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'91 shudders then dies - any thoughts?

pgrey

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'92 XLT
Hi all,

I've got a '91 Explorer with 208K on it. The truck has run great but today did something I've not had happen before. I'm hoping someone will be able to point me in the right direction.

It started fine and when I put it in gear it shuddered pretty hard. It drove fine once I put my foot down a bit, and then as I came to a stop sign it shuddered hard a couple of times and the engine just died. It re-started fine and drove fine for a minute or two before I reached my destination. After sitting for about fifteen minutes, I started the truck, put it in gear and it shuddered but kept running,and I drove it a short way home.

The shuddering I'm speaking of is a pretty hard jolt - it doesn't feel "soft". It almost feels like a gearbox problem other than the fact that the engine died. When the engine died, it didn't die gradually - it just stopped. It doesn't seem to have the problem in neutral or park, but when I put it in drive or reverse, it occurs. It's not consistant but is frequent.

Also, yesterday when I started it, it revved pretty high (3K RPM-ish) for a couple of seconds. I didn't think I'd accidentally put my foot on the throttle, and now I'm wondering (assuming) that that problem is related to today's trouble.

Does anyone know of any "typical" Explorer problems that might cause this? I've looked through the maintenance and FAQ threads and can't find anything that seems related. Any thoughts will be appreciated.

Regards,

Peter
 
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Vanquish502

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Year, Model & Trim Level
91EB, 91EB, 92XLT
Sounds like a bad TPS. Do a search "throttle position sensor". My truck went up to 2700 RPM when I started it when I had a bad TPS.

Go to a junkyard with a philips screwdriver and take one off and pocket it ;)


Forget searching. Heres a pic. Enjoy



Yeah yeah yeah, I know it's dirty.

Wouldn't have it any other way ;)
 
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pgrey

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'92 XLT
Vanquish502 said:
Yeah yeah yeah, I know it's dirty.

Wouldn't have it any other way ;)

I'm in no position to comment on the cleanliness of other's engine compartments. ;)

Thanks for your suggestion. I'll check it out today.

Peter
 
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MrShorty

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Spanish Fork, UT
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92 XLT and '87 Bronco II
When it "shudders and dies" would you say it is similar to the way a manual transmission would die if you didn't press the clutch in? If yes, then I would suspect torque converter clutch issues.
 
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pgrey

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MrShorty said:
When it "shudders and dies" would you say it is similar to the way a manual transmission would die if you didn't press the clutch in? If yes, then I would suspect torque converter clutch issues.

Possibly. I drove it today and it didn't die, but it did "shudder" and made some thunking noises that could have come from the gearbox area when I initially put it in reverse. It happened so quickly, I didn't get a chance to "ID" the noises.

I'll search on "torque converter clutch" and see what comes up.

Peter
 
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Jason94sport

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02 Sport 2WD 5 speed
Could be a bad MAS, IAC, TPS or fuel pressure regulator. I'd suspect one of these before anything else.
 
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Tony H

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'91 Eddie Bauer
Doesn't do it in Neutral or Park.... I would agree with above. Sounds like your Torque Convertor is staying Locked.

If it was Throttle Body or MAS It would run crappy no matter what gear you were in.
Sorry for the bad news
 
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pgrey

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I pulled the connector running to the torque converter clutch solenoid. When I started the car and put it in gear, it "grabbed" once and has been OK since. If I drive it for a couple more days and it stays OK, that'd be a pretty good indication that the TCC is the culprit (It feels like the problem is the TCC. That diagnosis jibes with all the symptoms.). At that point I'll drop the pan and see if I can clean up whatever I need to.

Sounds like a gearbox is in my future. I know I shouldn't be too upset. The truck's got 208K on it and I suppose it deserves a new gearbox.

Thanks for all your help.

Peter
 
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Jason94sport

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Ahh, didn't see it didn't do it in N or P....Then that would be tranny related.
 
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jtison

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'94 XLT/155 Kmiles 4x4
Keep your mind open ....

Tony H said:
Doesn't do it in Neutral or Park....
Fuel starvation problems usually don't surface until the in-gear kickdown happens, either.

I had this happen on another kind of vehicle last summer, turned out to be a very clogged fuel filter that had put a strain on two electric fuel pumps. It idled and revved just great ... put it in gear, and instant death. After R&Ring the filter, I eventually needed to replace the (expensive!!) fuel pumps to get rid of all the ugly stalling behavior.

A quick cheap test will be to R&R your fuel filter. Should only cost you about $8. If conditions improve, you'll know where to focus your next move. If not, you're out an hour and about $8.

Good luck,
--Jim--
 
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pgrey

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I replaced the fuel pump and filter about 6 months ago so....

It's making a noise from the transmission area when it grabs so I'm fairly certain it's the TCC. Also, it feels harsher and more sudden then any fuel related stutter I've experienced.

Regards,

Peter
 
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Chad Summers

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Any idea for sure what the problem (and fix) would be? My 94 explorer just started doing the same thing today. Feels like the torque converter is trying not to dissengage. Check engine light has been coming on more frequently lately as well, not sure if thats related though.. ???
 
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pgrey

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Chad Summers said:
Any idea for sure what the problem (and fix) would be? My 94 explorer just started doing the same thing today. Feels like the torque converter is trying not to dissengage. Check engine light has been coming on more frequently lately as well, not sure if thats related though.. ???

I unplugged the TCC solenoid connector a couple of days ago and the problem has not occured since. I'm assuming this means that the TCC solenoid needs to be replaced or the valve body is dirty or...?

I'm going to have the gearbox rebuilt. After 208K miles, it's due. No check engine light on my Ex and no codes.

Peter
 
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