4.0 or 302 | Ford Explorer Forums - Serious Explorations

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4.0 or 302

I'm getting a new engine in a month or two but I need to decide weather or not to get a new 4.0 and use the vanir pistons and other componets with the BBK ( I think it's BBK) supercharger from Summit or drop in a 302. Not sure what cost differences would be. Obviously the 302 would have more expansion room for future mods and the 4.0 would basically be done. The AOD has already been allocated.


Noach
 



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honestly... I would say go for the 302. It obviosly has more low end torque and overall power but also has more mods and can be made exceptional. I'm not sure what the overall price is but if you are going to do a swap... you might as well do it right.

also the tranny for the 5.0 is going to be stronger and you wouldn't have to worry about the weaker 4.0L tranny (unless you have a 5 speed)
 






To swap in the engines alone I would say they should cost around the same. The 5.0 a tad bit more due to the tranny and adapter for the T/C. However you will end up with a better engine with lots more torque and lots more horsepower.
 












There is no contest, the 5.0L is the way to go.

After driving a 5.0 power "X" and Ranger, it is the way Ford should have built them in the first place. The "X" cruises great on the hy-way and off-road the "X" has the low end power to make it thru.
 






If you have the money to buy a supercharger for a 4.0 and other performance parts, I would definately switch over to a 5.0. It is labor intensive but would be better in the long run. I am in the process of converting to 5.0 myself.
 






What kind of Fuel Miledge could be exspected from a 5.0 powered explorer, (more),,

have been thinking about this swap as well, but what would the fuel miledge be? going with a late model Fuel injected 5.0 H.O Engine.
im thinking about the same due to the 5.0 not working as hard to move the rig?
 






When I was looking at Explorers, the gas mileage on the window sticker had 15cty 19hwy for the 5.0 and 16cty 20hwy for the 4.0. Definately worth the 1mpg diff.
 






Man, forget the 4.0 and the 5.0. Get a diesel! You would have the ultimate Explorer! I figure that since you are pulling the engine out, why not just go for it abd make it as cool of a car as possible?
 






Well I definetly think the 5.0 is the way to go. Now what's this gargin about an adapter for the transfer case. Do I need a custom one or will a later model one work on my 92? Also how diffcult would it be to change over the rear end to Traction-Lok and does the back diff ratio have to match the front. I'm kinda new to the 4wd stuff. I've had only sports car's in the past. I'm a newbie. Thanks for all the help.



Noach
 






This is a bit lengthly, but it contains the specs I was going to use to rebuild my 4.0. I have decided to go with a 5.0 instead for the following reaseons:

1) Cost (It will actually be less expensive to go with the 5.0)
2) More enhancements can be made to the 5.0
3) Modifications to the 4.0 will also require a new Transmission (Either a T5 for Standard or a built up Auto Trans)
4) Better Low end torque (desirable for wheelin)
PS - You DON'T need the expense of Vanir's Forged Pistons for a blower.





Cost For V6 rebuild $3200.00
BBK blower (supercharger) $2700.00
Transmission (T5, bell housing, hydraulic clutch, 4x4 adapter ... $2500.00
New 66mm TB, 75mm MAS, JBA Headers, CAT, Chip, balance Injectors, Oil Cooler, new radiator, other misc stuff - $1400 (it adds up)


Your at $9800.00 (cut out the blower and chip, your under $7000)
PLUS how much is your labor worth?

If you go with Auto Trans and 2 wheel drive you can do it for about $900 less

Engine Rebuild: I figure about 210 HP without blower, probably about 270 with BBK blower, but it will NEVER have the low end torque of a V8. It WILL be a fun street machine .

The higher rebuild cost is due to parts and labor for some extra porting work. Light porting work will be CRITICAL to making this engine work (Don't over work the porting or you will actually get poorer results. You just want light porting done: clean up the radii, Port the bowl and generally clean it up. DON'T enlarge the port volume. Remove the EGR warts from the exhaust side, and clean them up. In looking at the intake manifolds these will be difficult to properly port match. You can't use the gaskets, you would have to use the Fuel rail as a guide. The fuel rail ports are larger on the bottom than on top, but this is what you would want to port match if anything. The other problem is that the fuel rail mounting is a very sloppy fit. I was considering something like alignment pins as a fix. All in all the cost I was quoted wass way too high.

Vanir also warned NOT to use any of the roller lifters on the market for this application. They are expensive, don't do a whole lot for you, and are of poor quality.

If you rebuild the 4.0 you will need to do pretty much everything at one time, especially if you go with a blower. (Also remember, most blower applications require LOWER compression ratio's, 9.0:1 is about the highest you should go)

New Heads - Mahle, or Marnel (There are no Aluminum heads)
Cam: Comp Cam stock replacement # 49-410-8
Rockers: Delta Camshaft rocker kit
Push rods with hardened tips
Pistons: Federal Mogul Hypereutectic (H570P)

Crank, oil pump, rods, crank: OEM replacements

NOTE: If you go with the Vanir Forged Pistons, you must also use the forged rods. ADD $2000.00 to the engine rebuild.

One final note: What are you trying to accomplish? Is the vehicle for fun on the street, take to the track, or take it off road?

Another reason I decided agains the 4.0 with a blower is that blowers don't do all that well off road, in my opinion, they tend to "kick in" just when you DON'T want them to on the trail. On the street is a different story.

Good luck whatever you decide, I'm sure it will be a fun vehicle.
 






I think I would stick to the diesel, NOT !

I can not say for sure what my mileage is in the Ranger/5.0L but I know that it is no worst than the 2.9 it replaced. The 2.9 was working its heart out for me and still ran well when I took it out but the 5.0L is really there, does not seem to work at all on the hy-way or in the woods.

Good Luck,
 






okay im getting this V8 bug as well. i have access to a 93 5.0 out of a f-150. it has 150,000 on it. i would be actually getting the whole truck so i would have the tranny. i havent seen it yet. its a work truck from my dads company and they said they would cut me a deal if i want it.

my question is about the t-case:
is there an adapter that i could get to adapt my BG 4405 or should i go with a tcase that bolts up like out of a bronco?
then i assume i would have to get new drive shafts and find new mounting points for the tranny, and t-case?

i have the will power to make everythign work and a welding rig and cutting torch as well as drill press and scrap metal at my disposal, as well as a tractor with a boom to pull the motors out and in.
 






Find out what transmission is in the F-150.

ZF tranny is VERY BIG. You will need to make modifications to the transmission well and/or use a body lift. It may be possible to to use the tranny top cover from a newer transmission on the donner to move the stick backwards into a more stock location.

The Mazda M5R2 tranny is much smaller and should fit (this is what I am doing). I also found a tranny shop that has some top covers from a new R2 tranny that goes behind a 4.6 liter engine. They will put this top cover on the older R2 tranny for the 5.0 liter at no additional charge. This moves the stick back about 3" so that it ends up close to the original stick position. If you don't do this you need to get a shifter shaped like the old ford S curve stick because the transmission shifter will come through the floorboard under the dash. This is not a big deal to fix either way.

Cantact AA regarding the adapter. They do have an adapter that mates the full size ford transmission to the BW1350 T/C (50-4502 for 31 spline tranny). I don't know if the 4405 has the same bolt pattern and spline count, but I suspect it might.

Your other option is a DANA 20 T/C. AA makes an adapter for this as well. It is a manual T/C only, and NOT a flanged drive shaft end. BUT.. it is strong and there is a 3.15:1 gear kit (although it is expensive).

The adapters cost just under $500. 00 from AA, order through Summit and save about $100.00

It sounds like you have the equipment and skill to build the custom tranny bracket that wil be required. It is not really complicated, but just another thing to do.

In ANY case expect to modify the drive shafts if yougo with the F150 transmission. The adapter will add about 4" of length to the transmission and T/C combination. You will shorten the rear drive shaft and lengthen the front. Remeber.... measure three times, cut once.
 






thanks for the info Guy, thats what im looking for.

from what ive found out the that the bg 1350 and the 4405 do have the same bolt patterns (if that helps anyone.)

ill have more info on the tranny this weekend and the price for the truck. im looking at less then a grand for a full yfunctional f-150. hell ya.
 






Didn't they use the AOD transmission on the F-150?
(When it comes to Automatics)
 






I AM PLANNING ON DOING THE 5.0L SWAP ON MY 94XLT AND AM JUST WONDERING WHAT KIND OF CHANGES I WILL HAVE TO MAKE TO THE ENGINE COMPARTMENT IN ORDER TO MAKE EVERYTHING FIT IN THERE. I WILL PROBABLY GET IT OUT OF A 94 MUSTANG BECAUSE MY BUDDY IS SELLING HIS CAR FOR PARTS AFTER HE ROLLED IT. HE WILL ALSO GIVE ME THE TRANNY CHEAP TOO. WOULD IT BE BETTER TO GET IT OUT OF A MUSTANG OR A F-150? I THINK THE MUSTANG WOULD HAVE MORE POWER BUT THE TRUCK MORE TOURQUE. WHAT DO U THINK
 






With the use of special motor mounts, the engine will fit in fine. The Heater fan/AC box will have to be trimmed for valve cover clearance. I believe the pre 93 F-150s use the AOD fullsize tranny which is also used in the mustangs. (dont quote me though)
 






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