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5R55S swap

rocket 5979

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Rob, how would you describe the way your engine is running with the higher boost, compared to the lower levels? Do you see more significant heat issues between 10-14psi, or near 20psi? I'd like to find a level where I have no worries about any issues, just decent gas. Regards,


I have not ran my X on the street much after phase 2. With these blowers the higher the boost you run the hotter it will be. Even when I was just phase 1 running 9 psi boost it would get hot enough to cook an egg on top of the blower after one run down the track. Heck, even just after driving around like normal it is almost hot enough to do so.

This stuff will not cause you any real issues as long as you have an adequate cooling system for the engine and blower. Do that and have a good tune and everything will be alright.
 



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rocket 5979

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You guys are starting to talk spanish again.



One day Jakee you will understand Spanish. :D When remote tuning with James you will probably pick up a little bit of basic understanding about it.
 






jah81592

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Rock--....Uhhhh, Robert:p: I have some logs I will send you. They are pretty flat. The jury is still out on this meter. Seems to me they are finicky to small adjustments. A small adjustment down low yields hugh adjustments to short terms. I only am running around 700ad counts at wot (68% duty cycle) at 6psi a 10% increase in range between meters. This is good! It is still impressive for a little v-6. This meter is capable of supporting a huge amount of horsepower & goes to show you how free flowing this engine is... Like I stated previously the intake ports are large enough to swim in.-jh
 






CDW6212R

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That's good. Now where are my old pictures of my 351C V4 heads. Those are as large as 454 head ports. I miss those old engines, I need to get to building them again.
 






Jakee

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One day Jakee you will understand Spanish. :D When remote tuning with James you will probably pick up a little bit of basic understanding about it.


I hope so. I need all the help I can get from you wizards!
 






rocket 5979

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Rock--....Uhhhh, Robert:p: I have some logs I will send you. They are pretty flat. The jury is still out on this meter. Seems to me they are finicky to small adjustments. A small adjustment down low yields hugh adjustments to short terms. I only am running around 700ad counts at wot (68% duty cycle) at 6psi a 10% increase in range between meters. This is good! It is still impressive for a little v-6. This meter is capable of supporting a hugh amount of horsepower & goes to show you how free flowing this engine is... Like I stated previously the intake ports are large enough to swim in.-jh



Cool. Yeah 700 ad counts is well within range for what you need now and in the future.


I hope so. I need all the help I can get from you wizards!


That is part of what we are here for Jakee, to help people out.
 






jah81592

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Just thought I would keep you guys informed. My shop has been backed up for the last three weeks so my truck got put on the back burner. I have currently resumed tuning and making progress. PCS mentioned that aside from the Allison and 5R110 the 5r55S is a very difficult trans to tune, the previously mentioned transmissions are the hardest to get control of. I have really thought of throwing my laptop out the window on several occasions in the last few days! Anyway progress is in the making.
 






Skydiver

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Nice work !

Great reading material :thumbsup:


keep it up!


Got an update for us ?
 






Jakee

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Which brings me to ask this question. I've heard the stock 5r55e will hold 300 HP, right? How much could this tranny hold if it were rebuilt with the strongest available parts? Could this tranny be built to hold 400 HP?

Is there a guy here named GLACIER 991 that would be willing to build this 400 HP 5r55e tranny for someone?
 






CDW6212R

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Jake, the Ford terminology describes the torque capacity of the trans now. The "55" signifies 550 lbs.ft. of torque capacity, just as 4R"70"W means 700 lbs.ft. of torque capacity. Under ideal conditions you should be able to handle 400hp well. That means proper shifting always, under light and heavy throttle, no slipping ever. Slipping shifts means that the friction materials are wearing out.
 






jah81592

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Which brings me to ask this question. I've heard the stock 5r55e will hold 300 HP, right? How much could this tranny hold if it were rebuilt with the strongest available parts? Could this tranny be built to hold 400 HP?

Is there a guy here named GLACIER 991 that would be willing to build this 400 HP 5r55e tranny for someone?
Jake,
Unless someone has offered a solution since I researched it there are a few parts which will work in the E that carry over to the S. But I might add only a few. Secondly if you go with a standalone controller on the S you will be able to handle more power because of the ability of the controller being more precise than the stock trans functions in the factory pcm. I handled 400hp well just remember keep your bands adjusted in this tranny, that is the life of it.
Jake, the Ford terminology describes the torque capacity of the trans now. The "55" signifies 550 lbs.ft. of torque capacity, just as 4R"70"W means 700 lbs.ft. of torque capacity. Under ideal conditions you should be able to handle 400hp well. That means proper shifting always, under light and heavy throttle, no slipping ever. Slipping shifts means that the friction materials are wearing out.
Don,
In theory this sounds good but what about the 5R55E and the 5R55S? The E is only good for around if my memory serves me correct 350FT.lb torque where the S, well has been undetermined. Up till now no one actually knows the capacity of the S and I have seen some 650-700 hp cars on these tranny's. Just like I stated above I will be able to handle more torque and power with the S and a standalone than with the factory processor controlling the trans. With the factory pcm the trans controls are no-where near as precise as the PCS controller. But that throws another deal into this equation. Tuning the S with a standalone is a bit**. I still haven't gotten mine perfect. But, it is getting closer daily.-j
 






CDW6212R

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That Ford terminology is obviously debatable. The AOD was originally inadequate for the 302's that they started behind(Mark VI). Now they are called a 4R70W, and work very well in heavy trucks for mild towing. The internals haven't changed much, but the strength and function have. I agree about the 5R55E, Ford was optimistic to suggest 550lbs.ft. for a capacity.
 






Richie18

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I know this thread is a couple months old since its last reply but i was wondering if there have been any updates concerning the 5R55S.

In the near future i hope to put down some major horsepower at the wheels.

I already have installed a Eaton M62 to test forced induction waters, but for the future i'm looking to do a turbo application.

s1050046jc5.jpg


So just wanted to see if there was an update cause I'm interested!
 






rocket 5979

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I know this thread is a couple months old since its last reply but i was wondering if there have been any updates concerning the 5R55S.

In the near future i hope to put down some major horsepower at the wheels.

I already have installed a Eaton M62 to test forced induction waters, but for the future i'm looking to do a turbo application.

So just wanted to see if there was an update cause I'm interested!



We can help ya with the turbo. ;):thumbsup:
 






Richie18

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jah81592 where are ya?! Looking for an update, re-read the article and i got excited all over again...!
 






jah81592

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Richie,
The 5R55S has lived and proven itself to be a very dependable tranny. Coupled to the PCS controller it is a very agressive tranny. I probably make the most power of any v-6 on these forums and this trans hasn't let go yet. I plan on my second track outing this weekend. Hopefully everything will go better than the 1st (last year). As stated previously this has been by far my most difficult tuning project yet. Did I state this tranny can be agressive????? If you plan on making power then this is one mod you will definately need. please note this mod is time consuming and expensive. Don't cut corners or you will be an unhappy camper. The 5R55E gets alot of negative publicity. It is strong and will last for a while if you treat it right. I probably had 250 drag strip passes and countless road passes on it along with towing and the rigors of daily driving. Keep the bands adjusted, fluid changed and don't kill it with heat. It will live behind your M62, very easily....
As far as a turbo, pm or email me on the some advice on hardware you will need (so we don't clutter this thread with information not pertaining to this thread). Depending on turbo sizing the M62 is only a lightweight in the power. Onsite tuning is a must. Later-j
 






Cobraguy

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Don, you might want to tread lightly here bud, James isn't exactly a noob here. In your rebuttle you pretty much hit the nail RIGHT on the head, which is that his turbo runs one HELL of allot cooler than a Heaton on that Lightning. Also he is intercooled which increases power as well and in turn requirements of the MAF. Also, he IS running higher boost then a Lightning is too. IAT's are REDICULOUS in those Eaton superchargers. Probably about 100+ degrees hotter than James' turbo. James is not mistaken at all when he says his L-MAF is about to peg.

Rocket, you may want to tread lightly here yourself. Your comparisons and analogies are all wet when it comes to Lightnings and Cobras. The MAF meter is in FRONT of the puffer...how the hell can their outlet temps make a difference to the MAF?? Both are intercooled anyway. Believe me...I've done a lot to my Cobra and the Lightning meter works very well to a high hp level. Much higher than you will see out of your turbo V-6's. There are a whole bunch of 14 psi Eatons running around with 500 hp at the wheels. That's the limit before you need to deal with a MAP. And that doesn't change when you go to Whipple or KB. Air flow is air flow and in front of the blower, it makes no difference.

I'm sorry to jump into an old thread like this, but bad information is bad information and should be dealt with. I'm not saying he's not pegging his MAF, (which I don't quite swallow just yet) I'm saying your reasoning is just flat wrong.

Great job on the tranny swap James.
 






rocket 5979

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Rocket, you may want to tread lightly here yourself. Your comparisons and analogies are all wet when it comes to Lightnings and Cobras. The MAF meter is in FRONT of the puffer...how the hell can their outlet temps make a difference to the MAF?? Both are intercooled anyway. Believe me...I've done a lot to my Cobra and the Lightning meter works very well to a high hp level. Much higher than you will see out of your turbo V-6's. There are a whole bunch of 14 psi Eatons running around with 500 hp at the wheels. That's the limit before you need to deal with a MAP. And that doesn't change when you go to Whipple or KB. Air flow is air flow and in front of the blower, it makes no difference.

I'm sorry to jump into an old thread like this, but bad information is bad information and should be dealt with. I'm not saying he's not pegging his MAF, (which I don't quite swallow just yet) I'm saying your reasoning is just flat wrong.

Great job on the tranny swap James.



The IAT's do matter. The MAF itself does not read the post-blower IAT's but the IAT #2 sensor that is post blower sure as heck does. As for pegging the MAF meter? Even though the L's and Terminators are drawthrough if you are running a more dense aircharge through lower IAT's then yes the demand on that MAF sensors electronics will be higher and it will have more chance to peg depending on how close it is to the MAF hard limit which is 1023 Ad counts if you allow it to be set that high in the tune.

You might want to check your "I've got a Cobra I am holier then thou" attitude at the door. I have a Kenne Bell supercharged 4.6 V8 Explorer that is pushing near 550rwhp in current trim and will be well over 600rwhp once I get the MPH 2.5 heads and blowers cams on it; let alone when I do the nitrous. I have modified allot of Terminators as well so do not assume that you come into a forum dedicated to Explorers and we know nothing about other Ford vehicles.

Actually from your example, airflow is not airflow. Boost is just a measurement of restriction against airflow. That is the EXACT reason why 14 psi on a twin screw is one hell of allot different than 14 psi of boost on a Eaton. The boost charge on the KB or Whipple twin screw is cooler due to the twin screw having better adiabatic efficiency which will in turn allow a more dense aircharge to be generated. Hence more power made with the twin screw and also more demand on the MAF electronics as well. That is also why the KB2.8 can make more power at 20 psi than a KB2.2 can because it is more efficient; especially in the top end range compared to the 2.2. Since you want to be correct then how about you use the correct term which would be AIRMASS. Flow means nothing, density means nothing, and volume means nothing. None of those mean anything by themselves. Now factor them together and they do. That is called airmass. If you want to talk turkey then lets talk turkey but I can assure you that will have a very tough match on your hands if you try to compare brainpans when it comes to modifying Explorers for high horsepower or even your Cobra as well. Bottom line is don't come in here starting shi* with someone who probably knows one hell of allot more than you about this stuff.

Also James is a well respected custom Ford, GM, Nissan tuner so I would be willing to bet that he might just know a little more about his meter being pegged (or close to it) than you. Especially when you neither built the combo nor datalogged it or tuned it. Until you get your little Livelink software out and log MAF Ad Counts on James Explorer then you might want to hold your tongue on whether you think James is close to pegging his MAF. By the way I do custom tuning on Fords as well so I may just know what the hell I am talking about here too. Stop trying to come in here and cause problems on a thread that is months old.
 









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rocket 5979

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C'mon you guy's, this thread is good info.

Can we get back on track please?




I am all for it. If that guy wants to start another thread and dispute these items with me then I would be more than happy to oblige. :salute:
 






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