Change transmission but doesn't run in any gear.

dynoski · October 10, 2004

96 XLT 4.0 V6 4X4. Two days ago I bought a 96 Explorer with bad transmission. My friend and I changed the transmission this weekend with reman but after we done and started the truck, it doesn't move in any gear. The transmission doesn't engage in any gear. We checked all connection and all are okay. What we did wrong? Please help because we spent two days already fixing it. Please point us the right way so we can drive it.

I bought the XLT because of this forum. I read the procedure written one of your expert and it is not so bad. So I finally bought it from my neighbor for $1K and rely on this forum for all its problem. Hopefully I can fix it with your help and expertise.

Thanks,
Gerry

dynoski · October 10, 2004

BUMP!

Anybody who can help please. I'm disperate here. What can go wrong during instalation of a reman transmission? New installed transmission does not engage in any gear. I'm stump! Please help.

Glacier991 · October 10, 2004

Did you use the old Torque convertor? I'm a little lost myself... not sure what all you changed... wondering if you have any line pressure...

dynoski · October 10, 2004

Thank God Glacier991. I'm getting ready to direct this question to you and suddenly you're into it.

Well, we changed the whole transmission and we used the old TC. Is there any trick to install the TC? I just pushed the TC into the Trans and bolted the trans to the engine. If there's a trick to install a TC, I did not do it. So that might be the problem. Please enlighten me.

Thanks again.

Glacier991 · October 11, 2004

Well. let's think this one through.... things that will not let a trannie move in any gear. #1 .. low fluid. You ok with the fluid level? #2. Linkage failure. Everything move ok when you shift it? Lock the brakes, chock it and get someone under there to watch to make sure everything moves when you shift it... try this first with the engine off....# 3 No line pressure. Because of...pump failure, input shaft failure (stripped splines) gross transmission leak, no pump engagement at TC... hmmm I am sure others will have better ideas....(where is Opera House when you need him, an awesome diagnostician he)

Anyway.... the fact that you replaced the trannie and have the same symptoms says something... extraneous to the transmission... You added fluid... hmm linkage ok?

Before I went thru the effort to remove it... I'd check the obvious and then go buy a transmission pressure gauge.... and see if you have line pressure (see my post on using a Transmission Pressure Gauge)... something screams no pressure or no linkage...( I think even the 4R series did 1st and R off the shifter.... let's check those things first, ok ? - I mean the computer is important but this is outside a bad puter methinks)

Blee1099 · October 11, 2004

When installing the torque converter, rotate the torque converter in either direction to help ease installation.. More than likely its not seated properly.

Glacier991 · October 11, 2004

Blee has a point.... the TC will usually drop down twice.... an initial klunk and then a final one.... in part 4 of the Diary I show how to check to make sure it is seated... however, a TC that is not seated will make for a hard bolt in... you can do it, but you can end up with a busted flex plate as a consequence... usually in a nice circular pattern around the bolt holes. (been there done that seen it).

I'm still with my initial advice... linkage then line pressure (which will test pump gear/TC engagement as well....) Blee has a good point though. Thanks Blee for weighing in. Others have ideas ?

dynoski · October 11, 2004

Wheeww! Thank you Glacier991 and Blee for your unselfish help. We checked fluid level - OK, linkage moved to all gear position, all electrical connector were connected, no leaks. We did not check pressure because we don't have the pressure tool.

My plan is to removed the trans again and engage the TC properly so to cover all the bases. Before I do this, I have to read Glacier's diary on how to engage the TC. This is my first time to do trans in any vehicle. I'm DIY with no formal training, just reading manual, following directions and when something goes wrong ask the internet professionals like you guys.

glfredrick · October 11, 2004

I'd second what Glacier said...

It has to have a connection between the motor and tranny, which is the torque converter...

It has to have oil to pump, and a pump that is working correctly to pump it...

And, it needs correct linkage to tell the tranny that you want to engage a gear - which in the case of your transmission is both electronic and mechanical...

If any one of the three is bad, then it will not do anything.

Oh, and one other thing that they didn't mention - is the transfer case stuck in neutral by chance? Are you testing it with the tires on the ground?

Just so that you know, I rebuilt a 5R55E and it didn't move either - so I know that it is possible to have everything in there correctly and still not have it move. I never did find out what was really wrong, I just replaced the tranny with another one.

Brain · October 11, 2004

I'd have to agree that it sounds like the TC isn't engaged into the inner pump gear. For the 4R inner pump gear there is an o-ring that might make the TC feel like it has bottomed, but it hasn't. I've got pictures of the small pump gear w/ the o-ring in the Project Frankentranny thread. When you reassembled the pump, did you get the small pump gear facing the right direction?

First gear in the overdrive position has the fewest clutches and bands applied of all the gears, but reverse seems to work when others don't (typically). When you installed the valve body, did you get the rooster comb (with the shift indentations) connected to the main valve? It almost sounds like you are stuck in neutral.

Jefe · October 11, 2004

Does the trans fluid level change between engine off (and having sat for a while) and engine on? Or you could loosen a cooling line fitting and see if you're getting flow while on. Have you removed the pan on the new trans yet? If you do, check to make sure the filter is sitting right, and you could check shift linkage inside.

dynoski · October 11, 2004

Thanks to all of you. Well, all the above recomendations were checked except the pressure and everything went okay--no luck. We removed the trans again and reset the TC. We really spent a lot of time to make sure the TC is engaged. When we were satisfied that the TC was engaged, we bolted it back on. The trans went smoothly even the TC stud and Flexplate hole matched the first time we pushed in. We tighten everything and connected all electrical fittings. We replaced the fluid but about a pint leaked at the vent hole on top of the transmission---we thought we put too much fluid. When the leak stop we connected a longer vent tubing to it. Started it and shifted to all gears --NOTHING HAPPEN, TRANS DOESN'T ENGAGED.

Weve been working on this for 3 days and I'm so frustrated right now. I'm at the brink of calling it quits and absorb the loss and cry in the corner later.

Two questions: Do you fill tranny fluid inside the TC before you instal it and is that makes any difference?

If I can't fix it through all your help, I plan get another replacement transmission and try again. And if still doesn't work I don't know what to do.

Glacier991 · October 11, 2004

Hang in there, this board will pull together and support you as best we can... I think at this point you need to go to a NAPA dealer or somepace that carries KD tools... and invest the $75 or so in a transmission pressure gauge. We need to know if you have ANY control (line) pressures at all... Don't yank it again.... buy beg borrow or steal that gauge and hook it up, directions are on my thread about Transmission Pressure gauges. Believe me me feel your pain... we want to help...let's narrow it down...we an do this.... and in the end your reman may be bad... but lets work it thru... (handing you the crying towel).

TO everyone else... let's try extra hard to get him thru this!!!

Brain · October 11, 2004

Did you pre-fill the TC? Did you let it run a little while in neutral so that the pump could self-prime? Gearator pumps (like in this trans) don't move air very well, and I'd keep it out of any gear so that you don't burn up any clutch packs when fluid does start to flow. How long did you let it run in gear before you shut it off? If you only started it, shifted immediately through the gears and then shut it off, it might not have had time to self-prime the pump. Not prefilling the TC just means you should wait that much longer before you shift into any gear, because it needs fluid in it to transmit torque to the gears. I'd start it again in park, let it idle for the better part of 15-20 minutes, and then try the shifter again.

dynoski · October 11, 2004

Glacier991,

Thank you for your support. I needed it very badly. Talk to you when your phone is not busy. I might invest on the pressure gauge.

Brain,
Thank you. No, I did not prefill the TC. No I did not run a little while in neutral--probably less than 5 minutes. After we filled it with fluid I started and immediately I shifted and there's no engagement of the trans. I turn it off and tried it again--nothing happen. By then its already getting dark and we quit.

I will try your suggestion tomorrow and let see what happen. BTW, the truck was still in incline position (front tires were sitting on a ramp- probably 8 inches high and rear tires on the ground) when I tested it. Tomorrow I will try to let it idle for 20 mins and take it off from the ramp. I will let you know what happen.

The only good thing happen during this task was I'm now proficient in unbolting (removal) and rebolting (install) transmission on a 96 XLT. Probably next time, I will know how to rebolt a trans and make it work.

Brain · October 11, 2004

Yes, then without any fluid in the TC there will be no torque to the tranny, as it is a fluid coupling, and air doesn't work as the fluid doing the coupling. Once the TC fills with fluid, then you can actually get torque through the transmission. Sleep peacfully, because I really think that this is the problem, and that isn't really a problem that you have to do any more work to fix.

BTW, if it is up high on ramps with a serious incline, the vent on top might spill some fluid out, but while it is idleing and filling the TC, you might need to top it off a little. Don't trust the dipstick until you are level, because it goes into the front of the pan.

dynoski · October 12, 2004

Glacier991 & Brain,

Thank you again for your commitment. I followed your suggestions- I moved the truck off the ramp which now sitting in a flat surface. I started it and let it idle for 25 minutes then I shifted to all gears but no trans engagement. One minute while I'm shifting the O/D off light started blinking. Tried to turn it on via the switch at the end of the shifter but can't turn it off. Fluid is between the two dimple on the dipstick. Rechecked everything again and all are okay.

Is there any electrical signal that tells the trans to engaged? I will disconect the trans cooling to check if fluid is circulating and to check for pressure.

Glacier, Nice talking to you last night and I appreciate it very much for your unselfish devotion to share your expertise and willingness to help people whom you don't even know. I salute you.

Please continue to share your knowledge to make it run and I will do my best whatever you two might think what's wrong with it.

Brain · October 12, 2004

A-where the solenoids and input sensor hook up
B-where the shift selector hook up
C-where the output speed sensor hook up

These are the electrical signals that have to get from the computer to the tranny. The 4R55E is electronically controlled, so if any of these connections are not made, it won't engage. I'd unplug and replug each one of them to make sure you have good connections.

I could've sworn that the empty TC was the problem...

Glacier991 · October 12, 2004

This IS a puzzler. Tell me a little about this "remanufactured" transmission.... I am also very curious to know if we are even generating line pressures.

dynoski · October 12, 2004

Well, to make story short, original tranny does not move on reverse only moved on drive gears. So, we removed the no reverse trans and installed a reman bought from advance auto parts store. When I removed the pan of the original no reverse trans there's some small metal shaving in the magnet.

Those electrical connectors have been checked many times including the connector to the transfer case. They are tight and click locked.

I will check if theres a pressure as soon as I can. My free time is limited. I'm in the military, station here in Washington, DC and my duty hours are 7AM to 5PM. By the time I got home, I only have few minutes to work on it before its dark.

You guys are keeping my hope above water. I appreciate it very much. Without you, by now i've been crying in the corner.

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