head gasket blown? i hope not...

[leefhead]

so i had my explorer stored for a couple months outside my aunts house...not really stored, but, sitting outside on top of 6 inches of ice..first time starting it it took about 3 minutes of trying to get it to start, finally it starts. next time i go to use it, it wont start again, after about a minute, it starts. i go to put gas in it, it dies, wont start now for 10 minutes. once in awhile it would just bog down and almost die, then it would catch and start running fine... finally i just sold my sunfire today, so i start driving the explorer again...drives fine, bogs, drives fine, bogs. leaving crappy tire...it bogs, bogs, bogs, then dies. try to start it, bogs a bit, then dies. now it wont start at all, and there is quite a bit of oil around where the spark plugs are. i looked it up, and changing the head gaskets seams to be quite the job....might not be worth it...might be more worth it to scrap the vehicle... whats the possibilities?

 

[shaggymane]

Nothing you've said makes me think a head gaskets blown.

Are you confusing head gaskets with rocker arm cover gaskets/valve covers gaskets which are above the spark plugs. The head gasket is below spark plugs.

If a vehicle has been sitting around the gaskets often dry out and start to leak.
Once again after sitting around for months gas gets gummy. Sits around long enough it turns to varnish. Old gas will do things like stick a needle valve in a carb motor.

Anyway, you're in ontario? Got a can of starting fluid? Pull the air plenum off right before the throttle valve. Give it a 2 second burst into the TV, put air plenum back on quickly and hit start. If the motor fires for 2 seconds you have a fuel delivery problem not elec. And the first thing I'd go after is the fuel filter. 2nd is crack the shrader valve preferably with a fuel pressure tester.

Do you hear the fuel pump running after turning the key on?

 

[boggs1227]

if it sat for months in a icey enviroment ,did it have antifreeze in the radiator...or just a low mixture of antifreeze and water (more on the water side of mixture)...or just plain water.dont know if you just got oil around the plugs if that means the head gaskets have gone out..does it have mixed fluids ?? what grade of oil do you have in it to ?

maybe ( just guessing here) that if you only had water or maybe a low mix of water and anti freeze maybe the water froze and cracked a head internally maybe not the gasket it's self ...and oil flowing on top of the head is seemping into the combustion chamber ( is it all plugs that have oil on them ?)

the oil .....maybe you have a higher grade oil than the temps will alow for .

just thowing some ideas out here .....

edit: also what shaggy said about the fuel filter ...def' check that or replace it ..maybe condensation from a cold wet enviroment could have introduced water into the fuel system...if so thats a no brainer to fix and easy too ! also your engine may have blow-by on the rings and the bad fuel flow to the engine would not burn off the excess oil in the chambers thus the plugs fowling out

 

[leefhead]

Nothing you've said makes me think a head gaskets blown.

Are you confusing head gaskets with rocker arm cover gaskets/valve covers gaskets which are above the spark plugs. The head gasket is below spark plugs.

If a vehicle has been sitting around the gaskets often dry out and start to leak.
Once again after sitting around for months gas gets gummy. Sits around long enough it turns to varnish. Old gas will do things like stick a needle valve in a carb motor.

Anyway, you're in ontario? Got a can of starting fluid? Pull the air plenum off right before the throttle valve. Give it a 2 second burst into the TV, put air plenum back on quickly and hit start. If the motor fires for 2 seconds you have a fuel delivery problem not elec. And the first thing I'd go after is the fuel filter. 2nd is crack the shrader valve preferably with a fuel pressure tester.

Do you hear the fuel pump running after turning the key on?

the vehicle when sitting had almost no gas in it...i then put in 20 bucks, gave me just under a 1/4 tank, that tank sat for about 2 weeks.

yes im in ontario, sudbury ontario to be exact. i dont have any starting fluid, but i can definatly get some. can you link me to an not too expensive one i could get at crappy tire/part source or napa or maslacks or smth. where is the air plenum? i was thinking the fuel filter is the problem too, only thing is, mine wont come off. i can get one side off, but not the other. brought it into a shop once and they couldnt get it off either. i would like to find someone who has a fuel pressure tester so i can test that.

i didnt pay attention to the fuel pump sound...if i can get back to it (its in the crappy tire parking lot right now =/) tomorrow ill take a look and see if i can hear it.

if it sat for months in a icey enviroment ,did it have antifreeze in the radiator...or just a low mixture of antifreeze and water (more on the water side of mixture)...or just plain water.dont know if you just got oil around the plugs if that means the head gaskets have gone out..does it have mixed fluids ?? what grade of oil do you have in it to ?

maybe ( just guessing here) that if you only had water or maybe a low mix of water and anti freeze maybe the water froze and cracked a head internally maybe not the gasket it's self ...and oil flowing on top of the head is seemping into the combustion chamber ( is it all plugs that have oil on them ?)

the oil .....maybe you have a higher grade oil than the temps will alow for .

just thowing some ideas out here .....

edit: also what shaggy said about the fuel filter ...def' check that or replace it ..maybe condensation from a cold wet enviroment could have introduced water into the fuel system...if so thats a no brainer to fix and easy too ! also your engine may have blow-by on the rings and the bad fuel flow to the engine would not burn off the excess oil in the chambers thus the plugs fowling out

it had antifreeze in it, as well some rad stop leak from a previous issue. it has some old (needed to be changed for awhile, but never found the time, my fault) 10w30 high milage GTX oil in it. the plugs (well, one of them anyways...only checked one) seem fine...but theres oil all over the motor on top of the plugs going down to where the plugs are, and the tops of the plugs have oil on them too..



thanks guys...maybe ill get some gas treatment for water in it...

 

[bloxxbmw]

Sounds to me like your alternator and battery are going/gone. The batt was drained from sitting, and your alt isnt strong enough to keep it consistantly at 12v. Keep us posted

 

[leefhead]

the alternator and battery are fine...not only are they brand new, but i was trying to start it for like an hour and a half, now its almost dead. thanks though...

 

[91exploreron37]

If the fuel pump wasnt working then it wouldnt have started at all. I'd try the gas treatment first since it sat for awhile with so little gas it and there's probably plenty of condensation in there as well. Also check the dipstick for coolant and check the radiator for oil if you have'nt done that already.

 

[leefhead]

the coolent and oil hasnt mixed from what i could see yesterday. if i can get out there today, im gonna put some treatment in it and wait awhile and give it another shot...might be buying a 92 accord ex today for 700 bucks, all highway miles (person driving from canada to flordia, then back the whole time they owned the car) needs nothing for cert as well from what i can see.

 

[91exploreron37]

Thats ALOT of highway miles. How many miles is on the car total.

 

[shaggymane]

leefhead wrote:
yes im in ontario, sudbury ontario to be exact. i dont have any starting fluid, but i can definatly get some. can you link me to an not too expensive one i could get at crappy tire/part source or napa or maslacks or smth. where is the air plenum?

A not too expensive one? I'm talking generic starting fliud , ether. Any brand will do. I think it's 2 or 3 bucks a can.

Air flows: Air filter> MAF> plenum> Throttle body> Intake manifold. plenum is just another name for a tube, duct, pipe, whatever, so look for a plastic tube something like 3 in in diameter at the ends. Mine has a plastic insert between the round tubes and says "caution fan". the TV will have two cables running to it. Ones the actual Throttle cable and since yours is an EB I'm betting it has crusie control. So it has two cables.

The idea behind giving it a shot of ether is to help isolate the problem. If a motor will fire on ether, ignition should be good. Testing with ether works most times unless you've flooded the engine and saturated the spark plugs with gas. Pull a Spark plug out. Is it clean and dry? By clean, i mean normal brownish color. If it's black, wet and stinks of gas your motor is flooded.

I see from an above post you've pulled a plug. If it's not wet with gas I'd say it's starving for fuel so we're back to filters and gumed up parts.

There are other ways of testing for spark. Auto parts stores sell a device for doing that safely and aren't expensive. Another is stick a long screwdriver into a plug wire and hold the handle of the scdrvr 1/4 inch off off something metal that's grounded while cranking the engine. But fella, be damn aware of those high energy sparks. They hurt something fierce. If you get snapped you know there's spark. But it's truely not something ya wanna do on purpose (as a way of finding out).

You keep bringing up the oil around the spark plugs. It's an OHV motor. Valve cover gaskets leak. They aren't critical to smooth running motors. They just make a mess. they can leak so bad that when oil is put in a motor that has an oil fill in the valve cover, like a 390 FE, the oil will run to the back and on out to the outside of the engine.
The motor will run fine, just smoke until the oil burns off off whatever it's dripped on.

 

[91exploreron37]

leefhead wrote:
yes im in ontario, sudbury ontario to be exact. i dont have any starting fluid, but i can definatly get some. can you link me to an not too expensive one i could get at crappy tire/part source or napa or maslacks or smth. where is the air plenum?

A not too expensive one? I'm talking generic starting fliud , ether. Any brand will do. I think it's 2 or 3 bucks a can.

Air flows: Air filter> MAF> plenum> Throttle body> Intake manifold. plenum is just another name for a tube, duct, pipe, whatever, so look for a plastic tube something like 3 in in diameter at the ends. Mine has a plastic insert between the round tubes and says "caution fan". the TV will have two cables running to it. Ones the actual Throttle cable and since yours is an EB I'm betting it has crusie control. So it has two cables.

The idea behind giving it a shot of ether is to help isolate the problem. If a motor will fire on ether, ignition should be good. Testing with ether works most times unless you've flooded the engine and saturated the spark plugs with gas. Pull a Spark plug out. Is it clean and dry? By clean, i mean normal brownish color. If it's black, wet and stinks of gas your motor is flooded.

I see from an above post you've pulled a plug. If it's not wet with gas I'd say it's starving for fuel so we're back to filters and gumed up parts.

There are other ways of testing for spark. Auto parts stores sell a device for doing that safely and aren't expensive. Another is stick a long screwdriver into a plug wire and hold the handle of the scdrvr 1/4 inch off off something metal that's grounded while cranking the engine. But fella, be damn aware of those high energy sparks. They hurt something fierce. If you get snapped you know there's spark. But it's truely not something ya wanna do on purpose (as a way of finding out).

You keep bringing up the oil around the spark plugs. It's an OHV motor. Valve cover gaskets leak. They aren't critical to smooth running motors. They just make a mess. they can leak so bad that when oil is put in a motor that has an oil fill in the valve cover, like a 390 FE, the oil will run to the back and on out to the outside of the engine.
The motor will run fine, just smoke until the oil burns off off whatever it's dripped on.

You can use the "quote" button to qoute what somebody else wrote.

 

[leefhead]

turns out it was the fuel pump relay, haha. tested it with the ac relay thanks guys.

 

[shaggymane]

You can use the "quote" button to qoute what somebody else wrote.

You mean like this?

yes im in ontario, sudbury ontario to be exact. i dont have any starting fluid, but i can definatly get some. can you link me to an not too expensive one i could get at crappy tire/part source or napa or maslacks or smth. where is the air plenum?

i didnt pay attention to the fuel pump sound...if i can get back to it (its in the crappy tire parking lot right now =/) tomorrow ill take a look and see if i can hear it.

..

 

[boggs1227]