5.0L Explorer water pump (broke stud)

[njmalibu313]

Hi guys,

After figuring out that my water pump water pump was trashed (pully shaft bearings), I decided to replace the pump, thermostat, and serpentine belt.
Everything was going well, until I broke a stud, but still protruding at least 1-2 inches out of the timing chain cover. Well, rather than try and fix it, and fear making matters worse, I went ahead and installed it anyway,hoping the other 8 bolts and studs would prevent any leaking.

After getting everything back together, and a test drive, I am getting leakage. However, its very hard to tell exactly where the leak is coming from.

My question is, what is the likely hood of the leak being from the location of the broken stud? Does anyone think that any missing bolt will cause a leak?
I guess I need a confirmation here to actually admit that I f'd up, and will likely need to tear it back down, and extract the stud, so my next question is;

has anyone had a similar problem like this, and what was your solution? Since I have 1-2", I was planning on welding a socket or nut onto the stud, and trying to get it that way. Anyone have any other tips or suggestions here?

Thanks

 

[njmalibu313]

something I forget to ask,
I'm approaching 185k miles on the truck.
Since i'll more than likely be taking it apart again, is it worth changing the timing chain as well? The engine still runs very strong, and its been pretty well maintained. Do the chains generally fail after a certain time?

 

[ranger7ltr]

Just my opinion...

I would pull the broken stud out and fix it that way...You might have to remove the timing chain cover if the bolt is not easily accessed..You may even need to replace the timing cover if it is really buggered...The threads inside the cover might be seized due to corrosion inside between the steel bolt and the aluminum cover... I have always used either anti-seize on the threads and bolt body or non hardening sealer on the bolts that go into the water jacket...Either way retards the formation of corrosion and lets me remove the bolts without worrying about breaking them...

And at 185k, the timing chain has lived a long properous life...Replace it with a new double row true roller chain and gears...I would look at this as a maintenance item and one that changing at this point would be prudent since the engine is being torn down to this point to fix other issues...If this is the original part, there are probably pieces of nylon from the cam gear cracked off and in the oil pan and the chain itself will have quite a bit of slop in it...

At least you don't have to deal with the timing chain issues that the sohc 4.0 engines have...

 

[njmalibu313]

good opinion!

Thanks for the reply man, i really appreciate.

If someone finds this post in the future, even though I fouled up on the first stud, the second and third I got out with no problem by tapping the stud a bunch of times with a hammer. I also turned it both ways with my ratchet to try and help break it loose, and made sure I was applying pressure with the ratchet on a perfect 90 degree angle. I'm not sure if I got lucky on the other 2 studs, but I think it may have helped.

I did use anti-seize on the threads themselves, but didnt even think to put any on the bolt body. I'll try that. Never really understood why they didnt use stainless bolts from the factory, especially on things like exhaust manifolds, and downpipes.

I'll replace the timing chain as well while I'm in there. I did some browsing and see the 4.0 is a tricky one. This 5.0 has really done well, and hope it has a lot of life left in it. Anyway thanks again for the reply

 

[njmalibu313]

Update

giving an update, I managed to get the stud out without too many problems. I was lucky enough to have 1 1/4" of stud exposed outside of the timing cover.

What I did was welded a nut on end of the stud using a 110v flux core wire feeder for a tack, and put the full plug weld w/ 220v stick using 7018. I also smacked the end of the stud a few times to help break everything loose. So anyone who is planning on doing their water pump, I would recommend a few things;
1) PB bolt blaster and apply heat to the stud
2) tap the ends of the studs a bunch of times with a hammer to try and break them loose.
3) you'll more than likely need to use an extension bar for more torque, but rather than applying steady full pressure to loosen, try going back and forth (tightening and loosening) in quick short bursts (not using too much force). I think applying heavy force slowly is what causes them to twist and snap. quick short jerk bursts help to break them loose. This is all probably common sense, but easy to forget if you are in a hurry

This was all a relatively easy job (on the cursing scale),but I did run into a couple snags, one being separating the ac condenser from the radiator which I ended up breaking the clips off using a screw driver.
the other is figuring out the easiest way to undo and redo the serpentine belt. I will post some pictures and instructions on the way i found to be the easiest, especially doing it yourself.

Another tip to watch out for is when unhooking your clutch fan from the pump, make sure it doesnt fall and puncture your ac condenser. This happened to me, but luckily the freon was no good anyway.

thats it for now

 

[ranger7ltr]

Glad you got it going...

The 4.0 sohc has some major complexities that helps that engine make some major power.. But there are some major design issues that cause owners lots of headaches...

The 4.0 ohv engine is just like the 5 liter though...Pull the front end off the engine and remove and replace the gears and timing chain...

Did you find the timing was slightly loose? Take some pics if you can....

 

[njmalibu313]

ranger..I'm working on a write-up on water pump and timing chain for future references.

 

[Meriden]

Well I'm the latest member of the broken stud club. This is one of the uppers on the driver's side of the engine. Since I can see the whole shaft of the stud and the break is below where the threads start again, I suspect that it is flush with the surface of the block.

I'm looking at the following options:

1 Try to drill it our and get an extractor in it without taking off the timing chain cover.
2 Take off the timing chain cover and then try to drill it out and get an extractor in it.
3 Come up with some flaky plan to fasten the pump to the cover without taking out the stud so the water pump will not leak. (The motor leaks in enough places that any oil leak is likely to go unnoticed.)
4 Replace the whole motor since it has 230K on it.


Any suggestions, observations or condemnations appreciated.

 

[rb142]

Do not use an extractor. You will just end up having a broken extractor in there and then you are really in trouble.

Pull the timing cover off and weld a nut to the bolt. If you don't have a welder, find someone who can come to you (or take it to them). Pretty much the only other option is to drill it out completely (use left hand bits and hope it comes out on its own), clean up the threads and start over. That is hard to do in place without destroying the threads.

 

[Meriden]

Thanks for the reply. After a survey of the motor I've decided to replace it rather than waste any more time working to repair it.