_C

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Okay I can see the pic now. Yeah, if 3 wires are coming out from the dashboard then it's far more likely the fault is where these 3 join or before that, not all 3 wires simultaneously failing. It makes me wonder though, why they would have 3 separate wires for these lights instead of splitting after the a-pillar, since they are low current bulbs so a single wire would have been sufficient to supply them all till it needed to split closer to them.
 






sehaare

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From the wiring diagrams that DR98fl provided the first question you need to ask is "does the rear map lamp work?" it is powered from the same source. If it works then you most likely have a wiring issue, if it doesn't then you need to Look at the battery saver relay.
 












sehaare

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^ Battery saver relay powers more than just what was in that diagram, so seems like it must work still?
I agree but the original poster hasn't mentioned if any of those are working (unless I missed it) so I picked the easiest to check. Sometimes owners don't realize what things are interrelated and don't mention other issues that are also occurring. And I've learned the hard way from giving a lot of electrical advice on different car forums to no longer take it for granted that the owner has listed all of the symptoms of the fault they are experiencing.
 






410Fortune

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also the vanity visor/mirrors get their ground through the mount, so make sure when testing you provide them with a body ground
 






Len.Keis

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From the wiring diagrams that DR98fl provided the first question you need to ask is "does the rear map lamp work?" it is powered from the same source. If it works then you most likely have a wiring issue, if it doesn't then you need to Look at the battery saver relay.
The rear overhead lamp does work. Thanks for the feedback.
 












Len.Keis

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I agree but the original poster hasn't mentioned if any of those are working (unless I missed it) so I picked the easiest to check. Sometimes owners don't realize what things are interrelated and don't mention other issues that are also occurring. And I've learned the hard way from giving a lot of electrical advice on different car forums to no longer take it for granted that the owner has listed all of the symptoms of the fault they are experiencing.
Yes everything else is working.
Greetings my fellow Explorer Owners! I read just about every thread relating vanity mirror issues but I still have not been able to solve the problem I’m experiencing. Any help would be greatly appreciated : )

I am restoring a 1998 Explorer. The map light and vanity mirror lights do not work but they have been verified to be in working order. I have posted a crude diagram for reference.
  • There are 3 hot wires that supply power to the accessories.
  • There is continuity from each accessory to all three hot wires.
  • The voltage running through the wires is 0.04 volts with the engine off and 0.1 volts while running. The voltage should be 12.
  • There are other wires running through the A Pillar to the headliner that power the dome light, compass and map light (with dimmer switch engaged) properly.
  • The resistance reading from the map light to the A Pillar wires is 33% lower than from the mirrors.
  • I installed a replacement GEM but it had no affect.
Question: Is the problem more likely to be within the headliner wiring or from some point before the A Pillar?

Thanks : )


I really appreciate all the great feedback this thread has generated. Special thanks goes to JC and DR98FL. At this point I am disassembling the dash and looking forward to regaling you all with the solution!
 






sehaare

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The rear overhead lamp does work. Thanks for the feedback.
I'd suspect that 267 connector shown in the drawing. it could have come lose or have corroded. If you find it to check it, you can also check the voltage coming into it. If you have 12V going into to it, you could just run a new jumper wire from there up to your lights.
 






Len.Keis

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I'd suspect that 267 connector shown in the drawing. it could have come lose or have corroded. If you find it to check it, you can also check the voltage coming into it. If you have 12V going into to it, you could just run a new jumper wire from there up to your lights.
Thank you for the tip. I will check.
 






Len.Keis

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I don't have a problem with my relays but this is good information to know:

From Big County:

Relay Box 4 - located by gas pedal behind center of the dash...right above the shinny floor vacuum valve motor...you will see a long black box...take that off...and you will see 7 relays, 1 big one and 6 small relays...if you look at it with the big relay on the left, it will show like this:
1. accessory relay (big relay)
2. (top left) interior lamp relay
3. (top middle) head lamp relay
4. (top right) battery saver relay
5. (bottom left) one touch down relay
6 (bottom middle) parking lamp relay
7. (bottom right) dimmer relay

1RB4.jpg
 






J_C

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^ Thanks, there are pictures in this forum of that, including the part #s of the relays:
( Accessories is FOAB-14B192-AA (or is it F0AB-14B192-AA ?) - all others F57B-14B192-AA... or equivalent, for example on Amazon the F57B-14B192-AA can be replaced with various brands like Standard Motor Products RY612 )

Relay Box Interior 1998 XLT.JPG
relay-box under dash on '98.jpg
 



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Len.Keis

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^ Thanks, there are pictures in this forum of that, including the part #s of the relays:
( Accessories is 14B192-AA - all others F57B-14B192-AA... or equivalent, for example on Amazon the F57B-14B192-AA can be replaced with various brands like Standard Motor Products RY612 )

View attachment 429212View attachment 429213

Thank you : )
 






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