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410Custom's builds a 2007 Ranger V8 - custom truck build - Project "Ranger Premier"

Rick

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google schroeder ens

"Street car" lol

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It's absolutely amazing what they are doing with door slammers these days. 5 second 1/4 miles used to be reserved for top fuel dragsters and nothing less. When I started watching the funnies were in the 6s and the dragsters had just broken into the 5s.

Making outrageous HP work in the street is all about the computers.:thumbsup:
 



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Rick

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Okay BUT in order to set the camshaft sensor 180 (or 185-190) "out"
it really means we are going to set the cam sensor with cylinder one at TDC on EXHAUST stroke
The 0 mark on your balancer is used, not a mark on the opposite side
so the wheel you printed would not work!

View attachment 434619

I drew a simple diagram to help us visualize. (Please ignore the spelling errors LOL It was at 5 am this morning and at that hour I am a little bit dyslexic, O TDC!!)

Basically right now the cam synchro is set on the cam tooth based on the crank being at TDC compression
I need to reset the cam sensor to be on the cam tooth when the crank is at TDC exhaust stroke. The synchronizer will be pulled off the cam tooth and reset in the o DTC exhaust position.
This is 180 degrees of rotation on the cam tooth

For me to set the cam synchro at 185 degrees I can simply go to TDC (0) and then move it ATDC to the 5 degree mark, now drop the synchronizer in.
I really hope this helps!!

I will be lowering the truck this morning and resetting my cam sycnhro to 185 degrees out
I installed the two spin tech mufflers and exhaust to them
I fully expect the truck to run today
Fingers crossed
View attachment 434621

View attachment 434622

What's with the blue tape? Checking pinion angle?
 






410Fortune

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making sure exhaust stays away from future driveshaft!!

185btdc.jpg


Here's the deal
setting the cam sensor 185 degrees before tdc cyl 1 on compression stroke is NOT SIMILAR to having your distributor (or cam sensor) 180 degrees out of time!!!
That is where I got confused

when setting up Holley terminator X for a Ford with cam and crank sensors information on the web says to "set your cam sensor 185 out"
To me that is setting the dist on tdc exhaust stroke as we discussed, and 5 degrees away from that.
The actual instructions from Holley are to Set the cam sensor 185 degrees before top dead center

LIKE THE PICTURE, with the crank rotated 185 degrees before TDC occurs...........
Two totally different things!!!
Now I have clear direction and will report back

crank timing how to 09242022.jpg
 






410Fortune

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F yea bud
 






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Excellent work. Does that mean the 185* BTDC is the magic place to set the OEM synchronizer?
 






410Fortune

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yes for the holley it is required
Well actually it is required to be a min of 100 degrees btdc, but it is good practice to set it at 185 BTDC because Holley actually provided the formula to calculate this location back in like 2012
I will explain later in the thread, first lets get to what fixed it
We need to get Tims truck running!!! With these two things we are hopeful his sport will finally fire
He has similar coil wiring to me, as he followed my diagram!

Let me show you how WE fixed the truck. I say we even though I am the only one working on the truck. A whole slew of people came together to help me through this.
Brett was the one to show me the final "trick" to get her to fire, on a "hunch" (from experience!)
To be fair, the same idea was pitched on the classic bronco forum at around the same time, but I was still confused thinking they were talking cam sensor not crank

First off the crank balancer
"Lucky for us the stock balancer has a carved groove at 180 making this spot/tooth easy to identify
Now turn the engine clockwise (15/16 socket on crank) until your 185 mark is on the engine crank pointer

Now turn the balancer around one more time
The second time the 185 mark comes around to the pointer is the correct location


Now install cam synchronizer alignment tool
Stab 3 wire synchronizer into block, install hold down and hold down bolt
Install cam sensor
DONE

fortune_diagram.jpg



I have a spare crank balancer
683140CB-046F-4627-9FFE-05DBC88914B2.jpeg


Here is the CORRECT diagram to show how we get to 185 degrees BTDC
correct2.png

C11A5832-A362-45E5-8118-3AB91FF3BF34.jpeg



Factory balancer is 36-1, so each tooth = 10 degrees of rotation
With the timing pointer set to the 0 mark the crank sensor actually sits two teeth back from the 0 mark
the missing tooth that the crank sensor detects, (1 pulse per rotation) is three teeth forward of the 0 mark
So the timing offset on the stock balancer is - 5 teeth (this is important for holley software setup)
D3E7A265-01F5-41CB-8D7E-85E057FADEE3.jpeg

HERE IS 185 degrees BTDC on stock 5.0 balancer

Same mark CAREFULLY made on truck AND in position at timing pointer

6D49D7BB-08F1-49C7-9683-6BE59EE3A573.jpeg


Time to use the alignment tool and stab our synchronizer
C4EEA0BC-7304-46D0-B1D0-DB9FAA045D01.jpeg


This is the proper flag location
D3B843C8-104F-4641-86AF-EC6B374A95F1.jpeg

Notice with the alignment tool removed the flag is leaving the window as it passes by the cam sensor
This is DIGITAL FALLING which is preferred for tuning with the Holley, this is important for software setup

Cam synchro done!!


here is important info from Holley about setting up the PCM to run with cam and crank sensors


what we are doing:

"Cam sync location (degrees BTDC #1) = "Ignition Reference Angle" + “A” + (“A” / 2)

“Ignition Reference Angle” = Taken from Crank Sensor Setup in software
“A” = Angle Between Crank Pulses (crank degrees between triggers on the crank sensor)

“A” for a 8 cylinder = 90°
“A” for a 6 cylinder = 120°
“A” for a 4 cylinder = 180°
Using the formula above, plug in the “Ignition Reference Angle” you are using and the proper “A” value depending on the number of engine cylinders.
The location calculated is the “ideal” location and can vary +/- 30° or possibly more.
If you are out of this range contact Holley Tech Service for options.

Yakleys69 notes from Classicbroncos forum:
these are my notes: probably from multiple sources that I extrapolated what was relevant and likely wrote it in a way that I understood.
Cam Sync setup
Purpose is to identify when cylinder #1 is coming up.
Cam makes 1 rotation for every 2 rotation of the crank. Every other TDC cylinder #1 fires.

The cam sync signal trigger MUST occur:
* BEFORE cylinder #1 is at TDC on the COMPRESSION STROKE
* It also must occur at least 50 degrees BEFORE the “missing tooth” read by the crank position sensor.

“Ignition Reference Angle” = Taken from Crank Sensor Setup in software
“A” = Angle Between Crank Pulses (crank degrees between triggers on the crank sensor)
  • “A” for a 8 cylinder = 90°
"Ignition Reference Angle" + “A” + (“A” / 2) = Cam sync location (degrees BTDC #1)
50 + 90 + 45 = 185

The rest of my notes on this. no need to print out degree wheel each tooth is 10 degrees. Put on TDC mark teeth as needed. 36-1 trigger has 35 teeth missing one so 36 x 10 = 360

Crank Sensor ( 50° BTDC = Ignition Reference Angle )
Missing tooth is used to identify the Crank Position,
Other teeth are used for RPM and timing

Put Engine at TDC (engines rotates clockwise)
* This will be compression stroke of cylinder 1
* Can tell by placing finger over plug hole
* Also it will be after the intake valve opens, if you can see it

Crank Trigger is 36-1 tooth
* Every tooth is 10 degrees
* With engine at TDC , The crank sensor is on the 5th tooth
* So the ignition offset is 50 degrees

Note: the Ignition Reference Angle set in the software is is typically set to a value that is 10° more than the highest timing you will run. Do NOT set it higher than 75°.


Next My wiring diagram for the coil drivers
I found a couple of mistakes on my coil driver wiring map from earlier in this thread


test
 






410Fortune

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Wiring MISTAKES!!
I must eat crow for two things

First I was wrong earlier!

Tim's degree wheel DOES WORK!!!
Second, I had two pins backwards on my chart AND I reversed 4 wires after a coil driver

this caused me to be combining 4 cylinders incorrectly at the coil packs!!
truck was misfire and backfire during cranking!! Not good

It is fixed now
Let me show you how

wiring wrong at pcm.jpg


wiring wrong at drivers.jpg


I had typed 8, 7, 6, 5 instead of 5 6 7 8 and that caused a snowball effect

The file has now been corrected, as has the wiring at the truck

Basically I had to remove the coil pack and coil drivers
I labeled all 8 cylinder signal wires with their number (flags on tape)
Then I could see where I was way off! Basically combining the wrong cylinders for the waste fire coils

E45AB840-E5DD-49FA-8651-F65626857088.jpeg

The purple ink shows how things were wired incorrectly. The correct wire combinations shown in graphite direct from ford wiring schematics for our coil packs

9D913BB2-756F-4480-A61A-AFA8845B0D88.jpeg


With all 8 wires labeled for their cylinders based on the pin locations from Holley it was clear to be way off. This caused misfires and backfires

Easy enough to fix on the bench

I compared holleynwiring information to my chart and found some mistakes
Then I went and confirmed the truck is wired from pcm all the way to the coil drivers 100% correct (phew)
The only changes needed were after the odd side Coil driver
Everything else was correct

Tims truck used the same wiring diagram and is having similar misfires and backfires during cranking
We are
Hoping with this information about the cam synchro and the coil wiring his truck will also decide to run!!
 

Attachments

  • pinwrong pcm.pdf
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  • pinwrong drivers.pdf
    176.5 KB · Views: 6






vroomzoomboom

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remember i was saying i have a mark thats 180 out on the balancer? i should have said groove, and thats what i was talking about.
i will have to take the coil wires out tomorrow. lucky for me, its actually one of, if not the only harness to get out fairly easy. crappy thing is i promised a friend of mine i would do the rear brakes on his car tomorrow so this will have to wait. that and i will also have to sort threw the many revisions that where made to the original start up tune, but it does all make sense now. when ever the truck did try and start or did, it didnt sound like it was hitting all 8, and you could smell unburnt gas. this would be the reason why. i know i will have a few other issues, but they can be sorted out after the truck is running. thanks for keeping at it jamie!
 






410Fortune

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This is what we do!!!
Thank the guys at the classicbronco Forum Yakelys69 is the one who posted up the info on how he got his explorer running. The rest of the internet is just bits and pieces of info scattered all over, no real good thread for setting up the explorer 5.0 with the Holley Terminator X!
Truck is running, but it still needs tuned
I just wanted to hear it fire so I can move forward with the rest of the build!!
 






410Fortune

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Speaking of moving forward with the build

decided to use a stock airbox, slightly modified, for this truck. We did not want to run an open element under the hood, there are no good aftermarket airboxes made for the ranger, and the ones that are out there for Jeeps and such are $$$$

So lets modify some stock parts
I need a good way to connect the intake tube to the airbox
This is the job of the factory MAS
20D3F211-8632-4A2A-8CCD-9CD472B7A2C2.jpeg

7E67EDAA-8C87-4894-A844-F0D3D772EEC3.jpeg


So I gutted one, we do not need the sensor and we want more airflow so
D6B29299-789E-4411-B9AF-A47A72B6EB0D.jpeg


housing was filed smooth inside. I left some "meat" at the top to enable me to plug the hole
5F6BA260-5815-4FCE-B0D7-30CF358AC32C.jpeg


hole was drilled and tapped to accept threaded plug
C4561EBD-4D0E-46D5-A57A-312A08BFA3E2.jpeg


set flush inside
C03652FA-8212-4FED-8D22-89666D368FB5.jpeg


cleaned and JB welded so no air leaks
FA3D5141-6E41-44B4-AECB-00BDA33683AF.jpeg


housing cleaned and painted
81614C07-92DE-46A9-96AD-C05BB85F908C.jpeg
 






410Fortune

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airbox mods
The stock v8 airbox allows a little more air in then the v6 box
Still not enough for my liking so
26C314B7-BDC6-44E0-A5E8-A38380EDA86A.jpeg


I added a second intake “horn” and shaved them both down a bit, this should allow more cool air in from behind the headlight


Both glued in place
D4CBF995-2C69-4DFC-9291-07F1567C97CE.jpeg

Completed v8 airbox
5AF4639C-8076-4892-86D7-F57CFB3466C4.jpeg


Now the v8 box mounts slightly further away from fender then the stock ranger box so
470AC93D-2BF6-43FA-9C21-726AEAF272BE.jpeg

Difference is 1” out
Drill new holes, paint bare metal, re install bracket

EA226164-FE71-44BC-9055-FC23C1C4D8A6.jpeg

A1ED76D2-31A0-4CC4-8375-BC7D4BDEB1BF.jpeg

89B19C1C-86DA-48E1-9EAE-904F8C91E840.jpeg


Fits like stock!!
821FAB16-B265-4D5E-B3E9-931FAF57FE9A.jpeg


Everything buttoned back up and we have a running truck
CE4C38A5-D497-4E8D-82A8-69D93D5CE33C.jpeg

60A900E8-DA73-41FF-ADC5-965234ED3BAA.jpeg
 






410Fortune

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NEED to post a video of it running.


Okay here it is! Video from the first start

It is not very good video as I fully did not expect it to start. I had been trying different things for 3 days before this and each time it would just crank and crank, sometimes with misfires and backfires. So when it actually started it really caught me off guard!! I scrambled to get my phone and shoot a short clip, then thought "I better shut it down and check things out"
Soon after I tried to start her again.
Now she comes to life with the bump of the key

The FINAL fix to get it running was to SWAP the CRANK sensor wires side to side
Right now I am using a stock magnetic VR type crank sensor. The holley was not happy with our crank signal, resulted in a red light after cranking (6th diagnostics led is for crank sensor)
Brett said I should try swapping the sensor wires side to side on a "hunch" he had seen this before.
Access to the crank sensor on the 5.0 SUCKS
But I realized I could simply swap the PCM signal wire and the ground feed at the ignition adapter, took 1 minute.
There was a dude on the classic bronco forum who suggested I do this also, however I was confused thinking we were still discussing cam sensors. So thanks to @Brett and @EPB72 for the suggesting. Reversing the crank sensor PCM ground and signal wires worked! It reverses the wave form or field coil or something like this, it made the Holley happy

4096DB0E-E7DC-48F3-B03A-C037E95F59BE.jpeg


9B3AAB46-451D-4AB3-8806-AE8A5ADDE6A6.jpeg



So I did, then tried to crank the truck
IT FIRED!!!!!
I was so taken back it actually scared me......... it coughed, backfired one time (likely left over fuel) and then started running and smoothed out!!

That is when this video was taken



13 seconds of pure relief and awesome!
It was like 3:30 in the afternoon and I was still on my slippers, basically get out of bed start troubleshooting truck hahahaha

I will still be installing a hall effect type crank sensor when it arrives, it is a better setup for tuning and reliability
 






vroomzoomboom

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ok, so we know that the tack wont work because there is no signal going to it now, anything else in the cluster that isnt working anymore, or did you do your magic with the wiring and fooled it to thinking a ford system was still in there.

that sounds better on my computer then it did on my phone!

have you tried putting it into gear yet as well, or just happy it runs for the time being.
 






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While watching the video I turned the Volume way up!
 






410Fortune

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ok, so we know that the tack wont work because there is no signal going to it now, anything else in the cluster that isnt working anymore, or did you do your magic with the wiring and fooled it to thinking a ford system was still in there.

that sounds better on my computer then it did on my phone!

have you tried putting it into gear yet as well, or just happy it runs for the time being.

the 07 CANBUS cluster will need to be hacked
Tach and coolant, od off light, not going to work there is no way for me to input to them
Plus the theft light is just flashing away non stop
The cluster is just resting in there for testing

I have two other similar clusters (05 and 06 ranger) as well as many gen II clusters I can use for parts
That is one of the next challenges

I may have to bust a 05 ranger cluster apart so I can get to the meat and potatoes, then using parts from a gen II cluster make it function...and if that will work I will have to add just about every cluster wire a Gen II needs. Right up my alley!
I do NOT want to have to use a Holley digital dash, we like stock looking and that is more $$$$$$$$$$

Worst case scenario we will use all aftermarket gauges and make some LED indicator lights.....??? We shall see


Right now I am making a "to do" list
there is lots to do to get Eddie his truck back, but at least its getting short enough to fit into a LIST!
I have slight exhaust leak at drivers header, did not look too much into it yesterday, could be at collector, could be at gasket? will see

The trans only has 5 quarts of fluid in it right now
This was INITIAL startup just to PROVE the wiring and plumbing to the drivetrain are SORTED!!!!!!!!!!!
WOOOHOOOOOOOOO

lots of cleanup/fab/install still to do

Seat install is another biggie, the center console and shifter, need to install ARB air line, compressor and a mountain of electrics
:)
 






vroomzoomboom

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just wanting to know whats instore for me when (if) it comes to life. i also cringe at a dead cluster, and dont want to go to a holley dash (even with the bargain price of $1000 after the conversion to canandain pesos). the guy that is helping me to also get it started (his name is danny kimble) has made a interface that you swap out the stock computer and plug it inline with the terminator so all gauges and functions act like they did when it was stock, but he only has them for fox and sn95 mustangs. he has said he is working on a explorer one because they are very similar to a Australian falcon so i am kind hoping he get that going soon and may look further into it.
 






410Fortune

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I can make the Gen II cluster like yours function 100%! Holley has OD off light output, it has tach output too
Everything else comes from sensors in the engine or speed signals from your ABS computer
Your cluster (pre 2004) is easy(ish) to adapt!!
 



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