Ford 4.6 3 Valve repair question

[Fire488]

My specs are in my profile. I have been going through spark plugs of late due to a miss developing after about 15,000 miles on them. After changing them the problem always goes away. On the last change I notices that the rear cylinder, passenger side was wet and smelled like antifreeze. I looked all around the intake for a pool of leaking antifreeze but it was dry. I cranked the engine with no pugs and the cylinders were dry. My check engine light has been coming on and then would reset after a while then go on again. I can't remember the code generated but it had to do with the catalytic converter failing. I also have that annoying exhaust leak on the passenger side too due to the exhaust manifold leaking. I have also been losing antifreeze lately as well. There are no drips or signs anywhere. I thought it may be a leaking radiator. I decided to hook up my pressure tester and saw that the cap is rated to 20psi. I pumped it up to 15psi and noticed immediately that the pressure was dropping. There was no sign of a leak...The oil is clean with no signs of water contamination. Then to my horror I noticed that there was antifreeze coming from my exhaust! My immediate thought is a head gasket or intake manifold problem. I am not familiar with this modular engine. I am asking if anyone here knows of anything that might get me in the right direction to repair my engine. Is there an inherent problem with these motors? Should i try to find a replacement long block? I am not sure where to go with this... I am an experienced mechanic, but I work in the marine and diesel industry.
Thanks in advance...

 

[Flag Gibby]

The heads were redesigned in 2008 to take care of the manifold problem and it sounds to me like one of the exhaust studs must have pulled out and that is where the antifreeze is coming from. The leaky exhaust manifolds can give a catalytic converter code so it sounds like you need to do the manifold repair that is discussed here in several different posts.

 

[scubastevesx]

Just got my manifold replaced under extended
Warrenty. Note they dont't cover studs
My manifold was cracked not broken studs
Got free loaner from the dealer no hassel
They also replaced my radiator . Now for
The studs seeing there not covered they were
Braking so the had to jack the engine for
Accsess they were replaced per tsb
The studs and engine jacking were 1000.00 probly
Seems high but i got a brand new suberu
Outback to drive for over week for free
So im no complaits

 

[Fire488]

The heads were redesigned in 2008 to take care of the manifold problem and it sounds to me like one of the exhaust studs must have pulled out and that is where the antifreeze is coming from. The leaky exhaust manifolds can give a catalytic converter code so it sounds like you need to do the manifold repair that is discussed here in several different posts.

Thank you so much for the help. I can't tell you how relieved that makes me feel. Although I am still puzzled how the antifreeze got to the passenger side rear plug. All the studs look like they are in place and yet I hear the exhaust leak for about 15 seconds during start up and then it goes away. I did hear that same news about the manifold generating that code as well. Any insight on the manifold repair as parts and best way to get to them? I had the wheels off and it looks very tight. I think i may be able to release the engine mounts and lift the motor to one side then the other.
I hate the thought of pulling the motor, but it may come to that i guess.

 

[Flag Gibby]

You shouldn't have to pull the motor; the fit is tight, but it can be done without damaging anything. As far as parts go, you will have to use OEM parts on this one since there are no aftermarket headers/manifolds for the Explorer 3V 4.6L yet.
Be sure to read Scubastevesx post (#3 ) since he just had extensive manifold repairs done to his Explorer.

 

[scubastevesx]

ya you got a warped or cracked manifold once it warms up the leak closes
mine was also on the pass side you could also have a cracked
intake manifold. also the aa manifold is for the 06-07 the o8 ae casting
may fit but im not sure. look at fordparts.com depending were ya go
they my have to jack the engine like mine to fix the studs although
not broke now they may break coming out. the worst case is pulling
the engine which was priced at 1200.00. it the coolant coming from the
manifold or exhaust pipe

 

[Fire488]

You shouldn't have to pull the motor; the fit is tight, but it can be done without damaging anything. As far as parts go, you will have to use OEM parts on this one since there are no aftermarket headers/manifolds for the Explorer 3V 4.6L yet.
Be sure to read Scubastevesx post (#3 ) since he just had extensive manifold repairs done to his Explorer.

Thank you and will do.

 

[Fire488]

ya you got a warped or cracked manifold once it warms up the leak closes
mine was also on the pass side you could also have a cracked
intake manifold. also the aa manifold is for the 06-07 the o8 ae casting
may fit but im not sure. look at fordparts.com depending were ya go
they my have to jack the engine like mine to fix the studs although
not broke now they may break coming out. the worst case is pulling
the engine which was priced at 1200.00. it the coolant coming from the
manifold or exhaust pipe

I am very familiar with removing seized or galled studs, nuts, and bolts since I work on boats and every job seems to be that way. Especially when using unlike metals.
So the stud holes go into the water jacket on these heads then? I was going to replace them with a higher quality bolt if possible and I guess I will have to permatex the threads.

 

[scubastevesx]

Im with ya on the dis metal thing im
Faa A&p mech worked every type of boeing jet
Out there. The alluninum corrodes alot
On seat tracks main structure you name it
I acutall have the the drills
And tools for the job just i dont have time
Being its our main ride till this oct. good luck
On it ihave heard that water jackets are real
Close if not touching the stud. Good luck
Give us a heads up after you get it figured
Out or if you have questions

 

[Fire488]

Im with ya on the dis metal thing im
Faa A&p mech worked every type of boeing jet
Out there. The alluninum corrodes alot
On seat tracks main structure you name it
I acutall have the the drills
And tools for the job just i dont have time
Being its our main ride till this oct. good luck
On it ihave heard that water jackets are real
Close if not touching the stud. Good luck
Give us a heads up after you get it figured
Out or if you have questions

Sure will man. Thanks.

 

[Fire488]

I am going to purchase 2 manifolds for this engine and attempt this job without removing the engine. I watched a few videos I found out there, but most were on pickups (F150's) and they were older versions than mine. The job looks like it is going to be a challenge for sure.
I am still concerned about the antifreeze coming out the exhaust when I pressurized the system. The engine did start right up without static lock so it is safe to assume that there was no anti freeze in the cylinders. The oil is still clean as well. I do not see any broken studs and there is no sign of anti freeze leaking at the manifold stud area on the outside. Could it still be leaking there on the inside?
I guess I am just hoping that it is not a blown head gasket or intake manifold as it usually is when antifreeze comes out the exhaust pipe. Having some trouble finding the manifolds. I did find a stud upgrade kit on Summit Racing so i will go with those so far. I'm thinking Mr. Gasket or Fel Pro for replacement gaskets.
I need a hug...LOL

Thanks to all for the great advice.

 

[Flag Gibby]

You should be able to get the parts through a local ford dealership over the parts counter or on www.fordparts.com. It looks like the LH is half the cost of the RH which indicates what side is regularly replaced.
My thought is to pull the exhaust manifold on the passenger side and pressurize the system and you should see where the antifreeze is coming from.
Good Luck ...

 

[Fire488]

You should be able to get the parts through a local ford dealership over the parts counter or on www.fordparts.com. It looks like the LH is half the cost of the RH which indicates what side is regularly replaced.
My thought is to pull the exhaust manifold on the passenger side and pressurize the system and you should see where the antifreeze is coming from.
Good Luck ...

Thank you and that is where I will start.Either way the exhaust is leaking so I need a manifold. Do you think i should bother with the drivers side since it is not leaking? Sure is much easier to get to though.

 

[scubastevesx]

To be honest i go buy if not broken dont
Fix it I would stick to that if the drivers side is
Not leaking it less room on the drivers side
If it makes you feel better replacing both and youv
Got the time Go for it manifolds are a pain proir
To mine getting fixed i called around
80 percent of shops said they would not
Touch them

 

[Fire488]

To be honest i go buy if not broken dont
Fix it I would stick to that if the drivers side is
Not leaking it less room on the drivers side
If it makes you feel better replacing both and youv
Got the time Go for it manifolds are a pain proir
To mine getting fixed i called around
80 percent of shops said they would not
Touch them

I noticed that as well and my local Ford dealer gets $2200 to replace the right side only.

 

[Fire488]

Well here is an unhappy update. The Ford dealer i spoke with over the phone explained with a mechanic sitting next to him that it is impossible for anti freeze to be leaking in the exhaust due to a broken manifold stud or warped manifold. He claimed that the antifreeze running out the exhaust pipe indicates another problem altogether possibly a head gasket or intake manifold gasket or a crack.
He recommended that i purchase a new or rebuilt motor as it will be cheaper in the long run. The engine has been meticulously maintained with all fluids and filters being changed as scheduled. I am very disappointed to say the least.

Does his diagnosis sight unseen sound correct?

 

[scubastevesx]

Im really not sure what would be cheeper
But i have priced our head and there in the
1000 range it is a lot of work the hole front
Of the engine has to come off plus intake
When said coming out the exhaust that why i
Want to no if its tail pipe or just leaking around
The manifold. Coming out the pipe would
Lead me to think a cracked or bad head gasket it
Is posible but i think unlikly is the intakes
Cracked and when you presure test it feed
Coolant through the engine i cant guess on
The right way to go but its s tough dession
To make

 

[Fire488]

Very tough motor to find it seems and it looks like a long block is my only option. I will still need to replace that manifold since it is leaking and I'm not sure about the intake manifold. One dealer told me to junk the truck...LOl This truck still looks new. Fully loaded. 139k miles and its ready to be junked? I guess dealers only want the new easy jobs now it seems. I'll keep digging.

 

[Explorer_PL]

I have 157k on mine and I hope for another 50-100 out of it. the manifold tick is very noticeable for the first 20 seconds, but I am not going to fix it until I need to replace the motor. The replacement manifold would be of the same design and would probably last 50k miles before making noise again so what's the point.

I've been lucky with mine - I know that - not sure for how much longer.
I would hate new car payments, and the way I see it, you can get a decent mileage motor for under 1500, plus lets say another 1000 in labor and misc staff. That's about 6-7 monthly payments on a new car, and you are done as opposed to having a loan for next 60 months.
Also, in my case, I've added too much staff (not really big deal but still something); plow setup, brake controller, headrest DVDs for kids, and I know this truck pretty well. And the parts are inexpensive and easy to get.

Check online salvage yards, or eBay. There are plenty of those 4.6.

 

[Flag Gibby]

Fire488, I understand the frustration, but before you get too far into this take an afternoon to just track down where the leak is at and then you can work from there. Right now everything is speculation in terms of what needs to be done until you carefully take off the intake and exhaust manifold and see where the antifreeze is coming from. Once you know where the coolant leak is coming from then the hard decisions can be made.