Limited Slip or Transfer Case issues?

[drhill]

Hi Everyone,

my wife's car is a 2003 Lincoln Aviator full time AWD (I think very similar to Explorer and Mountaineer AWD). I can't figure out how to get rid of a few problems.

1. When making tight turns, the inside rear tire binds up and slips again and again like the limited slip unit is too tight or like there's no additive in it.

2. When I back out of a driveway or parking spot and have to turn while backing, there is a collection of noises (creaks, pops, snaps) that sound like they are coming from the front end

So far, I changed the front axle as the CV joint was blown out, that reduced some of the front end noises and some of the binding. I also changed the Limited Slip oil and put in a bottle of additive...no perceptible difference?

Anyone have any ideas? I'm stumped. When we first got it 6 months ago, I had a shop change the x-fer case oil and they said it was very dark coming out - could the viscous coupling be burined up and locking?

Thanks for any help!

 

[manaen]

have you checked the fluid again in your TC, the limited slip rear does not bind that tight that the wheel would slip or hop. I think your efforts are better focused on the TC. I would smell the TC fluid to see if it is burnt again

 

[jrford]

Whats the Axle code on the Door? Or do you have a ClassIII or ClassII hitch.
Question is if its limited slip? If limited slip that could do it too.
I'm leaning on the xfr case being AWD viscous clutch, classic symptom of it going out, binding it figure 8s.
Wheel bearings are real common, maybe thats in the mix too.

When i changed my xfr fluid at 30k, yes 30k it was black too. . . in fact f/r diffs where black too. 30k later no problems, but i refilled with Mobile 1.

 

[drhill]

I was suspecting the transfer case too but I wasn't sure the symptoms of it going out...if that is the case, I image driving with it like this could be causing damage to rest of my driveline? I.E. maybe why my front axle CV joint was blown out...?

I'll double check the codes but I thought all Aviators had rear Limited Slip...as per my research anyway.

At 69k trans fluid was very dark (no surprises - filled for life - HA!), TC was dark and when I just did the rear diff last night at 78k...eh, just ok. I'll do the front diff at the next opportunity and I'll get under there and look at the x-fer case oil again. I think I have a lead on a good used TC at a local j-yard (17k miles) to swap.

Is there any way to test the transfer case to know for sure if that is the problem?

Thanks for all the help so far guys!!

 

[jrford]

as far as i know, binding in turns is it (found this on the jeep boards and their AWD), i would think it would also be the front wheels too??? Maybe someone has a better test in the 2nd gen section? For the most part AWD is the similar 2nd/3rd gens.

If that door code is a '45' its an open diff no clutch packs, a code of 'd4' is limited slip. there is a chance it could be those clutches (diff) if the rear is only binding. Also a common problem for the LSD's too.

Sorry i cant be of more help, but if you find a definitive way of diagnosing it let me know, i have AWD at 63k miles (but i have open 3.55's code '45'. I wonder if putting it on a hoist would tell you something, but i doubt it.

 

[IZwack]

90% sure its the transfer case - a Limited Slip differential does not have enough "grip" to pop and bang around turns.

If the vehicle is indeed AWD, then the viscous clutch inside the transfer case is dead and needs to be replaced. A few threads worth skimming over:

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=250986&highlight=viscous
http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=225515&highlight=viscous

 

[robby001]

I used to have the same problem with my 03 eddie with the all wheel drive. Ended up changing all fluids to synthetic and everything went away runs great now.

 

[drhill]

90% sure its the transfer case - a Limited Slip differential does not have enough "grip" to pop and bang around turns.

If the vehicle is indeed AWD, then the viscous clutch inside the transfer case is dead and needs to be replaced. A few threads worth skimming over:

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/...hlight=viscous
http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/...hlight=viscous

Wow - those links helped me a ton...that and all the other replies...my money is on viscous coupling seized as I do have the Borg Warner AWD system (no electrics). I was told by someone early on that viscous couplings typically fail open, that they slip all the time and never lock up both front and rear axles but he was no expert.

I'm sure this T/C took out my front axle...I'm getting a new one before I lose any more driveline or suspension parts!!

 

[IZwack]

I'm sure this T/C took out my front axle...I'm getting a new one before I lose any more driveline or suspension parts!!

Dont ask a shop to evaluate that for you because they will probably say yes, the front axle is gone now pay us so we can fix it. If you get the front tires up in the air, disconnect the front driveshaft from the axle, rotate the tires and if there is no crunching of any type coming from the front axle, then it is probably fine (just be aware that there will probably be some drag coming from the brakes).

 

[IZwack]

Oh and just an FYI, those links I posted I think refer to the Borg-Warner AWD transfer case. Your transfer case is the 4410, which still operates exactly like the 4404.

 

[drhill]

I just noticed the Part # difference...looks like mine is exactly the same as the 02-05 explorer/mountaineer unit...

Dont ask a shop to evaluate that for you because they will probably say yes, the front axle is gone now pay us so we can fix it. If you get the front tires up in the air, disconnect the front driveshaft from the axle, rotate the tires and if there is no crunching of any type coming from the front axle, then it is probably fine (just be aware that there will probably be some drag coming from the brakes).

oops - I meant to say Driveshaft not Axle! I did check the front axle when I replaced the driveshaft(CV joint was blown) and it sounded fine when I spun the tires...

I'll post up results once I get the t-case fixed...

 

[drhill]

It was the transfer case - replaced with new and no noises or stumbling...it was a locked up viscous coupling

 

[mountaineer02]

It was the transfer case - replaced with new and no noises or stumbling...it was a locked up viscous coupling

If you dont mind, what was the price and where did you get the new TC? Please let me know, I have the same problem.

 

[mountaineer02]

Oh and just an FYI, those links I posted I think refer to the Borg-Warner AWD transfer case. Your transfer case is the 4410, which still operates exactly like the 4404.

They might work the same, but trying to find parts for the 4410 seems to be very difficult. Almost thinkin of swicthing TC types and installing a switch?

 

[drhill]

It wasn't easy to find the 4410...I tried to go the cheap route and get one used from a junkyard - just wasted two weeks of my time as two yards couldn't bother to send me the right unit. I finally broke down and had my local tranny shop order me a reman'd unit as they couldn't find a new one...I think it cost me $995...

PM me if you still want the name of the shop...they are just a local shop near me in California

 

[jrford]

found this site http://4x4transfercases.com/
don't know anything about it. . .looks promising.
Check Ford Parts they do sell remains. . . .about $1k or so.

If you change to a BW4411 you might be missing some stuff, 4x4 module, harness, relays. . .and the PCM might have to be reprogrammed. By the time you finished it might be just as much as a ReMan.

I'd vote for find a local Trans and Gear shop and see how much and what kinda of Warranty they offer. I know a great guy in Royal Oak, Michigan. . .might be a tad too far.

 

[mountaineer02]

Yah, I was thinkin junkyard for that stuff. cause if this is going to be a continuous prob, I really dont want to keep investing. Plus it would kind of be nice to decide if and when i want all 4 on, and not just 35/65? Im going to drop the front shaft just to make sure of where im at first, besides i looked today and my sway bar link was braoken.

 

[mountaineer02]

90% sure its the transfer case - a Limited Slip differential does not have enough "grip" to pop and bang around turns.

If the vehicle is indeed AWD, then the viscous clutch inside the transfer case is dead and needs to be replaced. A few threads worth skimming over:

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=250986&highlight=viscous
http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=225515&highlight=viscous

great threads!!!Thank you. still alil confused. if its the viscous coupling, then why doesnt it do it all the time instead of turns? Usually its a diff matter when it turns?

 

[jrford]

great threads!!!Thank you. still alil confused. if its the viscous coupling, then why doesnt it do it all the time instead of turns? Usually its a diff matter when it turns?

it doesn't do it all the time because its only need in turns or slipping wheels.

In a turn the front and rear axles have to spin at different rates in turns and something has to give which is a center differential (similar in function but different in design then the front and rear Axle) this makes the transfer case open, the viscous allows it slip or lockup.

found this might explain it better,
http://auto.howstuffworks.com/differential.htm

 

[mountaineer02]

Ok, I dont want to swipe a thread, but drhill got his fixed and im still trying to figure it out it relates. I dropped my front driveshaft and i still continue to get this problem after i run it for awhile and it warms up. Is it possible its the rear diff packs then?