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Flywheel to block spacing - replacement engine trouble!

willfargo

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Replaced engine in my 96 explorer xlt with 4r55e trans with an engine from a 95 ranger.

Moved the flywheel spacer to the new engine, bolted it up and got everything connected... fired up perfect and then immediately heard LOUD chirping coming from bellhousing.

I had previously heard this happening sporadically when parked facing downhill when in park, sometimes in drive it would sound shakier.



Wife is not about to let me tow it to a shop to have a look at it so my research has led me to either think it is a bent flywheel or somehow there is incorrect spacing.



I seated the torque converter all the way in, yet it seemed that when I was bolting the flywheel to the converter the threads were not protruding all the way through the flywheel mounting holes, so now I'm worried that the TC is not all the way seated onto the spline shaft into the trans.



I bought this engine from "QualityUsedEngines.com" because it came with a warranty, but they said it was a direct bolt up after swapping a few components (motor mounts, etc) but no mention of anything to change with the flywheel.

I can't find any specs on flywheel spacing from the block, and I'm wondering if there are shims that can be used to achieve the correct spacing because at this point I wouldn't be surprised if the flexplate was sitting 1/4-1/2" too close to the block.



Going to begin removing the engine again tomorrow :( hate wasting time like this when it's starting to snow!

Anyone have any ideas on where to go from here?
 


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974X4BLACKSPORT

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Before you remove your engine for a second time, check the pinion gear on the starter motor, it may be contacting the flywheel when the engine is running.
 




410Fortune

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for the torque converter you said:

" seated the torque converter all the way in, yet it seemed that when I was bolting the flywheel to the converter the threads were not protruding all the way through the flywheel mounting holes,"

That is a GOOD thing. When the converter is fully seated onto the transmission and you stab the transmission up to the engine, and bolt the converter down the converter should pull forward 3/8"
So the fact that the studs were not all the way through the flexplate is a good thing, It appears you have seated the converter properly.

I have two questions:
Why did you change engines?
Was this chirp present before you changes engines?

Meaning it is the same 4r55e transmission as before?
ok so that's 3 questions

I ask because basically if you bolted your flexplate and spacer onto the new 4.0 engine then you are good to go there. The spacer is a simple device and it did not change size or shape from 1990-1998
In 98 the 4.0 ohv uses a 8 bolt flexplate so there is no way to screw that up

The chirp is either the cam sensor on the back of the engine, a problem with the starter or a problem with your 4r55e / converter
 




willfargo

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Changed engines because the piston seals had gone bad on the original engine, so I installed all new top end seals and gaskets on the new engine and popper her in.
The noise was present on rare occasion when the vehicle was parked facing down a slope and usually only heard when i had shut the engine off and it was spinning down.
Trans was rebuilt maybe 6 years ago
Starter is probably only 3 years old
 




willfargo

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I've watched a handful of videos of cam synchronizers and there's just no way it would make enough noise to be that small part. I'll try and get a video of it today and share that. It's out of the garage so I'll be replacing break pads on the mustang so I'll at least have a safe vehicle to drive for the next few days while the Ex gets torn down again.
I've found the dimensional data on the "Sonnax Billet Crankshaft Spacer" and will measure the oem one to see if it has worn down or if I have a warped flywheel. Flywheel warping would shock me... they are pretty damn heavy duty, but I haven't been around that long I suppose!
 




410Fortune

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The v6 flexplates actually used to break around the center hub.....yikes!

They can be very noisy and when they come apart look out...they can split into two pieces
Look for hairline cracks around the hub, bolt circle
Flywheel = clutch
flexplate = auto just fyi
 




willfargo

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Here is the best video I could get. Doesn't want to stay running today.
I didn't see any cracks on the flexplate when I had it out

 




RandomNerd2000

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Just my opinion but that sounds like a stuck starter.

I'm doubtful of a flexplate issue at this point. I just found out the hard way what happens when one breaks on my old 2000, and I had a knocking a few months ago I attributed to AC compressor clutch because when I shut the AC off, it went away. Lesson learned.
 




410Fortune

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that is a nasty noise
pull starter and bench test it
I agree it sounds like starter flexplate converter noise hopefully starter

the converter did pull forward the 3/8" when final bolted to flexplate correct?
trans stabbed to engine smoothly? You did not have to fight anything
dust shield / scatter shield is in place?
Why wont it stay running?
 




willfargo

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I'll pull the starter tomorrow and bench test it, i'd just be surprised as hell if a starter that new failed... but I guess i'll pray that is the issue because I do NOT want to yank the engine again.
I think I need to adjust the idle screw, just wants to pitter out without getting some gas... either that or theres a huge vacuum leak somewhere.... I did notice some vacuum line that connects to the bottom of the throttle body had a pretty floppy feeling bend in it, but can't find that online anywhere
 




410Fortune

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idle screw don't touch
computer controls idle
look elsewhere, large leaks, bad IAC, the noise you have might be causing load on the engine?
staying tuned
good luck!


When I have to stab engine to trans I always remove the engine mounting plates, while the engine is hanging on hoist stab to trans, bolt everything together and then raise engine and place plates on, drop onto mounts
Makes it much easier to get the correct angles for a smooth stab
any fighting or mis alignment can tear up the front pump or converter........
 




willfargo

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Where is the best place to anchor the hoist chain on the engine? When I pulled and installed the top end had been removed so it was easy but I'm going to attempt to only remove minimal components like valve covers so I don't need to replace gaskets again
 




410Fortune

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I use seatbelts or tow straps and tie them around the exhaust manifolds
They will stretch a great deal so make sure to keep it tight to the intake for your hoist hook
I try to go around the front cyl on one side and rear cyl on the other side with the ohv 6 it works out well, clears wiring, egr plumbing etc
I actually have 2 ohv 4.0 hanging by straps in the shop right now ill go get a pic :)

171_122044_200000000.jpg


171_122044_200000001.jpg


suspend engine and trans this way
can leave the strap with the engine so no need to keep connecting and disco chains
See what I mean by they will stretch? These ratchet straps are worse then seat belts, the hook was originally set on top of the intake
 




willfargo

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Perfect, any tips on getting the 2 hex key bolts from the top of the transmission off? I typically have taken the top end off just to get to those SOB's but don't want to have to replace any more gaskets and do more RTV
 




410Fortune

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yes
drop the trans cross member, let the back of the transmission hang
Use 24-36" extension and wobbly socket, working from back by the tailhousing, with a flashlight or good shop light, you can get ALL OF the bellhousing bolts in about 45 seconds this way with an impact.
Even the top ground strap bolt, the dipstick bolt (if you have an auto), and the wiring harness bolts can all be gotten this way. I used to remove the upper intake and do those top two bolts with a wrench! That was years ago, now my knees hurt just thinking about doing that again. :)

To put them back in I do the same, except I screw them in by hand with ratchet and I use tape or a bit of plastic bag to hold the bolt in the socket as I position them
 




RandomNerd2000

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^This. When I had to pull my 4r70w out my V8 Eddie Bauer, I just got a big bunch of extensions, sockets, and impact driver. In one morning's worth of time (five hours), I had it out, convertor changed out, and it back IN. I could do it again. If you're careful (do not do this), I've seen people if the motor mounts are stiff or it doesn't drop down low enough with just trans weight, take a block of wood and push up on the front of engine by the balancer. Before I did that though, I'd definitely give that starter a HARD look.
 




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..........or theres a huge vacuum leak somewhere.... I did notice some vacuum line that connects to the bottom of the throttle body had a pretty floppy feeling bend in it, but can't find that online anywhere
That's an EVAP hose that runs to a valve under the battery. You can replace it with a length of generic emissions hose or 3/8" fuel line.

Good luck on it being the starter.....
 




974X4BLACKSPORT

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Good video! It definitely sounds like the flexplate is contacting part of the starter when the engine is running. Remove the starter and look for shinny spots or shavings on all parts of the starter housing that protrude into the bell housing area. Look for shinny wear pattern on the flexplate (if possible), specifically the ring gear. With that much noise, the contact area should be quite noticeable.
 




willfargo

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Wasn't the starter unfortunately
Got the engine just about removed... but then the hockey game was starting so that took priority, obviously.
Will get everything removed and inspected tomorrow and report back. Had a neighbor pop his head over and agreed it sounds like the flexplate is contacting that damned plate between the block and bellhousing. When I told him I was debating pulling the engine or transmission... he yelled "NO NO NO NO just take the bolts off the bottom and take the plate off!"
When I explained the plate runs all the way up the back of the damn block, he was very sympathetic.

The EVAP hose...
It has a bend/kink in it but is still airtight, tested with an air compressor. However, I'm not confident it won't collapse under vacuum so I'll grab some generic vac hose and re-run it. Would that hose being kinked cause issues like a vac leak? I was having issues with cold starting prior to the engine swap... needed to give it a little gas for 20 seconds to get it warmed up and ready to rock but now it doesn't want to run without some accelerator help.
 


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410Fortune

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the fuel vapor hose was kinked?

That can cause some issues yes, but usually you will get a code for that after a few drive cycles. The fuel pressure sensor is always testing things and if there is any blockage you will get a P0453 or something like that
However in my experience a long crank is usually weak fuel pressure unless there are engine codes
 




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