Apten chip ... sever disappointment

[Sport Trac SVT]

Apten chip ... more tweeking needed.

Encouraged by Black Magics' dyno results, installed the Apten chip today and headed to the dyno.

First, I very much like the way the Diablo chip goes into the cpu case instead of hanging off the back like the Superchip. Second, I like the shifting program better also. As for the engine numbers, major disappointment.

My Superchip was optimized after installing my intake & exhaust. It has not been reprogramed after the MAF or the Random cat system. I sent Brian at Apten all of my dyno figures. He programed the chip from those numbers. They were not as good as the Superchip. I will add them to my graph tomorrow, I'm too discouraged today.:frustrate

Brian - you'll have an email waiting for you on Monday and we'll try again.

 

[Apten]

without looking at air/fuel there is no way to tell what is going on. But you having lower HP results sounds like you are either running leaner with the superchip, the vehicle still had memory in the adaptive tables when you switched chips, or it was warmer on the dyno than the with the superchip. It was a comparative run from one chip to the other, right?

When you swap, you always have to remove the harness from the EEC to completley clear the adaptive memory. If you don't do that, it will take parameters from the adaptive tables and override what's in the chip for a couple days/weeks.

I am more than willing to help analyze the dyno graphs and reflash the chip to make this work together better. There is no magic to making more HP with one chip than the other, somthing just sounds off. If you can get me air/fuel and the HP graph, that is all I need to make corrections.

Brian

 

[Sport Trac SVT]

Brian - The dyno figures are posted: Dead Link Removed .

When installing the Apten chip, the battery was disconnected for 20 minutes, the Superchip was removed, cpu contacts cleaned, Apten chip installed, battery connected, and started following manual guidelines. Dyno facility is about 35 miles away. After about 20 miles we started getting into the throttle to establish some higher cpu imputs. This is when we noticed the improved shifting.

Temperature was 74 degrees; 23 degrees cooler than the last Superchip dyno run.

 

[DarkFox1]

looking at your figures.. you saw a HUGE gain from just your filter and catback.. what the deal? I wish I coudl see an 18hp increase from my mods of such, but my #s are almost below your stock ones.

just by looking at it.. and i'm a total amateur, this is probablly the 4th dyno sheet I've seen besides my own.. but it looks like everything you so much as tweaked saw a HUGE gain over stock... you running nitro methane or something? lol, cos I saw no gains from some of this stuff and was told that they "make no difference" (items like plugs wires and cats Y pipes.. that stuff)

also, all I see is a 1hp decrease between the chips, and since you have 200RWHP I'd be more than content with that out of a v6 considering my 5.0 can't get near it.

btw correct me if I'm wrong.. but I'm seeing by looking at the charts (dont understand the figures in the table) that you have 200RWHP and 218ft lbs of tq at the rear with just an intake exhaust maf and superchip?

 

[Lifted95X]

I second what Darkfox says....it seems that every little mod, made a HUGE difference. But....all that said and done, I do see a slight decrease, BUT, I HIGHLY doubt that Brian will not be able to correct that for you.

 

[Black Magic]

Please read my last post in the "Just Got the Apten Chip." thread...

 

[aldive]

I find the timing of the post interesting, right at the close of the group buy.....

 

[DarkFox1]

I'm not trying to screw anything up, I just dont want to buy something and then have problems with my tranny.. I'm sorry I didn't think of some of this before

I've never really seen the #s of a 4.0L.. had I known they were HIGHER THAN MY 5.0l I would have invested in ranting some more about how slow my car is lol, as if yall wanna hear that.

 

[aldive]

Originally posted by DarkFox1
I would have invested in ranting some more about how slow my car is lol, as if yall wanna hear that.

I think you have adequately made everyone aware of your precieved lack of performance.

I for one am sick of the negativity about everything.

Are we gonna have to read about your disappointment in the chip for months? If its HP you want, forget the burn for 87.

 

[DarkFox1]

I dunno yet, I need to talk to the chip guy 1 on 1, I posted about it on the group thread, I'm sure he'll see it and let me know how to contact him.

btw servere, heh, probablly just a typo but its driving me nuts lol

 

[Black Magic]

aldive I find the timing of the post interesting, right at the close of the group buy....

Are you talking about my post?

If you are I was just posting in response to the other thread of sever disappointment and a couple of other posts about skepticism. I have been saying that I have had great outcome with my chip. I just hope that everyone is as happy as I am. I
could care less if no one bought the chip! I just posted my results as everyone requested.

I was not removing my pleasure for this chip, it is great! However, that is what "I" have found. I just didn't want anyone getting upset if they were not happy with their chip and blaming me.

 

[aldive]

Originally posted by Black Magic
Are you talking about my post?

No way Matt, sorry if I was not clear. It was about the giy who saif the Apten did nada for him.

 

[Lifted95X]

yeah...but this guy also said he got about 20 rear wheel horse from his intake and cat-back. I find it hard to believe, I guess anything is possible, and I am not knocking him, but that's seems quite high.

 

[Black Magic]

aldive Ok good, I just wanted to clairify.

Thanks!

 

[Sport Trac SVT]

The stock dyno figures are not mine. They were provided to me by another ST owner for stock baseline data. His ST is identical to mine regarding the year and drivetrain.

Darkfox - You are correct. The single biggest increase of hp and torquue came from the KKM filter and exhaust. As for the gains, I don't believe that you are looking at them correctly. Each graph line and dyno figure table header lists the components in the order installed. Each new run shows the change from the previous component. This allows you to review individual components and their affect.

As for the Intake/Exhaust/MAS/Apten chip/Cat HP (76.3°F) hp loss, it is only 1hp from the previous run (Intake/Exhaust/MAS/Custom Superchip/Cat HP (97.0°F)) but a loss of 10 ft. lbs torque. The cooler temperature should also have improved the new numbers. However, the Intake/Exhaust/MAS/Custom Superchip/Cat HP (97.0°F) numbers showed a peak 8hp loss compared to the Intake/Exhaust/MAS/Custom Superchip HP (87.6°F) run. But since there was a nice mid-range torque jump, i wasn't concerned about the hp loss.

In addition, the Superchip was customized after the intake/exhaust. It was never reprogrammed after the additional mods. I sent Apten my dyno figures so they could take the additional mods into account prior to burning my chip.

Matt - No one is blaming you. In fact, I even mentioned the improved shifting and cpu placement over the Superchip.

Al - I received my Apten chip on 10/3. However, I was out of town that weekend. This past Saturday was my first opportunity to get to the dyno. In fact, I even stated when i was going (Dead Link Removed). Everyone seemed to be more concerned about saving $5 and their gas milage.

SSIKORA (and others) - That guy can produce any dyno sheets you want and have offered to do so previously. You can also view the dyno history by searching Mysporttrac.com. I haven't wasted my time scanning the sheets because you can't see enough detail. By entering them in a spreadsheet, there's as much detail as anyone could want.

I realize I'm a newcomer here, but none of you have broken out the welcome mat.

 

[DarkFox1]

wow, nice post man, very thorough.

I apologize for my assumptions, there were like 4 or 5 runs on 1 sheet heh, it was rather difficult for me to read, but I did notice some very very nice peak performance numbers that seemed well above my 5.0. I guess I'm being selfish, but I expect more out of a stock 5.0 than a 4.0 with just a few more mods. I dont mean to be insulting by that.. I just want to beleive that the v8 is a good engine

 

[Lifted95X]

I understand Rob. Like I said....it just seems like an incredible increase for these mods. I appreciate you reporting your findings/readings. It is very helpful to show which mods do what. The air/fuel ratio looks off in the Apten graph.

 

[Robert]

Originally posted by DarkFox1
. . . I guess I'm being selfish, but I expect more out of a stock 5.0 than a 4.0 with just a few more mods. I dont mean to be insulting by that.. I just want to beleive that the v8 is a good engine

DarkFox1 - You also need to realize that your '97 5.0L is only rated for 1 more horsepower and 34 more ft/lbs. of torque than an '01 4.0L SOHC. It wouldn't take much to get the SOHC HP figures higher than your 5.0L when stock. Although you do have an intake and exhaust but you didn't seem to get out of them what you should have. I guess if you still have your stock intake and exhaust, you could try putting them back on and then getting another dyno run for comparisons. It would take a lot more mods on the SOHC though to equal your torque. Your 5.0L should respond every bit as well to mods as the SOHC and your 5.0L has more potential.

 

[DarkFox1]

well, on my last dyno run I pulled a 220.8 ft lbs of TQ at the rear wheels.. waht does the SOHC pull?

 

[Mbrooks420]

Ron, Welcome to the site, sorry if no one has broken out any mats By the way signatures are supposed to be kept to 6 lines.