Replaced clutch, bled system. No shift | Ford Explorer Forums - Serious Explorations

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Replaced clutch, bled system. No shift

thebigrooster

Member
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September 5, 2010
Messages
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City, State
Defiance, Ohio
Year, Model & Trim Level
1994 Explorer Sport
I recently replaced my clutch, pressure plate, and slave.

I got it somewhat bled, although it was softer then it was before I did the clutch. I could still shift, but it was still a little difficult at times. I assumed it was because the system wasn't bled yet and drove it, planning to bleed it later on. All at once it stopped shifting at all. Won't go into any gear.

The entire time I was driving it, it made a clunk noise. If I went into reverse, the first second it went under load it would clunk. Then going back into 1st it would clunk. And if i stayed in gear and made the truck bounce while in gear it would clunk back and forth. I'm not sure if I messed something up while replacing the clutch, but I know that's not normal.

Today I replaced the master cylinder because I snapped the pushrod attempting to bleed it more. Got a new Perfection master and bled according to their decent how to vid:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgNTDGwcjZc

Pedal doesn't feel a whole lot better then before, although I'm sure its enough that it should at least grind or go into gear with some work, and I can't get it into any gear at all.

Does anyone have any ideas? I need and miss my Explorer. Thanks in advance for any help or advice guys.
 



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what brand slave cylinder and other clutch hardware did you buy? You need to make sure you have a good bleed on the system. If your positive you have all the air from your lines, then maybe your slave cylinder is faulty or your pressure plate is faulty.

With the truck off, put the truck into gear. have a friend push on the truck and while your friend is attempting to push it, depress the clutch pedal, see if you get any release from the clutch. That will at least let you know if your slave cylinder/clutch system is working at all.
 






I bought the clutch kit and the slave on ebay. The slave was supposed to be luk brand and it came in a luk box with newspaper for packaging. Although it had luk instructions in a sealed bag. The clutch kit was supposed to be acdelco however it came in an acdelco box and it was sachs brand. Annoying as hell. Anyway, the system is not bleed all the way however when I first put it all back together itwasnt bled allthe way but it would shift, just a little rough. I literally cannot shift at all now, its like nothings there. I do havea decent pedal though.
 






I will check that tonight/tomorrow. Does anyone have any other thoughts on this? I think the clunk I had while driving could have something to do with this, maybe I put something back together wrong? I just don't know where to start or what to look for.
 












Did you try Boodaggy's idea? That'll tell you, like he said, whether or not your clutch is releasing.

When I originally installed my new clutch/master/slave, the slave I bought turned out to be the wrong one, and I had to pull everything out and start over again. My deal was that it wouldn't shift at all; the hydraulic line from the master to the slave wasn't sitting in the the quick disconnect fitting right and was letting air back into the system.

I know it's a silly question, but did you double check your fluid levels? You did fill the trans, the clutch fluid didn't all drain out/through the system?

Biggest thing I can tell you right off the bat from what you've written here is to start off bleeding the system all the way. The best way I found to do it was to have someone sit in the driver's seat, and me underneath the rig. To start the deal, the "driver" primes the line by depressing the clutch a 2-3 times slowly, then holds it down. I'd then open the bleeder valve, let the fluid drain a brief moment, and then close off the valve again. This turned out to be a 15-20 min ordeal to get it bled (once I had the right slave in).

As far as the clunk, I have no idea. Maybe the driveshaft? Might be something internal in the trans?

Give us some more feed back and hopefully we can help you some more.
 






I'm pretty sure that its the correct slave cylinder. I drove the truck for about a week and then it just kinda locked me out. Couldnt get it into any gear without shutting it off and restarting it. So since that time I've bled one big bottle through the system, clutch pedal still doesn't feel great. However I was shifting with about the same pedal, or less, for the first week with the truck. I'm still 'locked out' at this point.
 






Sounds like the slave is toast. Unfortunately aftermarket slaves are known to have issues for some reason. That's why a Ford unit is recommended. Do that test & then you'll know. Not much we can tell you unless you open it up or test the ability to get in/out of gear.
 






I can barely get it in and out of gear now when the truck is off. I cant move it when the clutch is pushed in and the truck is in gear. However I checked the trans and can watch the slave push the pp in about 1/4-1/2 inch (rough guess) I don't have the greatest feeling in the clutch pedal though. No leaks. I know I"ve read a dozen times or more that ford is the way to go however this unit should be a luk brand slave. It was wrapped in newspaper in a luk box but also had the snap ring and o ring in a sealed bag with luk printed on it. I guess my big question at this point is, how can a slave be bad when it doesnt leak? If you push in the master cylinder the fluid has to go somewhere. If it is not leaking, how can the slave not do what it is supposed to do?
 






Your PP should depress over an inch, probably an inch and half if I remember correctly. There is definite movement. I know I saw that as a problem with slave numero uno, and saw a big difference with my second slave.

Try "priming" the master cylinder again. As I said before, the brake bleeding method with 2 people worked better for me than the youtube deal you've linked (and I've tried). To prime the master, pull the quick disconnect (QD) off the trans, and depress the center of the QD with something like a small screwdriver, have your partner press the clutch, release the center of the QD, let the partner release the clutch. A VERY messy job, but holy cow a lot of air bubbles left. Reconnect it after a couple presses, making sure the reservoir doesn't go empty, otherwise you're back to bleeding, and then re-bleed the slave. If that doesn't work, then your slave is shot. Sorry to say, but that's my opinion. WARNING ON THIS TIP: DO NOT HAVE YOUR PARTNER PRESS THE PEDAL BEFORE YOU PRESS THE CENTER OF THE QD IN!!! IT WILL EXPLODE ON YOU, AND YOU WILL HAVE TO BUY A NEW ONE. HARD TO COME BY!! (Don't forget your eye protection and gloves)

And with your truck off, and having problems shifting into gear there, that makes me believe that your trans is shot. It's not a fun idea, but if it were me, I'd pull the trans back out and give it a shake and listen for anything that may be loose. At least drain it again and look for metal chunks in your fluid if you're not gonna pull it. The M5OD has a magnet at the end of the plug, so, anything small and metal will be there, and potentially larger stuff; run your fingers through the drain pan too looking for metal. Hope it's not this one.
 






I'm pretty sure the trans is good. It shifted decent before I changed clutches and it was rebuilt about 50k ago. I "bench bled" the mc and a lot of bubbles came out. I didn't put it in until I saw no bubbles coming out. It should've been pretty close to bled. Although I know this system sucks as far as bleeding goes, so I will try what you mentioned. I just dont understand how the slave could be bad if it isn't leaking. The fluid that is displaced by the master cylinder has to go somewhere. BTW the reason I had to replace the master cylinder was because I had my partner press the clutch in without me pushing in the QD. lol I found that out the hard way. But I know that's good now.
 






I bled the system with the QD today and then gravity bled it about 1 reservoir. Still not the greatest feeling in the clutch pedal and it barely will begin to grind in reverse, will not go into any gear while running, although after it rolled back about an inch it fell into gear while off. I'm pretty sure the transmission is at least ok. I think the slave is bad, but it should've been a Luk slave. Has anyone used a Luk slave with good luck before?
 






Did you replace your pilot bearing? Even if you did or didnt, it could be seizing up or creating enough drag on your transmission to keep it spinning, making it nearly imposible to get into gear. I have never seen it happen, but i was thinking at work today and if your transmission is in good working order, and your slave cylinder, clutch, and pressure plate are working correctly, the only thing left is the pilot bearing.

you have that little access hole in the bottom of your transmission. I dont think it to be to smart but you could have a friend start your truck with it in nuetral, and you look to see if your clutch and pressure plate still spin while the truck is running, with the clutch pedal pressed to the floor. Just make sure you take safety precautions, wheel chocks, even put it up on jackstands so that the tires if spinning, will not go anywhere. Make sure your friend doesnt have any grudges against you either (little sister flings, stole his g/f etc...).
 






I replaced the pilot bearing. I did look at the slave cylinder under the truck and it does move, about a 1/2 inch I'd say. Don't have the best feel in the clutch though. I also tried to start it in gear w/ clutch in today. It was moving forward at first crank. Clutch can't be releasing much at all, if any. I'm pretty sure it was a Luk slave cylinder, like I said. Apparently they're not worth much either? I wonder if it would help me to d/c the quick disconnect and try my old slave, bleed it out and see if I got more movement from that. Dunno if it'd be worth my time or not.
 






I was thinking about the whole problem with the Explorer. If I drove the truck into my driveway after driving it ok for a week, and it doesn't leak fluid, how could the slave cylinder be bad? If the fluid isn't leaking, the fluid displaced by the Master cylinder has to go into the slave and expand it, unless there is air. Am I wrong in thinking that?
 






Did you lube the splines of the input shaft to the transmission? Are you 100% sure the clutch was lined up correctly? Sure it was running and driving, but what it all seems to come down to is that your clutch isn't disengaging from the flywheel.

You still have power being transferred to the transmission, even with your clutch in. You need to run through the basics that we've told you here in determining whether it's the master cylinder, the slave cylinder, the pressure plate, the clutch, or the transmission.

You say that you don't get the best feel from your clutch pedal when you depress it, that leads me to believe Master or Slave cylinders. Why they are bad? Don't know, can't tell you. Things now-a-days come with manufacturing defects. I know you spent money, and I know it sucks that you'll have to spend more money to fix this problem.

You've bled the system a couple times, and you still don't have satisfactory results from it. I'm still going to lean towards one of the 2 cylinders. Otherwise, I'd pull the transmission, make sure that the clutch is properly installed, reinstall, and since it has the quick disconnect fittings, you shouldn't have to re-bleed the system.

That's the best advice I have left to offer. Until you run additional tests to see what's goin on, I'm out of ideas.
 






I didn't know you were supposed to lube the input shaft on the trans... What's the purpose of that? I've got the master cylinder + line out right now, going to try to bleed it and install it one more time, if no go, trans is getting dropped.
 






help with bleeding slave

I hope I am not making a fool of myself, by not reading the whole thread, if this has already been mentioned, I apologize ! Something that has helped me in the past, is to take the cap off of the reservoir, use a oil can and a tight fitting hose, attach it to the oil can, and the slave cyl, and then push the fluid through the lines. This pushes the air up and out of the res. put the cap back on it , so that when you disconnect the hose, it creates a sealing affect, so that you do not lose a bunch of fluid, and suck more air in. Save a big mess as well ! Good luck !
 






I did bleed as you suggested with a mityvac, and it did not work. I have since pulled the trans again and the slave looked like it was leaking very slightly. it was FTE brand. That is the same brand they had at my local Autozone with a lifetime warranty. Then I went over to Advance Auto. For 50 dollars they had a Perfection Slave cylinder, same brand as the master, and same company that made the youtube video. I was impressed by the master when I bought it, and their slave is just as good. It has a heavy rubber boot and is made of all metal instead of plastic. They also changed the quick connect system. It looks like it's a lot easier to work with. Here are some pictures. I have a feeling this one will be just as good as a Motorcraft slave for 120$.

th_IMG_20110830_184454.jpg


th_IMG_20110830_184433.jpg


th_IMG_20110830_184417.jpg
 



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Ok, I put the new slave in and it work...ed great. I could shift into 1 and 2 and with slight grinding shift into 3 and 4. Put in the transfer and shafts, gravity bled 3 reservoirs through it, start it, cannot shift at all. The slave is moving about an inch, maybe 1 1/4 inches. What else could be wrong? Could the pressure plate possibly being loose cause this?
 






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