Explorer Dyno Day in B'ham results w/bamachips..

[Doug904]

Hey guys,

We had a few guys show up and had some great results along with some great learning experiences. The biggest was from using larger TB's, headers, and MAF's but that will come on down the post.

First the constant vehicle to begin from was Aldive's truck, Al, 99' Explorer with a Mac CAI, cat-back exhaust(manufactorer?), and blue Micro Tuner. We had planned on simply using a chip to make changes to and pluging and unplugging it but his port was disabled, like 90% of the Explorer/Ranger crowd. So we had to use a X-calibrator to make the changes each time and that kinda restricted us on how many changes we could make because each time we had to reflash the PCM along with making changes. This would make for about 10 minutes between runs and when you're paying $85 an hour sitting there doesn't make for time well spent.

We started with a stock run....181rwhp and 203 rwtq

Base 99' Exp w/CAI and Exhaust

Next we tried my 89 Performance mail order program...189rwhp and 216rwtq

89 Performance

Next we tried my 93 Performance Mail order program...193rwhp and 217rwtq

93 Performance Mail order

Then a few adjustments to the tuning....196rwhp and 218rwtq

93 Performance Tuned...

Now that was it for my programming files so then we started tuning for the Pro-M ( Thanks Monmox-Kevin!). BOY was that a great day! We left my adjusted 93 Peformance program installed so we wouldn't have to reflash the PCM. The first run with the Pro-M SUCKED!! The A/F went so lean that the dyno guy shut down the run...

Pro-M base line shut down

Next I went in and made some adjustments to help get it down to a safe range and also correct the idle as it was staying in Open loop even at idle because the transfer function was so far off, that's why the CEL would come on for you guys with the Pro-M's.

Pro-M adjusted 1st run 193rwhp and 217 rwtq

Since I had gotten the a/f down to a safe range I leaned it out a bit and did our final run...197rwhp and 220 rwtq...

Pro-M Final run....

With all the tuning and such we were only able to make 1rwhp increase and 3rwtq. There again that could be the difference between two runs ran back to back so for $200-$300 everyone is paying for these your not making your money back and if your vehicle is staying in Open loop like the this one your killing your fuel milage and probably running very rich at idle destroying your 02's and lean up top burning up your spark plugs or even worse. Ive also got a comparison to a C&L meter but that comes on down the post...


So, now we got everything close as can be we decided to return the vehicle to the 89 performance file, and see what changes the 73 C&L meter was making. To our great surprise it ran a PERFECT 13:1 a/f ratio and even made 8-10 rwhp more with the 89 performance program! It was making the same performance numbers using 89 that we were seeing using the 93 tuning.

First C&L run....

I know I know, kick me in the tail but we didn't run it using the 93 Performance program. We were at nearly 3 hours on the dyno and the money aspect was starting to cloud my other thinking.

I did make a run using the C&L and the TORNADO!!! We didn't make sqaut!

Tornado using C&L

Here are the last two runs over each other...

C&L Vs. C&L w/Tornado..


Finally, here are two runs using the 93 Performance program with the Pro-M tuned program and using the 89 Performance program using the C&L meter..

C&L 89 perf VS. Pro-M 93 perf. and tuned...



Now, that was with Aldive's Explorer. We had a second Explorer show up as well, a 98 SOHC Sport w/ auto. He is in prepairing to install a STS turbo on his Explorer but wanted some baseline numbers with what he has now. His mod list includes...

JBA headers, 76mm C&L, 70mm TB, and 3" exhaust. Sounds like it should do very well huh?

With his first run we had to do some major tuning work. Luckily his PCM's port wasn't disabled so we were able to use the chip for doing the programming on and not have to reprogram the PCM each time.

I'm not going into detail as much as we did with Al's but here is his run with the 76mm MAF...

76mm C&L tuned....

Next, we wanted to see whta affect the 73mm C&L would have on his HP and also the base programming. Funny thing, we got the same amount of power from his Explorer with the 73 then we did with the 76...

73mm C&L...

Now don't go by the torque number at the top of that run, on a automatic truck sometimes the converter will slip or flash on quick stabs of the throttle like on a dyno and cause a spike in the numbers. The next graph I show with the two comparisons will show that they are very close on the 73 and 76 on the torque numbers...

73 C&L vs 76 C&L


In short this shows that using all of these high flowing components will not aid in the performance of a n/a vehicle. Al actually made more HP then him with stock manifolds and a smaller exhaust system. Is this bad? No, it will work alot better when he has his turbo installed but for now it's a bit low. This also shows the difference between vehicles for one to another.

All in all I had a great time and I met alot of great people. AL took alot of photo's but won't be back in Florida for a few days so I'm sure he'll post a few when he gets home. I was running from truck to truck so that I didn't get a chance to do this, I was too busy swapping MAF's and reprogramming PCM's to do much of anything else. When I got home I went to bed and just have gotten up this morning.

I will be offering the C&L meters very soon as well so I'll keep everyone posted when I do. I've been working with them for a little bit now and said that I wasnt going to sell anything until I could find out how they did and most of all what kind of increases they gave. I will have them listed on my NEW website very soon...

Thanks! Doug.

 

[IAmTodd]

Awsome write-up. That should give us all direction to what we should do for more performance. Thank you both for your time

 

[MONMIX]

Well what can I say.
My PRO-M is paid for, I might as well keep it I guess.
I dunno.
*shrugs*

PM me or drop me an e-mail and tell me what you think my next step should be.

BTW what is a C&L meter ?

 

[spindlecone]

Doug
Great writup, pls explaine furthur about running open loop with the Pro-M, with my setup am only in open loop for a few seconds at startup cold, than it is always in closed loop mode, my A/F is 12.8
MONMIX
You wanna sell your Pro-M, get back to me

 

[Doug904]

Doug
Great writup, pls explaine furthur about running open loop with the Pro-M, with my setup am only in open loop for a few seconds at startup cold, than it is always in closed loop mode, my A/F is 12.8
MONMIX
You wanna sell your Pro-M, get back to me

Well, it's different with every calibration I'm sure, no two pro-m's are the same. We used Kevin's meter to establish a transfer function for the Pro-m's that should be dead on. Now that I have it I can write Kevin's file using the new function.

What was happening was the computer was having to adjust more then 30% at idle because of the Pro-M's different transfer function. I had to tweak the transfer function for the meter in the PCM's programming to get it to goto closed loop and stay there. If it were to do this all of the time it would set off a CEL. Now when the vehicle went to about 1500-3500 rpm's, of course below WOT, it started to get closer and it went to closed loop but then the actual A/F ratio was screwy lean so I had to adjust the values more in the PCM. I will tell you that I had to make adjustments of more then 30% in some range's and 15-20% in others just to get a safe a/f ratio.

C&L meter's have been out for a while, I'm not sure how long but I'll say that Vortech used to rebadge them as their meters. I know atleast 7-10 years.

Here's a link to their website...www.cnlperformance.com I have worked a deal with them to be their exclusive Truck meter dealer because they aren't familiar with the types of meters we need and really don't have the time to figure them all out. Since I have and I know I can call them up and tell them exactly what I need and they send it to me along with a filter. The great thing about the C&L is it uses the factory electronics, you remove your eletronics and swap them over to the C&L so the main part of the meter is set for your vehicle.

Like I said I hope to be able to offer this meter along with a new filter for less then that of a Pro-M alone. I'll be sure and keep everyone posted!

Thanks, Doug.

 

[Robb]

I was hoping for a TBS test?

 

[spindlecone]

I was hoping for a TBS test?

TBS is no big deal, I had one last week in the hospital I work at, they just poke your arm with a needle

 

[Doug904]

I was hoping for a TBS test?

Sorry, we didn't have time. I can tell you that the added space provided by the TB spacer means nothing.

Doug

 

[huskyfan23]

Very nice results. I thought Al's biggest reason for going was the TBS test I've got one and I can tell you it does jack schmidt on the OHV.

 

[MONMIX]

well cool,
Spidle, based on what Doug said I am gonna hang onto my Pro-M for time being.

If I ever do decide to get rid of it you will have first dibs.

 

[spindlecone]

well cool,
Spidle, based on what Doug said I am gonna hang onto my Pro-M for time being.

If I ever do decide to get rid of it you will have first dibs.

Keep me posted, you got a cash buyer, ,no joke

 

[MONMIX]

$1,000,000.00



I'll let ya know, but for now I am keeping it

 

[Robb]

Sorry, we didn't have time. I can tell you that the added space provided by the TB spacer means nothing.

Doug

That is what I believe also.............but Al swears to it giving a seat of the pants feeling.

Oh well, I guess the TBS debate will continue!

Nice write up Doug, and thank you for your contribution with these dynos!!!

 

[spindlecone]

$1,000,000.00



I'll let ya know, but for now I am keeping it

Is paypal okay? will need to transfer some funds from the swiss account

 

[Doug904]

Yes, the euro is the preferred payment currency, deposit it to the account # OU812...

 

[bmxking5]

Nice write up Doug, and thank you for your contribution with these dynos!!!

Ditto

 

[karl_burns]

Great write up. I've got a GMS MAF. Wonder if that makes a difference......
Looks like the tuner is 100% the way to go!
Karl

 

[gijoecam]

So, Doug, can you summarize a little bit? I think I'm seeing it.... Intake, Exhaust, and chip with the "new" burn for premium, you gained 15 Hp, and 15 lb*ft? Then, from what I understand, on a different vehicle, the larger throttle body showed minimal gains even after re-tuning for it?

So basically, I'd be looking at a 10% gain for a 98 sport SOHC, right?

Here's another question.... with either setup, are there any significant improvements in the shift quality? I'm not looking to snap my head back and bark the tires, but quite frankly, the stock programming sucks. What would you recommend to improve the transmission shifting in addition to any gains that may be received from the programming?

-Joe

 

[celly]

Doug, thanks for the early beta on your testing with Al. I'm sure we'll get his insight too. I'm glad the "TBS" issue is finally laid to rest, not that it really was in doubt anyhow. Some folks sure held on to the belief that he little piece of plastic made one iota of difference. Sure answers a lot of questions about aftermarket MAF units too. I'm glad I didn't drop the bucks a few months ago on a Pro-M, thanks mainly to your input of course!

Brad

 

[celly]

Here's another question.... with either setup, are there any significant improvements in the shift quality? I'm not looking to snap my head back and bark the tires, but quite frankly, the stock programming sucks. What would you recommend to improve the transmission shifting in addition to any gains that may be received from the programming?

-Joe

I can't really answer much re: HP improvements (I'll let Doug field that one), but I can tell you that the shifting under Doug's programming makes a HUGE difference. I have his Torque 91 program loaded in my Ex most of the time, and it makes a world of difference. Shiftpoints are smoothe as silk and my Ex definitely has a much more aggressive feel to it.