Throttle body actuator position

[deadice]

I have an 04 Explorer, 4.0 v6 4wd. I had a code popup on my scanner a while ago for P2072 Throttle body ice blockage, this was during some cold days in Canada. It usually comes on every other start, but usually the first one in the day (cold engine).

I have cleaned the throttle body with throttle body cleaner, tried to scrape some of the black gunk off with a toothbrush, even tried swapping air filters to see if my K+N was giving me any problems.

With the engine off, the throttle butterfly sits offset by a few degrees, enough so that it does it sit entirely vertical. Could this be why the code is being thrown and why my city gas mileage is through the roof?

I am looking at a replacement throttle body and cheapest is $200 shipped.

Is this a good route to go down on, or should I consider cheaper options first like the Throttle position sensor?

 

[sethmorgan]

I think it's supposed to be open a little bit at idle. IIRC, there is an adjustable stop that determines how open it is at idle. If it was closed completely, I would think the engine would die (no air). Of course I could be completely wrong.

 

[deadice]

Makes sense.I'm stuck then. I don't want to spend hundreds on parts just guessing what the problem is, maybe I'll try the TPS sensor as it's only $30 at rockauto, then go on from there.

The only thing I did to my vehicle around that time frame was clean my K+N filter, but I have put a new Fram filter in to test that theory and I am getting the same result.

Could it be defective MAF sensor?

I lost my obd scanner, waiting for a new one to come in so I can't scan any PID's while I'm driving...

 

[sethmorgan]

The only thing I did to my vehicle around that time frame was clean my K+N filter, but I have put a new Fram filter in to test that theory and I am getting the same result.

Could it be defective MAF sensor?

If it has a freshly-oiled K&N filter, I would clean the MAF with MAF cleaner to remove any residual oil from the wire element.

 

[imp]

I think it's supposed to be open a little bit at idle. IIRC, there is an adjustable stop that determines how open it is at idle. If it was closed completely, I would think the engine would die (no air). Of course I could be completely wrong.

I suspect, unfortunately, that you are. "How open it is at idle" is determined by the computer (PCM). There is no longer any "throttle stop" to determine idle speed. Only reason for a "stop" on there is to prevent the blade from binding closed and being unable to open (I think).

The idle "position" of the throttle blade varies as load on the engine varies: A/C on and off, lights, turn signals, etc. The PCM automatically adjusts the throttle position, at idle, to maintain idle speed constant.

Right swetrid? imp

 

[sethmorgan]

I suspect, unfortunately, that you are. "How open it is at idle" is determined by the computer (PCM). There is no longer any "throttle stop" to determine idle speed. Only reason for a "stop" on there is to prevent the blade from binding closed and being unable to open (I think).

The idle "position" of the throttle blade varies as load on the engine varies: A/C on and off, lights, turn signals, etc. The PCM automatically adjusts the throttle position, at idle, to maintain idle speed constant.

Right swetrid? imp

imp, Ok I guess I was getting my scenarios confused. His first observation was that the butterfly is open a few degrees with the engine off. I'm pretty sure that's determined by the stop. I have no idea if that's adjustable or not. You are absolutely right about the PCM controlling the idle. Of course! I always appreciate a good correcting. Thanks for making clear the distinction.

And of course the butterfly position with engine off has nothing to do with idle...

 

[deadice]

I'll be cleaning the MAF sensor tomorrow morning with electrical contact cleaner, we'll see how that goes.

 

[deadice]

No dice. How complicated is it to remove the Throttle Body? is it just the 4 bolts holding it on? Can they be threaded back on after removal, or do I need new bolts/gasket?

 

[terp]

No dice. How complicated is it to remove the Throttle Body? is it just the 4 bolts holding it on? Can they be threaded back on after removal, or do I need new bolts/gasket?

I'm guessing most will say to replace the gasket, but what about the bolts? I, too, need to replace mine.

I'm nervous there might be something else wrong that casued the TB to go bad...like an electric surge or something.

My wife was driving and said the check engine light went on, then the power windows, radio, glove box, etc went out. I found a 30a fuse blown, a 15a fuse, and another fuse...replaced them all and still had the engine fail mode on and the wrench.

It would crank just fine, but seemed like not getting fuel...turn the key and rather than have a little buzzing sound like the fuel pump was going, it sounded a little strange...was thinking throttle body and scanner fired these codes:

p2112
p2104
p2100
p2107
p2110

So I am going to try the TB tomorrow...gasket and screws, guys?

 

[arjewell23]

A Fix!

I'm guessing most will say to replace the gasket, but what about the bolts? I, too, need to replace mine.

I'm nervous there might be something else wrong that casued the TB to go bad...like an electric surge or something.

My wife was driving and said the check engine light went on, then the power windows, radio, glove box, etc went out. I found a 30a fuse blown, a 15a fuse, and another fuse...replaced them all and still had the engine fail mode on and the wrench.

It would crank just fine, but seemed like not getting fuel...turn the key and rather than have a little buzzing sound like the fuel pump was going, it sounded a little strange...was thinking throttle body and scanner fired these codes:

p2112
p2104
p2100
p2107
p2110

So I am going to try the TB tomorrow...gasket and screws, guys?

Just a quick note. I had the exact same codes on my 07 explorer limited, v-8, 4.6 liter. Let me tell you all a little story. I had taken my throttle body off to put in a spacer. The company I got the spacer from sent me the wrong one. I put the throttle body back on and my car would start but no throttle and got the codes listed above. They are all related to the throttle body.

I had it towed to the closest ford dealership. They quoted me $880.00 for a new throttle body and plug. I told them no way in hell. They called 30 minutes later and said they made a mistake. It was only $509.00. I said nope, I have a tow truck on the way to take it to another mechanic.

Had it towed. My budd's friend fixed it in less than 1 hour. It's the connection from the throttle body motor to the plug. It became really loose and didn't make a connection. He fixed it for $40.00.

I had looked up this problem online for hours so I thought people might find this useful. You do not need to replace the throttle body. You can take the motor off and resolder the wires and you might need to replace the female plug that goes into the throttle body but that is it. My X runs awesome now!