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21Robbie21 SAS

ok so last night i went and picked up a '84 wagoneer D44 Full Width or WT, Driver Drop, Non-Vac Disconnect, W/Locking Hubs, Complete, its got rust and mud, but it seems good to go. I'm going to run leaves for simplicity. I am 2wd right now and the SAS will be the first step toward 4wd. The axle is 63" wide so i think im going to run spacers in the back. I want to do this as cheap as possible. I want to run 36" Iroks or another 36/37 when im finished. Im hoping to finish in ~3 months, but im not sure how realistic that is. Bryan (BMXking) lives close to me, and if he ever finishes his :D he will have the PRIVELEDGE of helping me :thumbsup: i am open to any suggestions, ideas, tips, tricks, specs, references, or anything that might help me do this project professionally, cheaply, and quickly. I just spent 200 on this axle, ordered a yakima roof basket, and a new cobra CB and antenna, so im outta cash for now, and im going to PC for spring break on April 1st so i might not take any steps these next two-three weeks. But after that im anxious!

sorry the rugs arent a good background, but its in the unfinished part of my basement and thats whats on the floor and damn this thing is heavy!
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you think its dirty now? this is after i hosed and scrubbed of the initial Cm thick covering of mud
 



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21robbie21 said:
well i guess ill get new spindles up front and spacers in the rear and make it 5 on 5.5
Converting the Wagoneer's 6-lug on 5.5 to 5-lug? Get a set of '85 F-150 rotor and hub set. I think RockAuto has them for like ~30 each (you'll need two). Everything else you re-use (knuckles, spindle, lockouts). Oh and you'll need the inner wheel bearings from the F-150 too. Site below explains this (scroll down to where it says "What parts do I need to run a flat top knuckle Dana44 with a 5x5.5" bolt pattern?")
http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/Steering/Steering_Research/steeringresearch.htm

21robbie21 said:
this its a basicly stock waggy steering system
Just as a caution thing - Heims all around usually don't last very long - well at least the heims themselves when driven just about every day. Some people go with the TRE because they usually last a little longer (especially the D60 TREs).

If you dont' have the tie-rod link that ties the two knuckles together, I have one with the stock TRE's on them. I don't however have the drag-link that goes from the tie-rod to the pitman arm (its an inverted-T design)
 



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IZwack said:
Converting the Wagoneer's 6-lug on 5.5 to 5-lug? Get a set of '85 F-150 rotor and hub set. I think RockAuto has them for like ~30 each (you'll need two). Everything else you re-use (knuckles, spindle, lockouts). Oh and you'll need the inner wheel bearings from the F-150 too. Site below explains this (scroll down to where it says "What parts do I need to run a flat top knuckle Dana44 with a 5x5.5" bolt pattern?")
http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/Steering/Steering_Research/steeringresearch.htm

Just as a caution thing - Heims all around usually don't last very long - well at least the heims themselves when driven just about every day. Some people go with the TRE because they usually last a little longer (especially the D60 TREs).

If you dont' have the tie-rod link that ties the two knuckles together, I have one with the stock TRE's on them. I don't however have the drag-link that goes from the tie-rod to the pitman arm (its an inverted-T design)


to convert to 5x5.5 you can only use your spindle if its a chevy/FSJ Small bearing spindle.

spindles.jpg


-73 to 76 flat tops
-small bearing spindles
-86 fsj backing plate and caliper (my own application)
-ford hub/rotor
-GM/jeep stub
-internal mount lockout that you have
 






garf your right redranger4.0
 






i wish i hada thought about this earlier...i had an 94 f150 8.8 i would have gave you for free to come get it and all youd need is shafts if you didnt want to go thru the trouble of converting the front to 5.5...but it got sold
 






There are two things I dont like about that steering setup. 1 is hiems on steering. Some like it I dont. The second is the two heims stacked on one bolt on the passangerside knuckle. Good point to cause a failure in my opinion.

I built my own steering. I got the histeer arm from www.sky-manufaturing.com along with weld in ends for gm TREs. I picked up the TREs at the local parts house. I aloo picked up .25" wall tubing local to make my steering out of. To re taper the pitman arm to the chevy TRE I bought a reamer from www.stockcarproducts.com Steering and brakes are two places to not be cheap.
 






RockRanger said:
The second is the two heims stacked on one bolt on the passangerside knuckle. Good point to cause a failure in my opinion.
There are tons of early Bronco guys running it this way, and ive never seen/heard of anyone having a failure. I know it doesnt quite look right, but it works.

I would also vote for TRE's if its gonna be a street driven rig. The thing is, the heims dont really wear out, they just get a little slack in them. A little slack on your tie rod or drag link makes for a lot of slack at the steering wheel.
 






james t said:
There are tons of early Bronco guys running it this way, and ive never seen/heard of anyone having a failure. I know it doesnt quite look right, but it works.

I would also vote for TRE's if its gonna be a street driven rig. The thing is, the heims dont really wear out, they just get a little slack in them. A little slack on your tie rod or drag link makes for a lot of slack at the steering wheel.


what do you think that slack is called? it happens when a heim wears out. I just dont trust heims. they are open to the air and water and dirt so they wear out faster. Im going to stick with my chevy 1 ton TRE's.
 






I know alot of people have run that setup and it has been fine. DB1 from this borad has that setup. I personally dont like that setup so I went with the chevy TREs. The only real advantage to running the heims instead of a chevy TRE is that you just need to go get a 5/8 or 3/4 drill bit and bore out the mounting hole on the knuckle and on the pitman arm. To run the chevy TRes you need to re taper the pitman arm. The tapered reamer is more expensive then a large drill bit but my piece of mind in safety it was worth it.
 






RockRanger said:
I know alot of people have run that setup and it has been fine. DB1 from this borad has that setup. I personally dont like that setup so I went with the chevy TREs. The only real advantage to running the heims instead of a chevy TRE is that you just need to go get a 5/8 or 3/4 drill bit and bore out the mounting hole on the knuckle and on the pitman arm. To run the chevy TRes you need to re taper the pitman arm. The tapered reamer is more expensive then a large drill bit but my piece of mind in safety it was worth it.


just go high steer 99% of the arms made for TRE's use chevy TRE's no need to retaper
 






I vote TRE's that waht I'm doing as well ;) Just need to buy some DOM now. :rolleyes:
 






redranger4.0 said:
just go high steer 99% of the arms made for TRE's use chevy TRE's no need to retaper

To make a chevy TRE fit a ranger pitman arm it has to be tapered larger. I did go cross over on my waggy axle. However if someone uses ford knuckles the TRE mounts on the bottom. So if you flip the tierod up to ontop you need to retaper the holes to run TREs.
 






Like Matt said.

Iusing the Chevy TRE on my factory ford knuckles, the reeming goes real quick though. ;) And you get a sort of high steer :D
 






RockRanger said:
To make a chevy TRE fit a ranger pitman arm it has to be tapered larger. I did go cross over on my waggy axle. However if someone uses ford knuckles the TRE mounts on the bottom. So if you flip the tierod up to ontop you need to retaper the holes to run TREs.


ah i wasnt even thinking about the ranger box. im using a toyota steering box so it didnt even cross my mind
 






well im still trying to find some stock waggy leaves and the stock inverted t steering system. I'm debating buying this kit(section525 showed me) or trying to piece stuff together myself 5x5.5 conversion kit , ill be cleaning all the parts off that came off originally tommrow night. I just finished scraping, sandblasting, wire brushing, grinding, and priming. Ill paint it flat black tommrow night too. IM going to start a crossmember tommrow night also.

IN THE BEGINING
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A LITTLE SCRAPED AND BRUSHED
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GRINDED, SANDBLASTED, AND WIRE BRUSHED
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PRIMERED
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I have a stock Grand Wagoneer Leaf pack (7 leaf version). You're a little far though.
 






i pmed you, i figured id tell you because for some reason no one else seems to notice the big bold numbers or if they do, they decide they dont want to respond, how nice.( nothing personal IZWACK , im just *****ing)
 






21robbie21 said:
i pmed you, i figured id tell you because for some reason no one else seems to notice the big bold numbers or if they do, they decide they dont want to respond, how nice.( nothing personal IZWACK , im just *****ing)
Shot u a PM back.
Just wondering - what big bold numbers are you talking about ? Ahah sorry I'm dumb!
 






On the PM's it'll say (in bold) "1 unread, (not bold) Total ___" ;)

Looks good Robbie. So are you doing the crossmember like Sections? I talked to my neighbor and he seemed like he'd be fine with welding it if you paid him. Just get the stuff set up, cleaned up/ground down so he can go straight to welding it, and he can do it one night after work and it'll be ready for you the next morning. It would be well worth the money. There was a guy that came to TowPro needing a 5 inch tig weld on something, and the welding shop next door charged him about 90 bucks!!! I paid my neighbor 100 today for all the work he's done for me so far(I'll pay him more when we finish the front end). Let's just say after the welding today, if something breaks, it's pulling chunks of the housing out with it. ;)
 






bmxking5 said:
if something breaks, it's pulling chunks of the housing out with it. ;)
Ooof! better get a larger housing then :D Or a thicker one - theeeeeck
 



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We started notching the front crossmember tonight after we cleaned all of the parts. What are the cons to not running shackles, and just having hangers front and rear of the springs?? I think James (JS91X) said that 034x4 did it, but can't remember for sure.
 






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