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347 in 1997 Mountiaineer, what do I need to know?

CDW6212R

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Hi Greg, I just described your future engine right? You should do like I have lately, look at rebuild costs. For what a SBF costs to build, a late model used engine to drop in is cheaper, but with the matching trans and wiring, adapters, R&P gears, drive shafts, it's not much different. If I knew yet that the NA 3.7 would fit, I'd be looking at the turbo versions, more torque and power. The reliability is a factor when you get into the towing too, I only need the upgrade for a spare DD SUV, not a towing rig or off road home basis.
 



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bronchole

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Don't forget the transmission. It needs a much larger cooler than the stock one, way more than double stock. Find a long Super Duty cooler, from the early 2000's, the long version. That will fit in the front a little lower than the stock one. Install a temperature gauge too, keep the temps under 175 or so if possible. Add at least one external filter, I'd suggest two in parallel, one simple inline filter, and a bypass filter with a .060" restrictor in the line. I think that's the required hole size, thos filters are not made for full flow, it takes multiple passes for all fluid to go through them, because they remove everything down to 2-3 microns. With that you could replace the filters about once every two years at the most, longer if the ATF is premium and not getting dirty.
I have been running a OBDII gauge reader for years specifically to read the transmission temp. Even with the low performing 212K 5.0 I know I need more transmission cooling. That for sure will get worse with a more powerful motor. It's on my radar. I have the cooler you mentioned in the garage. Unfortunately, my winch is right where I'd like to install it. Still, I need to do something otherwise I will have to back off the hill climbs, not because of the motor but because the trans is heating too much. I already have to do that on occasion.

I have been considering a remote mounted cooler with a fan on it. Did one on my buddys Jeep with a LS5 in it and it worked quite well.
 






CDW6212R

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Adding fluid capacity helps slightly too. Add a deeper pan(two quarts) and the filter, cooler, and it should end up needing a good four more quarts. You could leave the stock cooler and move it up higher in the grille opening, while routed the lines in parallel with a new bigger one. If no sub freezing temps are seen, bypass the radiator, that cools ATF slightly too. Run a 180* thermostat at the most in the engine, cooler the better for power, with a proper tune any temperature is usable.
 






gmanpaint

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Hi Greg, I just described your future engine right?


🤣

Well, I have an open mind right now, and have lot's of time to watch others build, and see what works, and what doesn't. I like to see everything in working order, and the bugs worked out, if I can. So far I have only physically seen one 347 stroker, and one built 302, that have both been proven reliable. I am watching new builds, and seeing what others have done to learn as they do. I'm not out to be different, or one of a kind, just after the end result, of more reliable HP & Torque. Will weight out HP to $$ ratio, and make a decision then. 😁

So, I am rooting for the OP here, to have a successful, and drama free build!
 






bronchole

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Adding fluid capacity helps slightly too. Add a deeper pan(two quarts) and the filter, cooler, and it should end up needing a good four more quarts. You could leave the stock cooler and move it up higher in the grille opening, while routed the lines in parallel with a new bigger one. If no sub freezing temps are seen, bypass the radiator, that cools ATF slightly too. Run a 180* thermostat at the most in the engine, cooler the better for power, with a proper tune any temperature is usable.
Already running a +2qt aluminum finned B&M pan. Had to after I crushed the stock one.
 






CDW6212R

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Me too, I wish everyone well with any Ford build. The cost is the recent problem, the last ten years have blown up costs, both for labor and parts. My 347 to go into my Lincoln is on hold still due to wiring project delays, but I got it for a great price given today's costs. just the long block can be $4k to $5k for a mild version, you have to watch every item cost. I hope I can get a ton done this next year and work on a spare SUV, an engine project for a basic DD dirty job truck.
 






CDW6212R

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Already running a +2qt aluminum finned B&M pan. Had to after I crushed the stock one.

Good job, I have a PML pan on one of mine, and three more in boxes. I like extra fluid.

When you get to hunting heads, look at this thread about heads as an example of cost and potential reliability and moderate performance. This is for an Enforcer head, evidently a budget version AFR head that are $1k or so;

The ProMaxx heads mentioned also are a decent acceptable budget performance head. Note that much else which is better, will cost above $1500. Used heads from the better brands typically cost near $1k give or take, once completely done and ready to bolt on. Buying used heads for $750 ready to go on doesn't happen any longer, I looked for a pair for 2-3 years before giving up. The cost of used really good heads when done, is usually more than the new budget heads now. So the new cost of best brand heads is not a ton more, thus the $1800 level etc.
 












CDW6212R

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Roller lifters yes, rockers no. Avoid roller rockers if you can, a mild combo doesn't need them, and they are louder and less reliable.
 






bronchole

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Just got off the phone with DampenerDudes. They do make/stock a dampener specifically made to work with the Explorer front dress and ingnition trigger wheel, reballanced to 28oz:
PN: FO3024EX28OZ
(Just under $200 as of 8/2021)
 






bronchole

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Anybody got any suggestions for a engine tune person that I can talk to about my proposed build, Southern California preferred. I got a quote for an engine build, but before I pull the trigger I want to talk to whoever I am going to end up using for the tuning.

I want their input on how we can devise a way for it to pass California smog testing and how that impacts the tune. Specifically I am thinking I can survive a smog test if I am running the right injectors and MAF sensor with the stock ECU. The idea is to run it on that for a couple hundred miles, then smog, then switch over to the tune that lets the beast out of the cage ;) Then the next time I have to smog I switch back, run 200 miles......
 






CDW6212R

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Look on EFI forums for more details of how CA smog laws affect tuning and passing it, plus the engine combo. I don't know anything but what I have read, examples on the Corral are there yearly. I gather that you can pass with all kinds of modifications, the internal kind not the CARB part number crap. So any compression and cam for example, might pass, but it comes down to a proper very good tune, and the proper engine combo that isn't mismatched and won't ever run right.

So do hunt some more and contact a tuner etc, Don Lasota is recommended here by several members. If they tell you that it's possible with various combinations, raise the compression to what a custom cam source suggests(Ed Curtis is the big name I'd go to). I'd expect him to say 9.6:1 or close, to run on regular 87 fuel. Have an Explorer intake ported top and bottom, open up the exhaust as much is possible there, and use a little larger MAF and TB. If it's a 302/306, rebuilt stock injectors might do, but I'd ask that too of Ed Curtis, I'll bet he says go a step bigger. Stock shifts are at 5000rpm, with a step bigger heads and the intake, the cam can make it push 5500rpm easily. Tune the PCM for all of that, and some counties in CA don't require the OEM tune to be there, they don't check the tune for originality. Some counties do have those bad tests, that's part of the hell which is CA.
 






bronchole

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So, I am dropping off the block at the builder tomorrow. Between the builder and his local recomended tuning guy they have negotiated a combination that should run and pass smog with the stock ECU. I will be getting another ECU that will have the tune in it for what the motor can do. Stay tuned!
 






CDW6212R

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So, I am dropping off the block at the builder tomorrow. Between the builder and his local recomended tuning guy they have negotiated a combination that should run and pass smog with the stock ECU. I will be getting another ECU that will have the tune in it for what the motor can do. Stay tuned!

That's a great idea for a smog state, when the PCM is a single unit that's easy to change. The later(1998+) Fords would require swapping the PCM and PATS module together.
 






bronchole

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I didn't think about the PATS module. Are you sure that won't be an issue on my late 1997? I guess even if it is I can have the programmer dissable it.
 






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Even on the later ones, the simplest option would be to pick up a PATS module to use with the spare PCM and pair them using Forscan. That way you could still have a spare computer ready to go (you'd just need to swap the PATS module in tandem with it).

All that aside... no, you shouldn't have PATS to deal with.
 






CDW6212R

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Yes, PATS began in 1998 for the Explorers.
 






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Being from Komifornia also, we do not have many options due to CARB reading the tune and reflash count on the computer (Stated by a Smog tester), and the requirement of OEM cats or stock sized CARB legal replacements.
 






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The PCM maintains a reflash count?
 



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bronchole

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That's good to know!

I bought 2 off of Ebay for like $30 each shipped. Both work just fine. If I decide to do any programming, I will keep my original one as is and only reprogram the new ones in case they had already been reprogrammed. Pretty sure my original one had not been reprogrammed.

BTW, I ended up not going with the 347. The tuner said it would be near impossible for it to run in a way that would pass smog check. He suggested rolling back to a 331 so that is what I did. Still breaking in so no tune yet.
 






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