Help me!! Too much bass? I must be crazy...

[kythri]

Alright audio gurus, I gots a problem.

I traded in my SHO back in September for my Explorer. Seriously missing the bump from the trunk, but not willing to sacrifice cargo space by putting the sub box in the back, I'd been suffering with the stock audio system for the last 9-10 months.

I recently got my Explorer system upgraded.

Stage One was HU, speakers and 4-channel amplifier:

Alpine CDA-7875 from the SHO
Focal Polyglass 165V2 6.5" Components for the front
Focal Access 130CA 5.25" Coaxials for the rear
- Driven by MTX Thunder 564 4-channel amplifier

Drove around in that for about a month, and decided that I did, in fact, miss the bump, and took it back into Car Toys for a custom box, subwoofer and amplifier install.

Stage Two is now complete - just picked up the Explorer today.

It consists of:

Custom box in factory location, built out to the end of the wheel well bump so as not to lose any cargo space.
MTX Thunder 7500 12" Subwoofer (T7512-04)
- Driven by MTX Thunder 801D Mono amplifier

When I picked it up this morning, everything sounded great, but after driving it around today, I've got a couple issues.

1> There's too damned much bass. It's far too loud, and I can't turn it down that much with the deck's subwoofer level control.

2> My SHO had 3 JL 10W6's in the trunk, most likely seriously underpowered by a Kenwood eXcelon X301T 2-channel. The bass response was a nice fast hard punch. The bass in the Explorer right now is rumbly and there's not very much clarity/distinction in the bass, such as there was in the SHO. All the bass in my music seems to blend together into a big ugly rumble.

I spoke with the Car Toys fellows this afternoon, and I've already got an appointment with them for Friday morning for them to finish up the work on the box (vinyl covering, the stuff they had sucked ass, so they're going to make it right, but I couldn't be without the Explorer today). They're going to take a look at it, and possibly turn the gain on the amp down or something. They might very well resolve all my problems, but I wanted to broach the subject here.

I happened along a sweet deal on a couple of JL 12W6's in a box a year or two ago, and they've been collecting dust in my storage unit. I'm curious if one of the 12W6's put into the box instead of the T7512-04 would be a better fit for the bass response I want.

I've checked the specs, and both subs want 1.25' volume in the box, which is what the box has got. The mounting depth on the 12W6 is actually 1.5" - 2" shorter than the T7512-04, so fit in the box isn't going to be an issue either.

The T7512-04 is a 4-ohm single voice coil, whereas the 12W6 is a 6-ohm dual voice coil, but it can be wired in parallel to bring it down to 3-ohm, which I assume is within the operating tolerances of the MTX Thunder 801D it's got specs at 4-ohm and 2-ohm, so I'd assume it'd run at 3-ohm just fine, but I'm not an audio guy, so correct me if I'm wrong).

Another option, if an adapter can be made for my box, is possibly dropping in one of the 10W6's that I still have as well (or pulling the 12" subwoofer box and panel combo, selling that to someone here, and having them build a 10" box...).

The headunit has a highpass and lowpass crossover built-in, and both are set to 120hz, I believe. I played around a bit with the crossover settings on the HU, and didn't seem to make much of a difference. Assuming any significant adjustments are going to have to be done on the amplifier.

Anyhow, any help, suggestions, or opinions on what I've suggested above (swap to the 12W6, etc.) would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!!

 

[icu400]

look at the gain on the amp, i bet its too high

I personally like the sound of JL subs, especially the w6, more than MTX subs. They are extremely clear, as you must know if you had three of them (jealous). Good luck with that project. I can't believe you got a 12 to fit there, thats pretty nice.

 

[kalel33]

I agree with both comments from icu400....you can turn down the amp @ the amp and I like the JLs better.

 

[karl_burns]

When you went from JL to the MTX....

...you definitely went down a notch in quality of bass. Especially from the w6 line. Gain the amp down a bit, see if you can get a JL back there (I've got a 10w6), and then Dynamat things so there's no rattling. I dynamated everything!

Karl

Sorry the pic isn't working correctly. It's the first one of the cargo area listed under my pictures if you're interested.

 

[kythri]

Weird - the photo gallery deal must be broken. It does the same thing there. The thumbnails show just fine, but all larger pictures are redx'd.

 

[imnotted]

does your box stick out of the plastic bezel? I don't see how you could get that much space and fit a 7" deep sub in there without that. Also, are you using one of those plastic boxes or an MDF one?

 

[RocksX]

Kythri, sorry I cannot help your problem much. I had similar problems with my 2 MTX 6000 on my 840 amp. And it helped drasticly by turning down the gain. But now I am wanting my cargo space back and have drawn up a new box based on the stealth box that V8BoatBuilder has only 14" deep which extends past the wheel well 2" instead of his 5.5" deep box, but yours SOUNDS very close to what I may have drawn up for the 12" Kicker Solo-Baric L7 I want. Is there any way you could post some pics of your box??

 

[Savage Wolf]

For problem #1, check the amp gain, HU bass out controls (if any) and at worst have a rca line level control knob put in give a extra amount of bass control

#2 bass response~ 10" sub is going to have faster bass response then a 12" sub anyday, the X has more open air space VS the SHO so the bass will be ALOT bigger in the X vs the SHO also is your box in the X sealed or ported/vented?

Alright audio gurus, I gots a problem.

1> There's too damned much bass. It's far too loud, and I can't turn it down that much with the deck's subwoofer level control.

2> My SHO had 3 JL 10W6's in the trunk, most likely seriously underpowered by a Kenwood eXcelon X301T 2-channel. The bass response was a nice fast hard punch. The bass in the Explorer right now is rumbly and there's not very much clarity/distinction in the bass, such as there was in the SHO. All the bass in my music seems to blend together into a big ugly rumble.
..........

Thanks!!

 

[410Fortune]

I have found over the years with all the systems I have installed, boxes I have built, etc...you gotta give it a few days, if not a full week. You cannot compare one car to the other, one system to the other, in a car they are all going to be slightly different.

Also it takes weeks of driving around, listening to all sorts of different music types and recording qualities (espeically today with MP3's) and lots and lots of adjusting the cut off frequencies, gain levels, etc etc until you find a happy medium. Throwing $$$ at it, switching woofers, is not the best approach! As long as you matched the sub to the amp, and the enclosure to the sub, even a cheapo sub can sound GREAT!

Give it a few days, you can play with the gain yourself if you can get access to it. I never set up a system with the gain past optimum (half) if I can help it, you should never have to if the sub and amp were matched properly. with the gain on half for the sub, you can then adjust the gain for the mids and highs to get a level you feel is the right balance. then the adjustments on the head unit can be used to fine tune for different song, music styles, and recording qualities (again mostly with MP3's)

Also give the sub time to break in, a new sub sounds like crap.

WHile I agree for the most part JL audio is a superior sub to the MTX I have also been quite impressed with MTX in the last few years, you get ALOT of bang for your buck with the newer MTX line, ESPECIALLY the amps....

 

[davesexplorer]

for the overwhelming bass check as was said the HU sub controls, the gain on the amp, and IF the amp has it, try touching down the bass boost.

Maybe the mtx sub requires different airspace than what it was given, that would be a factor in off sound or muddy bass, go ahead and try the 12" W6, you'll get more wattage out of that amp anyhow, and if theres the possibility that the box is within specs for the sub, I dont see a reason why you dont swap?

at any rate, enjoy the bass!

 

[kythri]

Alrighty folks - some good news, and other stuffs.

First off, took the Explorer back into the stereo store today for them to vinyl-cover the box, and for them to adjust the bass level.

They significantly turned down the bass, adjusted some other stuff, and it sounds LOADS better.

I'm still missing the sound that I had in my SHO, but we'll get by just fine for now. I might be taking it back in soon for a little more minor adjustment, but other than that, things are a lot better than they were.

Who knows - I might eventually switch down to a 10" sub in there, and have them shrink the box a bit (and sell this box/panel here or on eBay.

With that said, here's the pics of the enclosure/sub:

The box is MDF, fiberglass contouring, and vinyl wrapped. Volume is 1.25'.

 

[Fish Man]

looks pretty sweet, glad to hear you got it sounding more like you wanted. thats not your SHO next to it is it? oops, never mind saw you said you traded it in on the x...

 

[imnotted]

that's pimptastic! unfortunately, the crime rate is way too high here in san antonio, so I can't do anything like that and feel safe. I'll stick with keepin it behind the plastic. glad to hear everything sounds ok!

 

[davesexplorer]

Thats a nice and clean install, and you still have loads of room in the back!

 

[kythri]

We'll see how crime here in Albany, OR and Salem, OR is.

Everything is hella insured, but I'll still be pissed off if it gets jacked.

Anyhow, I'll drive around with this for a couple months, before I decide whether or not to sell the box/sub off, and put in a 10" stealthbox.

Thanks for the compliments, though!

The maintained cargo area was my goal throughout the entire process - Gotta have that space! =)

 

[RocksX]

That looks sweet man, exactly what I drew up on paper only couple inches smaller, I was going with 1.5cuft. Done some checkin around and I think I am going to go with the JL W7 instead of Kickers W7 though. Sweet box though man. Where is the amp, is it on the driver's side behind the plastic?

 

[kythri]

Well, the two amps are stacked behind the box on the passenger side, making for not-very-easy adjustment.

I haven't watched the procedure, but I assume that the entire panel has to be pulled to adjust the amps.

The XM tuner is mounted behind the head unit. It's amazing how much space there is back there.

 

[410Fortune]

Hmmm looks like you lost the cargo cover?
They ALMOST got the color right! hahaha

Just kidding it looks great...

 

[Indifference126]

W6>mtx 7000 series...

just an observation =)