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Questions about sythentics

oso2324

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Maryland
Year, Model & Trim Level
'99 Sport
Good afternoon all. I have a 99 Sport approaching 110K miles and she's due for service. I've done a lot reading about the preference of using syntheitcs over dino for the differentials and the transfer case. Many of the posts have indicated that sythentics increase MPG. I'm not an engineer but I do love learning about this kind of stuff so can someone please explain how sythentics increase overall MPG. Thanks, Mike
 



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they have a better slipperyness to them..... they are more pure and "slicker" than a dino oil... less friction between parts = less power needed to turn those parts meaning less fuel consumption to get to the same speed.....

do a search for aldive and his quest for 30 mpg.....
 






They will help your fuel mileage. But don't expect miracles. I changed all the fluids in my Mustang to synthetic, and picked up a whopping 1/10th of a second at the track.
 






Good question. I'm sure the Ford manual says use Synthetic. I've had two different opinions from the same Ring and Pinion shop. One said use dino oil and the additive for limited slip - the other tech said stay with synthetic if thats what it had before. Huh. And, yes, they sold a synthetic for $8 a qt vs about $20 at the dealer.
As far as friction - two factors involved. Hypoid gearing is partial sliding contact where both extreme pressure additives and viscosity affect friction loading. To minimize friction low viscosity and good extreme pressure additives are important.
So guess what? The Synthetic they sold me for my 97X 8.8 inch says on the coantainer it has it all, except the 75W-140 will probably use more fuel than the Ford stuff. But I'm trying to quiet down a slight gear whine so willing to use more fuel, for now.
 






Eneurb said:
I changed all the fluids in my Mustang to synthetic, and picked up a whopping 1/10th of a second at the track.
at the track, .1 of a second is enough to win a victory or lose a race....
 






Synthetic lubricants are fuel efficient, extended life lubricants manufactured from select basestocks and special purpose additives. In contrast to petroleum oils which are pumped from the earth and refined, synthetics are custom-designed in the laboratory, with each phase of their molecular construction programmed to produce, in effect, the ideal lubricant.

Many people with questions about synthetics haven't known where to turn to get correct information. Is it super oil or snake oil? Some enthusiasts will swear that synthetics are capable of raising your specialty car from the dead. On the other hand, the next fellow asserts that synthetics will send your beloved car to an early grave. Where's the truth in all this?

In an effort to set the record straight, we've assembled ten of the more persistent myths about synthetic motor oils to see how they stack up against the facts.

Myth #1: Synthetic motor oils damage seals.

Untrue. It would be foolhardy for lubricant manufacturers to build a product that is incompatible with seals. The composition of seals presents problems that both petroleum oils and synthetics must overcome. Made from elastomers, seals are inherently difficult to standardize.

Ultimately it is the additive mix in the oil that counts. Additives to control seal swell, shrinkage and hardening are required, whether it be a synthetic or petroleum product that is being produced.

Myth #2: Synthetics are too thin to stay in the engine.

Untrue. In order for a lubricant to be classified in any SAE grade (10W-30, 10W-40, etc) it has to meet certain guidelines with regard to viscosity ("thickness").

For example, it makes no difference whether it is 10W-40 petroleum or 10W-40 synthetic, at -25 degrees centigrade (-13F) and 100 degrees centigrade (212 degrees F) that oil has to maintain a standardized viscosity or it can't be rated a 10W-40.

Myth #3: Synthetics cause cars to use more oil.

Untrue. Synthetic motor oils are intended to use in mechanically sound engines, that is, engines that don't leak. In such engines oil consumption will actually be reduced. First, because of the lower volatility of synlubes. Second, because of the better sealing characteristics between piston rings and cylinder walls. And finally, because of the superior oxidation stability (i.e. resistance of synthetics against reacting with oxygen at high temperatures.)

Myth #4: Synthetic lubricants are not compatible with petroleum.

Untrue. The synthesized hydrocarbons, polyalphaolefins, diesters and other materials that form the base stocks of high quality name brand synthetics are fully compatible with petroleum oils. In the old days, some companies used untested ingredients that were not compatible, causing quality synlubes to suffer a bum rap. Fortunately, those days are long gone.

Compatibility is something to keep in mind, however, whether using petroleum oils or synthetics. It is usually best to use the same oil for topping off that you have been running in the engine. That is, it is preferable to not mix your oils, even if it is Valvoline or Quaker State you are using. The reason is this: the functions of additives blended for specific characteristics can be offset when oils with different additive packages are put together. For optimal performance, it is better to use the same oil throughout.

Myth#5: Synthetic lubricants are not readily available.

Untrue. This may have been the case two decades ago when AMSOIL and Mobil1 were the only real choices, but today nearly every major oil company has added a synthetic product to their lines. This in itself is a testament to the value synthetics offer. But, beware, many of the other "syntheitcs" are not true PAO (Polyalphaolefin) syntheitcs (ie: Castrol Syntec, Penzoil, etc...) they are hydroisomerized petroleum oil or an ester based synthetic blend.

Myth #6: Synthetic lubricants produce sludge.

Untrue. In point of fact, synthetic motor oils are more sludge resistant than their petroleum counterparts, resisting the effects of high temperatures and oxidation. In the presence of high temperatures, two things happen. First, an oil's lighter ingredients boil off, making the oil thicker. Second, many of the complex chemicals found naturally in petroleum basestocks begin to react with each other, forming sludges, gums and varnishes. One result is a loss of fluidity at low temperatures, slowing the timely flow of oil to the engine for vital engine protection. Further negative effects of thickened oil include the restriction of oil flow to critical areas, greater wear and loss of fuel economy.

Because of their higher flash points, and their ability to withstand evaporation loss and oxidation, synthetics are much more resistant to sludge development.

Two other causes of sludge - ingested dirt and water dilution - can be a problem in any kind of oil, whether petroleum or synthetic. These are problems with the air filtration system and the cooling system resoectively, not the oil.

Myth #7: Synthetics can't be used with catalytic converters or oxygen sensors.

Untrue. There is no difference between synthetic and petroleum oils in regards to these components. Both synthetic and petroleum oils are similar compounds and neither si damaging to catalytic converters or oxygen sensors.

Myth #8: Synthetics void warranties.

Untrue. No major manufacturer of automobiles specifically bans the use of synthetic lubricants. In point of fact, increasing numbers of high performance cars are arriving on the showroom floors with synthetic motor oils as factory fill.

New vehicle warranties are based upon the use of oils meeting specific API Service Classifications (for example SG/CE). Synthetic lubricants which meet current API Service requirements are perfectly suited for use in any vehicle without affecting the validity of the new car warranty.

Myth #9: Synthetics last forever.

Untrue. Although some experts feel that synthetic basestocks themselves can be used forever, it is well known that eventually the additives will falter and cause the oil to require changing. Moisture, fuel dilution and acids (the by-products of combustion) tend to use up additives in an oil, allowing degradation to occur.

However , by "topping off", additives can be replenished. Through good filtration and periodic oil analysis, synthetic motor oils protect an engine for lengths of time far beyond the capability of non-synthetics.

Myth #10: Synthetics are too expensive.

Untrue. Tests and experience have proven that synthetics can greatly extend drain intervals, provide better fuel economy, reduce engine wear and enable vehicles to operate with greater reliability. All these elements combine to make synthetic engine oils more economical that conventional non-synthetics.

In Europe, synthetics have enjoyed increasing acceptance as car buyers look first to performance and long term value rather than initial price. As more sophisticated technology places greater demands on today's motor oils, we will no doubt see an increasing re-evaluation of oil buying habits in this country as well.

CONCLUSIONS

Since their inception, manufacturers of synthetic motor oils have sought to educate the public about the facts regarding synthetics, and the need for consumers to make their lubrication purchasing decisions based on quality rather than price. As was the case with microwave ovens or electric lights, a highly technological improvement must often overcome a fair amount of public skepticism and consumer inertia before it is embraced by the general population.

But the word is getting out as a growing number of motorists worldwide experience the benefits of synthetic lubrication. The wave of the future, in auto lubes, is well under way
 






an unbiased testimonial if ever there was one <g>... kidding. I think synthetics are wonderful things, but don't slavishly adhere to their use....... but... no doubt about it, they are the best lubricants out there for extended use.
 






FL Oil Guy

Good information.

I already planned to go fully synthetic on all oils in my explorermobile. Got 51k on it, shouldn't be to late for good protection.
 






I have used full synthetic in my 2001 Sport OHC since I bought it with 21k miles on it two years ago, I now have 86K. Yes it is a bit more off the shelf but I dont change the oil till around 5k miles. The oil seems to have the same wear as a dino does at 2-3K miles.
 






Same wear..wow, I thought you could get like 10k miles or more between full oil change with new filter and oil topped off ever 3k miles or so.
 






Simple question with a complicated answer. First, what is synthetic? Legally, in the U.S. you can call just about any oil a synthetic. Chemists will tell you synthetic oils are olefins or esters compounds derived from simpler compounds.

There are 5 groups of oils. Groups I, II, and III are processed from crude oil. Groups IV and V are synthesized from other compounds. Group V oils do have more lubricity (slippery) than Groups I-IV. But very few oils are Group V. Mobil 1 is a Group IV. Amzoil can be either group III or IV. Most other synthetics are (Castrol, Pennzoil, Valvoline, Havoline, etc) are primarily group III.

Why does synthetic improve fuel mileage? Group III, IV, and V are thinner at cold temperatures than groups I or II. Less viscosity = higher fuel mileage. At 212 F, groups I-IV will have basically the same viscosity and same lubricity, and therefore the same fuel mileage. But in applications that don't get that hot, such as transmissions and rear ends or engines before the oil heats up, the lower viscosity will help improve fuel mileage.
 






85Dave, thank you for the informative and erudite answer. That's the kind of info I was hoping for. Next question - are there any CAT V lubes commercially available to the regular consumer for automotive use? Mike
 






Redline makes some group V oils. Some of the others use a small amount of group V in their group III/IV synthetic formulas. One problem I did not mention about groups I-IV is the tendancy to thicken with extended drains. Esters don't do this. But esters are the most expensive of all the 5 groups.
 






Other than the engine oil, all of the basic fluids in 2nd gen Explorers have synthetic fluids in them, stock.(Trans, front diff, rear diff). The other things like steering, etc. won't save any gas, or make more power. LOL,
Don
 






CDW6212R said:
Other than the engine oil, all of the basic fluids in 2nd gen Explorers have synthetic fluids in them, stock.(Trans, front diff, rear diff). The other things like steering, etc. won't save any gas, or make more power. LOL,
Don

The Merc V in the trannys is SEMIsynthetic from the factory.
 






I thought that Mercon V is synthetic? I noted that years ago it was a lot more expensive.
I just bought Castrol Mercon III I believe, and an additive, for my 99 5R55E. The additive is supposed to achieve better wear characteristics than the Mercon V.

Okay then, what trans fluid are you using Al? Do you know that it helped the gas mileage? My 93/99 Explorer is a three hour a day, 28 mile trip vehicle. Low speed, a lot of idling, and acceleration is devouring fuel. I have gotten a relatively constant ten mpg with the 93 OHV V6. I do hope for better mpg with the 99 SOHC engine.
Don
 






CDW6212R said:
I thought that Mercon V is synthetic?

Okay then, what trans fluid are you using Al? Do you know that it helped the gas mileage?

Mercron V is a specification not a particular ATF. By definition Merc V is semisynthetic.

I use Amsoil ATF ( Dead Link Removed ). Prior to using Amsoil, I used Mobil 1 ATF and yes, these fluids definitely helped MPG ( 1-2 MPG boost ).
 






Thanks Al, I have known about Amsoil for many years, but never had a vehicle worthy of their products. Things have changed. I'll start my 5R55E with the fluid I have. If it has no issues, I'll change the fluid again in the near future. :thumbsup:
Don
 






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