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Deep Base Type Noise - Tires?

D075407

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City, State
Perkasie. Pa 18944
Year, Model & Trim Level
2020 Ford Explorer XLT
Just leased 2020 Explorer XLT . Within a week of having the car I complained to dealer that car is very noisey when hitting the littlest bumps even driving slow speed. The noise is like a deep base sound like deep noise from a radio it hurts your ears. They thought it was the tires and told me Ford put a yellow foam inside the tires to help with the ride to make the ride quieter at assembly at the factory. Long story short they said they couldn’t scrape the stuff out of tires and therefore swapped my tires with another new car on lot. That didn’t fix problem. Then they ordered me new tires and when they took the second set of tires off of my car to put new ordered tires on they notice that these tires didn’t have the yellow foam . End result ford told me it’s a characteristic of the cars and there is now nothing more they can do.
I am so disgusted new car and now I stuck with getting sick every time I drive because it gives me migraine headaches .

anyone else have same issue bc they are telling me I am the first to complain. For a 47,000 Car it is made if cheap plastic and I am very unhappy I bought this car . This is my 5th ford and honestly the first time I have ever had a problem with Ford.
 



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join the club. Read the attachment...Yes, and mine still rattles.
 

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  • I have the same odd sound in my front suspension like something is loose.pdf
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Welcome to the Forum D075407. :wave:
The reason for putting foam in the tires is to reduce noise. It is designed to stop exactly what you are hearing when hitting bumps. Sounds like it isn't working. FYI, this is the first such thread linking it to the tires.


Peter
 






Just leased 2020 Explorer XLT . Within a week of having the car I complained to dealer that car is very noisey when hitting the littlest bumps even driving slow speed. The noise is like a deep base sound like deep noise from a radio it hurts your ears. They thought it was the tires and told me Ford put a yellow foam inside the tires to help with the ride to make the ride quieter at assembly at the factory. Long story short they said they couldn’t scrape the stuff out of tires and therefore swapped my tires with another new car on lot. That didn’t fix problem. Then they ordered me new tires and when they took the second set of tires off of my car to put new ordered tires on they notice that these tires didn’t have the yellow foam . End result ford told me it’s a characteristic of the cars and there is now nothing more they can do.
I am so disgusted new car and now I stuck with getting sick every time I drive because it gives me migraine headaches .

anyone else have same issue bc they are telling me I am the first to complain. For a 47,000 Car it is made if cheap plastic and I am very unhappy I bought this car . This is my 5th ford and honestly the first time I have ever had a problem with Ford.
Curious, is your XLT 4-wheel drive? There seems to be consensus that the noise is only in the 4-wheel units
 






The noise is like a deep base sound like deep noise from a radio it hurts your ears.
I have this problem! I just logged back into this forum to see if I could find a thread on this issue, because it's such a low, dull, odd sound, that it's hard to explain, and I thought I was going crazy. It bothers my ears, but not in a way that a high pitched or loud noise would. It's definitely annoying. I hear it most at low speeds over very minor bumps. The best I can explain it, it's like someone put you in a 8-foot diameter rubber ball and started gently tapping on the ball from the outside.
 






Just leased 2020 Explorer XLT . Within a week of having the car I complained to dealer that car is very noisey when hitting the littlest bumps even driving slow speed. The noise is like a deep base sound like deep noise from a radio it hurts your ears. They thought it was the tires and told me Ford put a yellow foam inside the tires to help with the ride to make the ride quieter at assembly at the factory. Long story short they said they couldn’t scrape the stuff out of tires and therefore swapped my tires with another new car on lot. That didn’t fix problem. Then they ordered me new tires and when they took the second set of tires off of my car to put new ordered tires on they notice that these tires didn’t have the yellow foam . End result ford told me it’s a characteristic of the cars and there is now nothing more they can do.
I am so disgusted new car and now I stuck with getting sick every time I drive because it gives me migraine headaches .

anyone else have same issue bc they are telling me I am the first to complain. For a 47,000 Car it is made if cheap plastic and I am very unhappy I bought this car . This is my 5th ford and honestly the first time I have ever had a problem with Ford.
I'm in the exact same position! I also have a 2020 Explorer with Pirelli 275/45R21 foam filled tires and they absolutely SUCK! When I took the vehicle for a test ride I felt a vibration but the salesman said the tires were most likely flat spotted from sitting out side in the cold. Should go away in 200 miles he said. It didn't. All the same issues you describe: deep bass-like sound, vibrations, I feel every little grain of sand that I drive over, worst ride ever. On really cold mornings it drives like it has square tires. Went back to the dealer and they also did a tire swap with another vehicle and said there was no change. Well if you trade **** for **** it won't change a thing. They also told me no one else has complained. Hate this car with a passion. I could write quite a list of things I hate about this turd. When I go to the gas station I encourage people to stand next to the car and light up a smoke. Last Ford product I'll ever buy
 






I'm in the exact same position! I also have a 2020 Explorer with Pirelli 275/45R21 foam filled tires and they absolutely SUCK! When I took the vehicle for a test ride I felt a vibration but the salesman said the tires were most likely flat spotted from sitting out side in the cold. Should go away in 200 miles he said. It didn't. All the same issues you describe: deep bass-like sound, vibrations, I feel every little grain of sand that I drive over, worst ride ever. On really cold mornings it drives like it has square tires. Went back to the dealer and they also did a tire swap with another vehicle and said there was no change. Well if you trade **** for **** it won't change a thing. They also told me no one else has complained. Hate this car with a passion. I could write quite a list of things I hate about this turd. When I go to the gas station I encourage people to stand next to the car and light up a smoke. Last Ford product I'll ever buy

The worst thing is actually believing it takes 200 miles to get rid of flat spots because the car was sitting. I swear either they need to train salesmen to learn about cars or someone needs to out a dealer if the salesmen try to give BS to the customer. Because that's not right at all.

Usually directional tires are more prone to flat spotting. And when that happens to me, the vibration goes away after 10 minutes of driving, basically as the tires are heating up and you're rolling (say on the highway etc). It does NOT take 200 miles. He's just saying that in hopes that 200 miles will take you days or even a week or 2 to do, then you won't worry about it, or you'll forget or have no time to go back to the dealer and you'll just forget about it.
 






Welcome to the Forum Roadfever. :wave:
As the member above mentioned, it doesn't take 200 miles of driving to cure flat-spotting. A few miles will do. It is quite common to have that condition if a vehicle has been sitting for a while in cold temperatures. I have experienced it myself and it is usually gone in a couple of miles. I believe it is more common in the larger size tires.

Peter
 






Found this thread and read with much disappointment. These are the exact same set of problems I'm experiencing with my brand new 2021 Platinum. I waited 6 months for this vehicle and how I wish I saw this information before delivery. We took it on a long trip into the country this weekend and the ride/noise issues spoiled what would have been a pleasant autumn outing.
The dealership called me today after I explained the issues to my salesperson. I'm bringing the vehicle back on monday and they have a loaner lined up. I'll bring the information posted in this thread too.
Does anyone have any further suggestions? Perhaps I should start a new thread.
 






No need to start a new thread if you're experiencing the same issue.

Peter
 






I just got my Platinum back from the dealer after waiting for a month for a variety of problems, but as to the base rumble, I now have a definitive answer to all my complaints, dating back to November 2019.

Comment From: Ford Comment Date: Sep-14-2021 13:17:25
There is not additional information about the noise condition for those vehicles; as we mentioned before, this noise has been found to be a normal operating characteristic for this vehicle.
No further diagnostics or repairs should be completed for this condition.


So there it is, after nearly a dozen visits to the dealer and nearly three months total in the shop. The shop time was more for other problems, like the cranky transmission shifts and numerous electronic faults. But, each time I gave up the use of the vehicle for a new problem I asked the dealer to continue to investigate the rumble. The dealer, Larry Miller Ford in Mesa, AZ did everything possible to help ( I just returned a nice 2020 Fusion loaner that I've had for 30 days) but in the end, it all came down to that final comment from Ford.

I haven't decided what to do next. Like Pedro, suggestions are welcomed.
 






Reading SteveAZ's comment from Ford (#11) is a real eye opener. Thanks for posting that Steve. Forewarned is forearmed!
I'll prepare myself for the long haul and report back as this issue matures.
 






Reading SteveAZ's comment from Ford (#11) is a real eye opener. Thanks for posting that Steve. Forewarned is forearmed!
I'll prepare myself for the long haul and report back as this issue matures.
Being that you are in NY, do you run winter tires? If so, it would be easier to see if it is the current tires that are the problem.

Peter
 






Being that you are in NY, do you run winter tires? If so, it would be easier to see if it is the current tires that are the problem.

Peter
Peter, thanks for weighing in and that's an excellent suggestion as I'm in Western NY and yes we do have winter snowfalls that are often significant. I prefer a snow tread tire for the snow season and was planning on purchasing winter snow tires before I was sidetracked by the ride acoustic issues.
I'm contemplating purchasing a 255/65 R18 wheel/snow tire set. The 255/65 R18 series sidewall is 34% taller than the oem 275/45 R21 and will transmit less road surface induced noise. If the higher profile tire significantly improves ride acoustics the 21s are going up for sale. Comparing the tires sizes the 255/65 R18 is in the +1% circumference range. That should be acceptable. Do you agree?

My testing: Last night at 10pm I lowered the tire pressure in the Pirelli Scorpion Zero 275/45 R21 tires to 29 psi cold (recommended is 32psi cold) and took a 30 minute test drive on rural roads around my neighborhood. The steering had a very heavy touch and the road noise was noticeably reduced and noticeably different. Noises were still present and still not acceptable. However, there was much less suspension feedback (noise and impact thudding) from road surface imperfections. That was encouraging, however the low frequency rumble noises upon deceleration in the 45-20 mph range were still present. I found a section of road nearby (repaved last month) with blacktop paving that had a slight undulation and coasting at 35 mph the suspension feedback was significant with the charasteric low frequency rumble noise reverberating throughout the cabin. That really has me wondering if the tires are transmitting and magnifying the noises. It seems to me the tires are acting as if they are semi solid rubber, transmitting every roadway surface imperfection to the wheel, to the suspension and then to the body components and finally to the driver. I read there is a version of the Pirelli Scorpion Zero All Season tires that have a foam like substance attached to the inner tread however my oem tires do not have the PNCS label molded in the sidewall as shown on the Pirelli website (PNCS - Pirelli Noise Canceling System).

So it appears the tires are significantly involved in the overall poor acoustic driving experience. I believe changing to a higher profile winter tire is an opportunity to gather additional information and ultimately change/improve the dynamics of the ride.
That said there may still be a drive-line issue contributing to the cabin noise which if that's the case the intelligent 4wd system is possibly a modern day version of the 1940 Tacoma Narrows Bridge. That bridge suffered a structural collapse due to poor understanding of aerodynamic flutter dynamics shortly after opening in 1940. Please see Verrazano Narrows Bridge for the full story and interesting video.

As I indicated above, I'm contemplating purchasing a 255/65 R18 wheel/snow tire set. I'd like a custom aftermarket wheel as opposed to a steel wheel. From what I've read the oem factory wheel has an Offset of +37.5mm and I need to ensure I have that correct. Can you confirm this? I'm also not sure an 18" wheel has sufficient clearance for the brake system on a Platinum model. Perhaps you can comment on this also.
 






I'm not sure about the offset. I always used the steel 18" Interceptor wheels and just had the dealer put them on. I've never had to adjust any offset on them nor on the 17" steelies I put on my 2011 Limited. As for the tire size you are think about using, yes, there would be a +1% diameter difference. Well with the accepted 3%maximum. At 60 mph with those tires, your actual speed would be 60.6 mph.

Peter
 






D075407, let me see if I can add some insight on your and others situations.

Let me preface by saying I have severe sound sensativity, actually diagnosed with a condition called Hyperacusis (google it), which I have on the extreme end. I also have high frequency hearing loss and 24/7 tinnitus that is permananent. Needless to say, whenever I test a car, my first priority is noise. I actually just posted a thread yesterday about our explorers and whether they do in fact have acoustic glass for mitigating sound.

So the phenomenom you are describing is something that I have noticed for years when test driving cars. My ears will pick up on it quicker than anyone. Some cars/suv's manage it better thans others and yes, tires can be a variable here.

I've come to several theories as to what creates this booming/resonating/deep sound in the cabin. One is that I feel it is more prevalant on unibody cars, than body on frame cars. Body on frame cars would be for example, trucks, jeep wranglers, ford expedition, etc. My theory is that the body on frame essentially isolates the body and in this case, the cabin better.

Secondly tires and their harshness would likely be a component here. Moreover, many of these vehicles and the higher trim level explorers have very large wheels which require low profile tires. These tires have greatly reduced side walls that may exaccerbate this problem.

Lastly, sometimes I think that it is the overall cavernous interior of these cars that may have some particular acoustic characteristic to cause this deep sound to resonate more.

So I just recently test drove many SUV's and the worst offender in this issue was the new Nissan Pathfinder. I couldn't even drive a mile without major discomfort to my ears. Go test drive one and see what you think.

I just bought my explorer a couple days ago and did not notice too much in the way of the bass sounds and I was checking this moment I started moving. However I bought a Timberline model which has tweaked suspension for offroad and 18 inch wheels which allows for a decent amount of tire sidewall for cushioning.

My biggest fear with the timberline is the more aggressive tread of the all terrain tires, and so far they have been decent in road noise, but I am prepared to change them if my ears can't manage the sound.

I will admit though that I am starting to notice a little bit of the booming noise, which makes me nervous, but so far it is nothing like the Nissan pathfinder I test drove. I also drove a VW Atlas and Jeep Grand Cherokee L and the Atlas had little booming noise and the Jeep had a little more.

This issue is noticable in many SUV's and cars and I agree to a large extent that it is some characteristic of the car that cannot be completely mitigated, but some variables may be able to help.

I found the Explorer to have a very quiet cabin overall and it could also be that when you get a cabin very isolated from wind and road noise, other sounds appear to be more harsh as they they are no longer being masked or mesh together with other frrequencies, etc.

Again these are just theories of mine, I have no expertise in these areas to back they theories.

I will say that in my opinion the issue described by SteveAZ is not the sound you are describing and is a entirely different problem.
 






D075407, let me see if I can add some insight on your and others situations.

Let me preface by saying I have severe sound sensativity, actually diagnosed with a condition called Hyperacusis (google it), which I have on the extreme end. I also have high frequency hearing loss and 24/7 tinnitus that is permananent. Needless to say, whenever I test a car, my first priority is noise. I actually just posted a thread yesterday about our explorers and whether they do in fact have acoustic glass for mitigating sound.

So the phenomenom you are describing is something that I have noticed for years when test driving cars. My ears will pick up on it quicker than anyone. Some cars/suv's manage it better thans others and yes, tires can be a variable here.

I've come to several theories as to what creates this booming/resonating/deep sound in the cabin. One is that I feel it is more prevalant on unibody cars, than body on frame cars. Body on frame cars would be for example, trucks, jeep wranglers, ford expedition, etc. My theory is that the body on frame essentially isolates the body and in this case, the cabin better.

Secondly tires and their harshness would likely be a component here. Moreover, many of these vehicles and the higher trim level explorers have very large wheels which require low profile tires. These tires have greatly reduced side walls that may exaccerbate this problem.

Lastly, sometimes I think that it is the overall cavernous interior of these cars that may have some particular acoustic characteristic to cause this deep sound to resonate more.

So I just recently test drove many SUV's and the worst offender in this issue was the new Nissan Pathfinder. I couldn't even drive a mile without major discomfort to my ears. Go test drive one and see what you think.

I just bought my explorer a couple days ago and did not notice too much in the way of the bass sounds and I was checking this moment I started moving. However I bought a Timberline model which has tweaked suspension for offroad and 18 inch wheels which allows for a decent amount of tire sidewall for cushioning.

My biggest fear with the timberline is the more aggressive tread of the all terrain tires, and so far they have been decent in road noise, but I am prepared to change them if my ears can't manage the sound.

I will admit though that I am starting to notice a little bit of the booming noise, which makes me nervous, but so far it is nothing like the Nissan pathfinder I test drove. I also drove a VW Atlas and Jeep Grand Cherokee L and the Atlas had little booming noise and the Jeep had a little more.

This issue is noticable in many SUV's and cars and I agree to a large extent that it is some characteristic of the car that cannot be completely mitigated, but some variables may be able to help.

I found the Explorer to have a very quiet cabin overall and it could also be that when you get a cabin very isolated from wind and road noise, other sounds appear to be more harsh as they they are no longer being masked or mesh together with other frrequencies, etc.

Again these are just theories of mine, I have no expertise in these areas to back they theories.

I will say that in my opinion the issue described by SteveAZ is not the sound you are describing and is a entirely different problem.

This is good information aTW, thanks for sharing your perspective.
I have about 500 miles on the Explorer and the booming, low tone rumble is there all the time under 50. It's easy to induce on a smooth road by accelerating to 45 and then coasting to 30. Highway imperfections add an additional tire noise which I believe is the 45 series tires on the 21" wheels. Once the booming rumble is fixed I'm moving to a 18" wheel with the appropriate size, tires perhaps what you have on the Timberline.
On Monday I take it back to the dealer and they will be providing a rental. Interesting comment from my salesperson when she called to schedule my appointment. She drove a new Platinum they just received from the factory with similar issues. That's interesting!
I'll keep this thread up to date as I learn more.
 






This is the most spot-on thread I've seen in the 18 months I've been posting about this issue, and others. Briefly, here's my feedback on the feedback:

Pedro's description is an accurate description of my complaints.

There are actually two sounds in my Platinum. The drum like sound, and something that sounds like a loose sway bar or something heavy.
The second sound is Very noticeable over uneven surfaces at low speeds, 9-15 mph. It is this sound that I initially complained about and over time the drum-like sound replaced my earlier complaints. I've described it as shaking a cardboard box full of rubber balls.

The unibody theory sounds good but my 2016 Platinum didn't experience any of the noises we're talking about here. I think the whole mess is created by the new rear wheel design and the repositioning of the engine. It's a whole new suspension that needs a redesign of the redesign.

And finally, I just test drove a Lincoln Nautilus Reserve. Perhaps, because it supposedly employs white noise, I didn't notice any objectionable road noise other than the usual tire sounds on rough pavement. I can't confirm the white noise, other than to take the salesman's word. Peter would know.
 






This is the most spot-on thread I've seen in the 18 months I've been posting about this issue, and others. Briefly, here's my feedback on the feedback:

Pedro's description is an accurate description of my complaints.

There are actually two sounds in my Platinum. The drum like sound, and something that sounds like a loose sway bar or something heavy.
The second sound is Very noticeable over uneven surfaces at low speeds, 9-15 mph. It is this sound that I initially complained about and over time the drum-like sound replaced my earlier complaints. I've described it as shaking a cardboard box full of rubber balls.

The unibody theory sounds good but my 2016 Platinum didn't experience any of the noises we're talking about here. I think the whole mess is created by the new rear wheel design and the repositioning of the engine. It's a whole new suspension that needs a redesign of the redesign.

And finally, I just test drove a Lincoln Nautilus Reserve. Perhaps, because it supposedly employs white noise, I didn't notice any objectionable road noise other than the usual tire sounds on rough pavement. I can't confirm the white noise, other than to take the salesman's word. Peter would know.
SteveAZ,

Didn't mean to step on your toes, when I mentioned that your problem may not be related. I didn't know you were have the deep drum sounds.
I agree that there are many unibody cars that don't exhibit this sound. And I too, had a 2015 Ford Explorer sport and I don't recall anythig significant.

I do believe as I think you are touching on, that this is something that it inherent to the overall design of the vehicle. It may just be that unibodys are more sensitive to having the correct design and engineering to keep this type of issue at bay. I have often heard deep drumming sounds from a multitude of different unibody vehicles all to different degrees.

My family just rented a Ford Expedition to take on a long road trip and it had absolutlely no hint of any sound from bumps, the best I have ever driven, and the only reasoning I could come up with is it being body on frame.

But at the end of the day, who knows, I'm just throwing out ideas.
 



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Additional information for the 2021 ST model. Not specifically for the 2021 Platinum but may have a bearing on my cabin acoustics issues. I'll share with the dealership on Monday 10/18 when I return the vehicle for this issue.
See the attached document below for additional information on affected vehicles.

I found this on the NHSTA website.
2021 FORD EXPLORER SUV 4WD | NHTSA

Page down until you find this and click on this link

1634474091819.png




1634473941124.png


Text from the attached pdf document below:

SSM 49953 - 2021 Explorer ST/Aviator - Engine Sound Enhancement (ESE)/Active Noise Control (ANC) Inoperative - Built On Or Before 07-Jun-2021
Some 2021 Explorer ST and Aviator vehicles may exhibit a customer concern of undesirable powertrain sounds inside the vehicle and/or less than optimal speaker sound from the vehicle. This may be due to the engine sound enhancement (ESE) on Explorer ST vehicles and the active noise control (ANC) on Aviator vehicles not being activated. To correct the condition, use the Ford Diagnosis and Repair System (FDRS) > select Toolbox > ACM > ACM - Enable Engine Sound Enhancement and Active Noise Control. Click RUN and follow the on-screen instructions carefully. If prompted with a window stating Feature Not Supported, select OK and continue through the installation application. For claiming use causal 18K810 and applicable labor operations found in Section 10 of the Service Labor Time Standards (SLTS) Manual.
APPLICABLE VEHICLES
2020 - 2021 CAR: TV U611N AVIATOR
2020 - 2021 CAR: TV U611N AVIATOR
2021 CAR: TW U625N EXPLORER
 

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